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  1. #241
    MXAAGVNIEETRO IS RIGHT MyriVerse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackClaw View Post
    Itís super unfortunate that this character has been hijacked by hate groups and dirty cops. I wouldnít want Frank gone entirely but there are a couple of options Marvel can do. The first is to simply keep him around but relegate him to guest appearances only. The second is to simply retire his logo.

    But I think the boldest option is to keep him around but do a story where Frank specifically goes after hate groups like the Proud Boys and the alt right. That Marvel can tell the world that the Punisher is here to stay and he has absolute ZERO tolerance for these scumbags and that they are not on the same side in any shape or form. Itíll be controversial to the groups I mentioned and those who sympathize with them. But with Trump getting banned from almost every major platform online and Parler getting dropped by both google and Apple, I think itís safe to say that people are caring less and less about what these people think.
    Yes to this! I might actually buy a Punisher series (1st since the 90s) if this became his new MO.
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  2. #242

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    the extra skater
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  3. #243

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    https://www.wmcactionnews5.com/2021/...e-zip-tie-guy/

    "According to the filling, Agents discovered items that helped identify Munchel from video and photographs of the riot - including a vest with the Punisher symbol and Tennessee’s state with a thin blue line."

  4. #244
    Astonishing Member Raye's Avatar
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    My stance is that retiring the Punisher, or his skull symbol, in response to how it has been mis-approriated by certain groups would be letting them win, and I don't think we should give them that. Removing Frank from the books, or changing his costume to remove his symbol does not remove that symbol from these groups hands, it still means to them what it always has, only if Marvel stops using it, they don't have a counter point saying otherwise, Marvel has in effect handed them the symbol to assign whatever beliefs they want to it. So I think Marvel just has to aggressively pursue legal action against unlicensed use of the symbol, (which they have been doing, to be fair, but it's like whack-a-mole) and counter it with stories that make it clear they do not support the meaning these people have assigned to the skull emblem. Which, again they have done, but it was a fairly short scene, just a few pages long, and comics do not have enough reach for these people to really get the message, so I'd like to see a longer story that could be collected into a TPB where that is the whole point of the story, and maybe if it is possible to revive the Punisher TV series, or make a movie, that may have more effect. On the fan side of things, maybe some Youtubers or something could also help spread awareness that the Punisher symbol being used in that way goes against everything the character represents, and what his creators intended.

    I know it feels like these efforts don't have any effect, but I am not ready to admit defeat and effectively hand these asshats the symbol.
    Last edited by Raye; 01-21-2021 at 06:34 PM.

  5. #245

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    Quote Originally Posted by Raye View Post
    My stance is that retiring the Punisher, or his skull symbol, in response to how it has been mis-approriated by certain groups would be letting them win, and I don't think we should give them that. Removing Frank from the books, or changing his costume to remove his symbol does not remove that symbol from these groups hands, it still means to them what it always has, only if Marvel stops using it, they don't have a counter point saying otherwise, Marvel has in effect handed them the symbol to assign whatever beliefs they want to it. So I think Marvel just has to aggressively pursue legal action against unlicensed use of the symbol, (which they have been doing, to be fair, but it's like whack-a-mole) and counter it with stories that make it clear they do not support the meaning these people have assigned to the skull emblem. Which, again they have done, but it was a fairly short scene, just a few pages long, and comics do not have enough reach for these people to really get the message, so I'd like to see a longer story that could be collected into a TPB where that is the whole point of the story, and maybe if it is possible to revive the Punisher TV series, or make a movie, that may have more effect. On the fan side of things, maybe some Youtubers or something could also help spread awareness that the Punisher symbol being used in that way goes against everything the character represents, and what his creators intended.

    I know it feels like these efforts don't have any effect, but I am not ready to admit defeat and effectively hand these asshats the symbol.
    I never saw from this point I think is a good one, because even if Marvel retire or change the character, the old Frank with black skull still exists in history and probably they will keep him as a symbol, so...
    the extra skater
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  6. #246
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    They should shelf Frank for a few years and bring Lynn Michaels back and make a film about her. I think these guys from the far right are misogynists so I doubt they'd wear the Punisher's symbol if they knew the Punisher is a woman.

  7. #247
    Extraordinary Member TheCape's Avatar
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    They aren't doing anything with Frank since like 2019, so keep doing that i guest?. Not that it matters much thought, i frankly don't think that Frank needs to be altered because of what some people in real life does with his symbol, especially when Frank whole stick isn't even related to whatever they preach.
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  8. #248

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    Retiring his symbol is the only way out, I guess.

  9. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raye View Post
    My stance is that retiring the Punisher, or his skull symbol, in response to how it has been mis-approriated by certain groups would be letting them win, and I don't think we should give them that. Removing Frank from the books, or changing his costume to remove his symbol does not remove that symbol from these groups hands, it still means to them what it always has, only if Marvel stops using it, they don't have a counter point saying otherwise, Marvel has in effect handed them the symbol to assign whatever beliefs they want to it. So I think Marvel just has to aggressively pursue legal action against unlicensed use of the symbol, (which they have been doing, to be fair, but it's like whack-a-mole) and counter it with stories that make it clear they do not support the meaning these people have assigned to the skull emblem. Which, again they have done, but it was a fairly short scene, just a few pages long, and comics do not have enough reach for these people to really get the message, so I'd like to see a longer story that could be collected into a TPB where that is the whole point of the story, and maybe if it is possible to revive the Punisher TV series, or make a movie, that may have more effect. On the fan side of things, maybe some Youtubers or something could also help spread awareness that the Punisher symbol being used in that way goes against everything the character represents, and what his creators intended.

    I know it feels like these efforts don't have any effect, but I am not ready to admit defeat and effectively hand these asshats the symbol.
    Considering how you basically described how the Nazis stole the swastika, I have to agree with you on this.

  10. #250
    Astonishing Member K7P5V's Avatar
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    One thing's for sure, the majority would still consider supernatural/angelic Punisher a bad idea...


  11. #251
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    To be perfectly honest, I've never liked Punisher nor seen his appeal. The only "Punisher story" I've enjoyed is the series Cosmic Ghost Rider Destroys Marvel History especially the part with Baby Thanos. One of the best aspects of the series, IMO, is how it shows that Punisher's violent methods when implemented on a grand scale generally make things worse, not better.

  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celgress View Post
    To be perfectly honest, I've never liked Punisher nor seen his appeal. The only "Punisher story" I've enjoyed is the series Cosmic Ghost Rider Destroys Marvel History especially the part with Baby Thanos. One of the best aspects of the series, IMO, is how it shows that Punisher's violent methods when implemented on a grand scale generally make things worse, not better.
    I think it's refreshing in a universe where villains get zero comeuppance... that we have a character that actually tries to fix the problems permanently. At least he killed the Mandarin (for now). Would be more impressed if he killed the Kingpin or Norman Osborn.

    I get exhausted with villains like Bullseye doing awful things, getting arrested, escape... rinse, repeat.

    Just read a Daredevil story where he gets the Kingpin out of jail... you read stories like that and think... what's the point?

  13. #253
    Astonishing Member batnbreakfast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by evolutionaryFan View Post
    I think it's refreshing in a universe where villains get zero comeuppance... that we have a character that actually tries to fix the problems permanently. At least he killed the Mandarin (for now). Would be more impressed if he killed the Kingpin or Norman Osborn.

    I get exhausted with villains like Bullseye doing awful things, getting arrested, escape... rinse, repeat.

    Just read a Daredevil story where he gets the Kingpin out of jail... you read stories like that and think... what's the point?
    That's like Marvels 3 best characters. How about not killing them?

  14. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by batnbreakfast View Post
    That's like Marvels 3 best characters. How about not killing them?
    So you like the rinse, repeat process ad infinitum? Personally I don't see the point of doing the same thing with these characters over and over. But I'm just one customer.

  15. #255
    Latverian ambassador Iron Maiden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by evolutionaryFan View Post
    So you like the rinse, repeat process ad infinitum? Personally I don't see the point of doing the same thing with these characters over and over. But I'm just one customer.
    At least Marvel isn't real dependent on the Punisher and he could be on hiatus for a while. DC's bread and butter on the other hand is the Batman/Joker cycle.

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