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  1. #1
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    Post Does DC hates the 90's?

    Wally didn't exist in the New 52 until majority of the fans basically demanded to bring him back.
    Kyle Rayner got depowered and now rarely shows up.
    Tim Drake got sidelined as a background character in most Batbooks.
    Dick Grayson was basically dead for 2 years worth of books in favor of Ric.
    Bart and Connor didn't exist in the New 52 until the bendis's Young Justice. Before that, they were replaced by the wannable Bar-torr and Kon-el.
    Roy Harper doesn't even have his Daughter anymore.... and he's dead
    Connor Hawke doesn't even exist anymore, still waiting for him to come back.

    Any suggestion why?

  2. #2
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    No, I don't think so.

    They're trying to acquire new customers.

    The '90s were 30 years ago, even if you were born in the late 90's to early 00's you've already aged out of the demographic that ATT wants to get.

    They want the generation that were born in the late 00's to early 10's and in that time DC has already changed a lot; just like how Kyle, Wally, and Tim are "my" Green Lantern, Flash, and Robin so to are Hal, Barry, and Damian (I think)? for this new generation.

    It's like telling me Kyle isn't the "real" Green Lantern it's this old dude with grey temples or Robin isn't Tim but some dork called Jason.

    In ten years from now they're gonna go after the New 52 generation and so on and so forth it goes on forever.
    Last edited by charliehustle415; 01-18-2021 at 11:15 PM.

  3. #3
    Fantastic Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Yes. They are doing everything in their power to prop up Hal, Barry. Wally and Kyle were a threat to that so they have to degrade them. Conner gets in the way of the new shiny toy that is Jon so he needs to be dealt with. Connor Hawke likely would become popular nowadays and they dont want Oliver to have kids so forget about him.

  4. #4
    Mighty Member jb681131's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAWtoyoto 432 View Post
    Wally didn't exist in the New 52 until majority of the fans basically demanded to bring him back.
    Kyle Rayner got depowered and now rarely shows up.
    Tim Drake got sidelined as a background character in most Batbooks.
    Dick Grayson was basically dead for 2 years worth of books in favor of Ric.
    Bart and Connor didn't exist in the New 52 until the bendis's Young Justice. Before that, they were replaced by the wannable Bar-torr and Kon-el.
    Roy Harper doesn't even have his Daughter anymore.... and he's dead
    Connor Hawke doesn't even exist anymore, still waiting for him to come back.

    Any suggestion why?
    You got it all wrong.
    New52 was a Reboot ! So they couldn't in so little time re-include every characters. That's all.

  5. #5
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    I don’t think they hate the 90’s, as much as I think they overlooked the successes and strengths of several different eras overall, with those 90’s examples feeling worse because they stumbled so badly with them even when they did try and use them, but not out of spite, but because things just worked out weird. The 00’s, for instance, should have proven you let Johnson do that Speed Force book idea he had, as well as offered ways to use those 90’s character as well, since all of them were slightly different but still successful in that era... and yet nothing of that style got done either.

    Clearly, they wanted to use a version of Kon-El/Conner, Bart, Tim, and Wally at different times. But Scott Lobdell sucks outside of his comfort zone, and the Flash book didn’t really carry on consistency in quality level after the first team of the New 52.

    And that’s not to say the premise of the New 52 precluded those characters either - if you’re skipping Jay to do Barry, want all four Earth-born Lanterns, have most of the Batfamily present, and are immediately doing alternate Earths as well... then there’s an arbitrary and changing standard for what you think the audience can and can’t understand.

    The mistakes they most missed was how much writing and intelligent editing mattered, as they wound up diving away good writers and having micro-managers tank good things left right and center by the time Didio was done. It’s just very obvious with those 90’s characters because they all excelled the most in healthy writing atmospheres.
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  6. #6
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    No, DC does not hate the 90s. DC does not hate any period it has published in, nor does DC hate any character it owns. Neither does Marvel or any other company. These type of questions are always ridiculous.

    Certain writers/artists/editors etc might like/dislike certain eras/characters but the company doesnt. The company only loves money, if your favourite era/character is not represnted well it's because the company doesnt think it will make them enough money to justify the effort.

  7. #7
    (Formerly ilash) Ilan Preskovsky's Avatar
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    Um, DC isn't a single identity with a single viewpoint. That said, Dan Didio clearly hated the '90s and had little time for legacy and replacement heroes so as executive editor (publisher, I know, but same difference in this case) he shaped the line. Most modern creators and, presumably, editors grew up on '90s DC so I would imagine that the pendulum is going to swing right back going forward.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAWtoyoto 432 View Post
    Wally didn't exist in the New 52 until majority of the fans basically demanded to bring him back.
    Kyle Rayner got depowered and now rarely shows up.
    Tim Drake got sidelined as a background character in most Batbooks.
    Dick Grayson was basically dead for 2 years worth of books in favor of Ric.
    Bart and Connor didn't exist in the New 52 until the bendis's Young Justice. Before that, they were replaced by the wannable Bar-torr and Kon-el.
    Roy Harper doesn't even have his Daughter anymore.... and he's dead
    Connor Hawke doesn't even exist anymore, still waiting for him to come back.

    Any suggestion why?
    It's a timing thing the generation that is in power now thinks of the 90's as that era they took on binge drinking so they don't care for it, it isn't their era. It is a time that things were changed from the way they always were. Ten years from now a generation will come to power that Wally was their Flash and Kyle was their GL and the only thing that will stop them from making that change is IF it appears the status quo makes consistently more $$$.

  9. #9
    Mighty Member Timothy Hunter's Avatar
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    There are the old guard at DC who have nostalgia for the Silver Age such as Dan DiDio and Geoff Johns and the newer faces who might have grown up on 90s comics but aren't as much advocates of the characters they grew up like Johns and DiDio were for Barry and Hal.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Timothy Hunter View Post
    There are the old guard at DC who have nostalgia for the Silver Age such as Dan DiDio and Geoff Johns and the newer faces who might have grown up on 90s comics but aren't as much advocates of the characters they grew up like Johns and DiDio were for Barry and Hal.
    That’s me. Wally and Kyle were my favorite ones back in the 90s, when I started reading.
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  11. #11
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    I don't know if they hate the Nineties characters ... but they LOVE the '90s Aesthetic. The irony of course being the DC thing from the 90s everyone talks about as a timeless legendary thing is Batman and Superman TAS, and they embraced the Neal Adams era of design (with appropriate dashes of Silver to Gold Age traditionalism).
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  12. #12
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    As others have said, Didio seems to have hated everything that came out of the 90s and worked to get rid of much of it, but that doesn't apply to the company as a whole.

    I really hope now that Didio's gone they finally bring back Linda Dnavers, but the sheer amount time that has passed since Didio blacklisted her makes it unlikely.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by K. Jones View Post
    I don't know if they hate the Nineties characters ... but they LOVE the '90s Aesthetic. The irony of course being the DC thing from the 90s everyone talks about as a timeless legendary thing is Batman and Superman TAS, and they embraced the Neal Adams era of design (with appropriate dashes of Silver to Gold Age traditionalism).
    Another irony is that, because of Rob Liefeld, Todd McFarlane and the breakthrough of Image Comics, many people hate 90s aesthetic and since that time. Jim Shooter and Alex Ross are two great examples of that.
    And ironically today Jim Lee, another flag-carrier of 90s aesthetic, is DC’s CCO.
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  14. #14
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    I have a theory about that, but it is supported by nothing so take something with a pinch of salt. Here it goes:

    -DC doesn't hate the 90's, but DC loves money.
    -Someone who was born at a point where they could become attached to the 90s, (i.e. 1985 - 1995) is somewhere between 35 and 25 years old.
    -That seems to be the generation economically suffering the most in the US at the moment.
    -Thus, DC shifts its attention to either older readers (hence the Silver Age lovefest) or younger readers -who are still supported by their parents (and as far as I know DC YA sales are not very good anyway)

    That's my take.

  15. #15
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    When DiDio was in charge, then we could say that there is a certain dislike for that period. Specifically now, the question is not about hatred, but about money. DC invest in things that make them more money, and ignore those characters that a lot fewer people buy. Unfortunately, Tim, Connor, Roy, Bart, Kyle and others fall into this category right now. We have an example of Bendis's Young Justice - they gave the book a chance, but sales were poor, and most likely it was a fatal blow to them. Considering how these characters have been treated all these years, it can be said that DiDio's fault here is very significant, because it greatly influenced this situation.

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