Is there bias or unintentional sexism in tom taylor's writing of WW?

[Agent Z]

tom taylor treats her as fodder for heavy hitters in dceased too. Did a videogame also "force" him to portray her like this in that comic too?

Well, maybe he just sucks at writing Wonder Woman.

I still wouldn't call him a sexist and fans of Cass Cain seem to like how he uses her.

Every writer has their blind spots and unfortunately for us WW fans, Diana is Taylor's.

[Immortal Weapon]

Are you sure? Who idea wasto show WW getting trashed by hercules in injustice while the likes of shazam and supes own him? Was that part ofthe videogame? And what about dceased where she isalso fodder for other heavy hitters? That is all him.

In the game Super easily kills Shazam with heat vision to head with no struggle whatsoever. The Injustice games work on a scale of "as the plot demands".

[WonderLight789]

In the game Super easily kills Shazam with heat vision to head with no struggle whatsoever. The Injustice games work on a scale of "as the plot demands".

And dceased? Who forced him to write WW as a weaklink that goes down against any heavy hitter in that comic?

[WonderLight789]

Well, maybe he just sucks at writing Wonder Woman.

I still wouldn't call him a sexist and fans of Cass Cain seem to like how he uses her.

Every writer has their blind spots and unfortunately for us WW fans, Diana is Taylor's.

Diana has more than just taylor. He is far from the only writer that writes WW as jobber. But i don't feel like doing a thread for every writer of the past years that have done this. I made this one because the man claims to know and love WW. So it was interesting to me how little knowledge and love his writing actually shows.

[Frontier]

For the record, I think that Diana vs Hercules fight was after Taylor stopped writing the original Injustice series.

[SiegePerilous02]

I don't think a writer not getting Wonder Woman is necessarily an indicator of them being sexist. Wonder Woman isn't representative of every female character, and every writer has some misses.

What I know of Taylor's work doesn't thrill me though. A lot of Jean Grey fans apparently love him for how he handles her, but a lot of those also hate Morrison's Jean and she's my favorite version, so I'd probably have the exact opposite opinion.

[Guy_McNichts]

I wouldn't accuse the guy of sexism because he's apparently written other female characters well elsewhere.

It's just Wonder Woman is not among them, despite his claim that he loves her. That just sounds like lip-service.

And a load of bollocks.

[Vordan]

Nah it’s not because he thinks female characters as a whole are inferior, it’s because Taylor is a guy who was raised on the DCAU, and the DCAU revolved entirely around Batman primarily and Superman secondarily. That’s the way Taylor writes his DC comics, with either Batman (Injustice) or Superman (DCeased) at the center and with everyone else as sidekicks.

For the record, I think that Diana vs Hercules fight was after Taylor stopped writing the original Injustice series.

Yep that was Brian Bucceleto. Also mystical you’ll be happy to know that while Hercules may have beaten WW (I don’t remember that but it’s been forever since I read Injustice and I have zero desire to reread it), Bucceleto also had Diana straight up destroy Superman in a fight

Hahahahahahaha those freaking faces man, my God this is unintentionally hilarious.

Taylor writes Diana as a massive jobber though.

People seem to like how he writes Black Canary and, even though I think she’s insufferable, Harley so no, it’s probably just what I’m a Fish said. From what I’ve read of him I don’t think he really has any grasp of her beyond “Warrior Goddess who thinks Superman is awesome”.

He was stuck with a pre-existing characterization of Diana with Injustice, so while he did a rather terrible job writing an evil Wonder Woman he can’t take all the blame there.

DCeased is all him though.

He’s a WonderBat shipper actually lol, he said he grew up on the DCAU, and he paired WW and Bats together in that dream world in Injustice, and then Cassie and Damian together in DC2 (which I found idiotic but whatever, it’s his Elseworld).

Yeah DCeased is his baby and he had that Injustice stardom to do what he wanted. Diana basically does zero in DCeased, Superman is the main protagonist and is the one who is basically organizing everything. Hell “Green Canary” is more proactive and better characterized than Diana is imo. I was willing to give Taylor a chance after he killed off Batman, was shocked he did that and it made me actually stick around because he had subverted the boring stereotypical story anyone else would’ve done of Batman being the one to lead humanity against the zombie heroes (no doubt because he already done that basic story in Injustice).

But then in what should’ve been Diana’s big moment, taking care of zombie Superman, she just jobs pathetically and achieves nothing except getting herself infected. And then in DCeased 2, Cassie is literally nothing except Damian’s girlfriend, she does not contribute to the conclusion in any meaningful way. Taylor clearly loves the Super Sons, just like he loves their fathers, but his love of WW and her mythos is shallow at best. He didn’t even have Cassie confront Diana ffs, what the hell? And then she jobs to Green Canary and dies in issue 1 iirc.

[Tom Kalbfus]

I have read both injustice and Dceased. And in those. WW is either a trophy for batman or superman. A murder or a weaklink. And sometimes all at once. For example. In her fight with hercules in injustice. He had herc easily overpowering WW. Even though both are demi Gods. Yet shazam beat herc And Superman killed him. shazam says he has the power of multiple Gods while beating hercules. Yet Diana also has powers from mutiple Gods and is a child of zeus like herc. So how come the power level difference is so big? Then in Dceased. She is killed in one hit by superman. Mary Marvel only needed a few months of training and boom, goodby WW. And once again, tom taylor talked about how mary has powers from multiple Gods. While forgeting Diana has them too. In taylor's hands. WW is always portrayed as a weaklink next to men. Or next to women based on already existing male characters such as mary marvel, batwoman etc. So is there bias or sexism here? Or is he just that clueless about where WW is supposed to rank in power?

I don't know why they gotta vilify Hercules, he's supposed to be a Greek hero! Usually in the Greek pantheon the make deities of the same rank are usually stronger than the females, and Hercules is of the same rank as Wonder Woman as they are both demigods. I sure Aphrodite won't beat Ares in a wrestling match either, unless Ares wants her to!

By the way where does Aphrodite fit in the Wonder Woman Universe, is she friend or foe? According to Greek legend she has a love relationship with Ares who is not on the best of terms with Wonder Woman.

[WonderLight789]

I don't know why they gotta vilify Hercules, he's supposed to be a Greek hero! Usually in the Greek pantheon the make deities of the same rank are usually stronger than the females, and Hercules is of the same rank as Wonder Woman as they are both demigods. I sure Aphrodite won't beat Ares in a wrestling match either, unless Ares wants her to!

By the way where does Aphrodite fit in the Wonder Woman Universe, is she friend or foe? According to Greek legend she has a love relationship with Ares who is not on the best of terms with Wonder Woman.

That is pretty bias to me.

[Tzigone]

That is pretty bias to me.

Well, if they have the same amount of magic, and more muscle, it makes logical sense for males to to be stronger than females (which is similar to the reason Superman should be stronger than Supergirl to me, since Kryptonians have the same degree of sexual dimorphism as humans). Unless we aren't talking physical strength.

[Alpha]

Why would bio engineered or magically gifted races follow the rules of human testosterone?

[I'm a Fish]

Well, if they have the same amount of magic, and more muscle, it makes logical sense for males to to be stronger than females (which is similar to the reason Superman should be stronger than Supergirl to me, since Kryptonians have the same degree of sexual dimorphism as humans). Unless we aren't talking physical strength.

I mean, they're gods. They shapeshift all the time. They can look however they want to look. I don't think real world muscle mass applies here.
Because if it did, Wonder Woman is leaner than Steve and no one is gonna argue that Steve is stronger than Diana. So yeah, can't really use real biology and sexual dimorphism in this argument. They be magic.

[Gaius]

He’s a WonderBat shipper actually lol, he said he grew up on the DCAU, and he paired WW and Bats together in that dream world in Injustice, and then Cassie and Damian together in DC2 (which I found idiotic but whatever, it’s his Elseworld).
.

Yeah, I’ve seen Taylor and his defenders cite that as he can write “the true Wonder Woman” but my reaction to that is “the true Wonder Woman isn’t arm candy for Bruce the douche. Try again, mate.”

Yeah DCeased is his baby and he had that Injustice stardom to do what he wanted. Diana basically does zero in DCeased, Superman is the main protagonist and is the one who is basically organizing everything. Hell “Green Canary” is more proactive and better characterized than Diana is imo. I was willing to give Taylor a chance after he killed off Batman, was shocked he did that and it made me actually stick around because he had subverted the boring stereotypical story anyone else would’ve done of Batman being the one to lead humanity against the zombie heroes (no doubt because he already done that basic story in Injustice).

But then in what should’ve been Diana’s big moment, taking care of zombie Superman, she just jobs pathetically and achieves nothing except getting herself infected. And then in DCeased 2, Cassie is literally nothing except Damian’s girlfriend, she does not contribute to the conclusion in any meaningful way. Taylor clearly loves the Super Sons, just like he loves their fathers, but his love of WW and her mythos is shallow at best. He didn’t even have Cassie confront Diana ffs, what the hell? And then she jobs to Green Canary and dies in issue 1 iirc.

Yeah; I’ve seen some say his Wonder Woman in DCeased was also evidence he can write a good Diana but the main things she did that series was get morally lectured to by Superman on the sanctity of not killing (again), talk about how awesome Superman is (again), and then get jobbed to Superman, Mary Marvel, and Black Canary.

[Tom Kalbfus]

Why would bio engineered or magically gifted races follow the rules of human testosterone?

Since they look exactly like humans, one might assume they are human to some degree, rather than the result of parallel evolution. Since there is a multiverse of parallel Earths, the most reasonable explanation for Krypton is that Kryptonians are humans from a parallel Universe, this is more likely that the explanation that they are the result of parallel evolution. Same goes for gods and goddesses that look human, on some level they are human. Of course this is fiction, but that would be the most believable explanation to the reader.