What's Your Headcanon For Why Batman Turned Into A Jerk In The '00s?

[Agent Z]

Lol he's a low tier superpowered man, I repeat Thanos wrecked Hulk and Thor earlier. Are you telling me Cap is anywhere close to those 2 in terms of strength? He looked like he was straining to me, he was reaching towards Cap, Cap was putting up a resistance and Thanos furrowed his brow because he had to put effort into it. He shouldn't have to use any effort whatsoever to reach over and punch him, Cap's an ant to him that scene's up there with the most ridiculous Batgod moments. Btw you haven't acknowledged the other part where Thanos full on punches Cap who manages to survive.

Captain America has survived a blast from a Chitauri weapon, being flung into a bus and being buried under ice for nearly 70 years. He's managed to curl a helicopter and outrun moving vehicles. His is not a low tier superhuman. Look at that scene again. The thumbnail for the video I posted clearly shows that Steve has to put effort into blocking Thanos and he still loses the fight.

I get it you hate Batman, and want to bury your head in the sand when other characters do things you'll get angry at him doing but come on, there's no way you can seriously defend that Infinity War scene. Why would Thanos have to strain and struggle for a mildly superhuman guy when he didn't AT ALL for a God of Thunder and giant rage monster with near limitless strength.

Tell me, have I accused you at any point of hating all characters that aren't Batman? No? Then why would you assume that the only reason I'm criticizing Batman is because I hate him? You repeating that Thanos was struggling and straining against Steve doesn't remotely make it true and this is not the first mistake you've made about other characters' performances when trying to call out some kind of double standard against Batman.

[The True Detective]

Captain America has survived a blast from a Chitauri weapon, being flung into a bus and being buried under ice for nearly 70 years. He's managed to curl a helicopter and outrun moving vehicles. His is not a low tier superhuman. Look at that scene again. The thumbnail for the video I posted clearly shows that Steve has to put effort into blocking Thanos and he still loses the fight.



Tell me, have I accused you at any point of hating all characters that aren't Batman? No? Then why would you assume that the only reason I'm criticizing Batman is because I hate him? You repeating that Thanos was struggling and straining against Steve doesn't remotely make it true and this is not the first mistake you've made about other characters' performances when trying to call out some kind of double standard against Batman.

So Cap is on the level of Hulk and Thor then? Ok, all superhumans are equal, forget that Bucky is able to fight evenly with Steve and is in no way a high tier character like Hulk or Thor are. Why does it matter if he didn't win? Batman didn't beat Darkseid when he dodged the OE but it's still used a Batgod example. Thanos without plot armor would kill Steve with a direct punch, there's no way around it.

Cap needed to team up with Bucky just to scrape by with a win against freaking Iron Man, now I'm supposed to buy all of a sudden he has the power to stop a guy all the other heroes have to dogpile on? No, it's garbage and it wouldn't get a pass if Batman did it. It'd get labeled Capwank if he was treated the same way Bruce is.

It's my opinion that you hate Batman because the vast majority of posts you make about him are negative. I've never seen you defend him in any situation, if there's an argument involving him you'll take the opposing view and argue against him. You like Wonder Woman, your posts about her aren't negative. So excuse me if I think you hate a character you do nothing but complain about.

[Rise]

Complaining about power feats in superhero comics is pointless. None of them ever makes sense and they always inconsistent. In one comic Batman can keep up with Darkseid, in other he is outwittd by Harley. They always happen as "plot demanded".

And The True Detective, there's a difference between criticism and bashing and some fans getting tired of Batman being written in certain way doesn't mean that they hate him. I do agree that it's getting old and some people who complain about Batman all the time can't handle it when someone talk negatively about their favourites. Batman isn't the only one who suffer from some issues and doesn't face consequences for his actions.

[The True Detective]

Complaining about power feats in superhero comics is pointless. None of them ever makes sense and they always inconsistent. In one comic Batman can keep up with Darkseid, in other he is outwittd by Harley. They always happen as "plot demanded".

And The True Detective, there's a difference between criticism and bashing and some fans getting tired of Batman being written in certain way doesn't mean that they hate him. I do agree that it's getting old and some people who complain about Batman all the time can't handle it when someone talk negatively about their favourites. Batman isn't the only one who suffer from some issues and doesn't face consequences for his actions.

I agree, complaining about feats in the grand scheme of things is just silly. And it maybe extreme to say any of these posters hate Batman but I do think they strongly dislike him and let that cloud their opinions sometimes. I don't think complaining about him is the lone sign someone hates him but if 90% of your (collective you) posts about him are always going on about how he sucks now then you at the very least aren't too fond of the current incarnation of him and the character just isn't for you anymore.

I think it's silly for anyone to act like every person who criticizes Batman is doing so for some valid reason or is even really a fan. A lot of the Batgod comments come from people who just flat out hate him, not talking about anyone in this thread, but they're out there. His popularity and notoriety rile people up like crazy. He doesn't have any more PIS feats than Cap, Black Widow, Green Arrow, etc he's just more popular and thus has a larger fan base to talk up his feats. So he gets bashed harder than other nonpowered heroes. Same reason Superman gets called OP much more than Martian Manhunter, Goku, One Punch Man and Thor.

[Rise]

I agree, complaining about feats in the grand scheme of things is just silly. And it maybe extreme to say any of these posters hate Batman but I do think they strongly dislike him and let that cloud their opinions sometimes. I don't think complaining about him is the lone sign someone hates him but if 90% of your (collective you) posts about him are always going on about how he sucks now then you at the very least aren't too fond of the current incarnation of him and the character just isn't for you anymore.

I think it's silly for anyone to act like every person who criticizes Batman is doing so for some valid reason or is even really a fan. A lot of the Batgod comments come from people who just flat out hate him, not talking about anyone in this thread, but they're out there. His popularity and notoriety rile people up like crazy. He doesn't have any more PIS feats than Cap, Black Widow, Green Arrow, etc he's just more popular and thus has a larger fan base to talk up his feats. So he gets bashed harder than other nonpowered heroes. Same reason Superman gets called OP much more than Martian Manhunter, Goku, One Punch Man and Thor.

Even if they hated him, they absolutely entitled to it and there's nothing wrong with it as long as they don't go overboard with it. I would understand more why you would be upest with it if someone is bashing Batman or insulting his fans, but no one is doing it here. People are simply discussing the topic of the thread while being respectful and not really attacking anyone, but simply showing frustration with how he has been handled and you can respectively disgree with them without accusing them or calling them "haters".

[godisawesome]

There was a time where I was down with the idea that Batman had realized he’d been messed with in Identity Crisis’s backstory sometime after Knightfall, and that had been the trigger for his paranoia going into overdrive towards everyone, including his family, reinforced by the sheer stress of everything that happened before Knightfall.

I’ve since soured on Identity Crisis itself considerably, but I think that the idea of someone Bruce trusted removing some memory of his could be repackaged and rewritten in some other media to good effect (think the Civil War movie of the MCU vs the Civil War comic storyline.)

It would be the extra element of betrayal that would be the key to making Bruce change, not the sheer trauma he’s gone through, though it would contribute. It would also line-up pretty nicely with how he went from being down with recruiting Tim and Azrael and putting Huntress on the Justice League (in spite of his weird hatred of her at the time) to running some crazy “evil future” scheme with Tim’s 17th birthday, the sudden relevance of his anti-JLA plans, Brother Eye, and even being set-off by Catwoman saying an unfortunate phrase in Hush.

I like the idea that Bruce suffered something that set off his paranoia, but I’d switch out Identity Crisis’s story for soemthing better.

[The True Detective]

Even if they hated him, they absolutely entitled to it and there's nothing wrong with it as long as they don't go overboard with it. I would understand more why you would be upest with it if someone is bashing Batman or insulting his fans, but no one is doing it here. People are simply discussing the topic of the thread while being respectful and not really attacking anyone, but simply showing frustration with how he has been handled and you can respectively disgree with them without accusing them or calling them "haters".

It's not like calling someone a hater is a slur or something and of course with all the nonstop negativity towards Bruce on the forum his fans will eventually snap and get sick of it. Not just this thread but any thread having to do with him is eventually turned into "this is why modern Bruce sucks" discussion 1,000,000. The thread simply asking how a relationship between him and Wonder Woman would go predictably had the usual suspects going on about how awful he is and that Wonder Woman would never be friends with him or tolerate him let alone date him.

It can't be that hard to just avoid threads about a character you don't like anymore, I don't like most of the Batfamily so I just steer clear of their threads, apparently it's too hard to do the same for Bruce. And even when he's written as the complete opposite of Batjerk or Batgod the threads don't have much discussion. Batman: Universe was not dark, grim, gritty Batgod so you'd think everyone sick of that characterization would flock to praise it or at least discuss it as a breath of fresh air. Well, you'd be wrong. Batman: Universe discussion was all but nonexistent here.

So it's just annoying that people enjoy discussing what's wrong with Bruce, but then when they're given what they claim to want they're silent and all of a sudden don't want to talk about him. I just want a little consistency.

[Agent Z]

It's not like calling someone a hater is a slur or something and of course with all the nonstop negativity towards Bruce on the forum his fans will eventually snap and get sick of it. Not just this thread but any thread having to do with him is eventually turned into "this is why modern Bruce sucks" discussion 1,000,000. The thread simply asking how a relationship between him and Wonder Woman would go predictably had the usual suspects going on about how awful he is and that Wonder Woman would never be friends with him or tolerate him let alone date him.

It can't be that hard to just avoid threads about a character you don't like anymore, I don't like most of the Batfamily so I just steer clear of their threads, apparently it's too hard to do the same for Bruce. And even when he's written as the complete opposite of Batjerk or Batgod the threads don't have much discussion. Batman: Universe was not dark, grim, gritty Batgod so you'd think everyone sick of that characterization would flock to praise it or at least discuss it as a breath of fresh air. Well, you'd be wrong. Batman: Universe discussion was all but nonexistent here.

So it's just annoying that people enjoy discussing what's wrong with Bruce, but then when they're given what they claim to want they're silent and all of a sudden don't want to talk about him. I just want a little consistency.

No one here hates Bruce. No one here has stated they hate Bruce or has said anything that could even be remotely intepreted as hating Bruce to anyone using common sense. You are inventing a victim narrative to complain about something that isn't even the actual topic of this thread.

And for all your finger wagging, I don't see you participating in much, if any, positive discussion about Batman either.

[The True Detective]

No one here hates Bruce. No one here has stated they hate Bruce or has said anything that could even be remotely intepreted as hating Bruce to anyone using common sense. You are inventing a victim narrative to complain about something that isn't even the actual topic of this thread.

And for all your finger wagging, I don't see you participating in much, if any, positive discussion about Batman either.

"To anyone using common sense" yep, there it is your legendary condescending attitude, was wondering when it'd make an appearance. So you can't explain why you don't participate in any positive discussions about Bruce. I've already explained why I feel like posting much is a waste of time since I onow how all of his threads turn out. Is there a reason why you don't post in threads about non Batjerk Batman stories, like Batman: Universe?

[Agent Z]

"To anyone using common sense" yep, there it is your legendary condescending attitude, was wondering when it'd make an appearance. So you can't explain why you don't participate in any positive discussions about Bruce. I've already explained why I feel like posting much is a waste of time since I onow how all of his threads turn out. Is there a reason why you don't post in threads about non Batjerk Batman stories, like Batman: Universe?

First of all, you accusing me of being condescending is the pot calling the kettle black.

As a matter of fact I have posted in non-Batjerk threads. I've even defended versions of Batman that got bashed on like Nolan or Affleck. Hell, I've even defended Bruce in Batman Beyond. I have also been very critical of Superman, Wonder Woman and other characters and have not defended them all the time.

Now if you see no reason to bother contributing to positive discussion about Bruce, that's your right. But you don't get to go on tirades about how there is no positive talk about Bruce in these boards especially when you derail a discussion to talk about people hating on Bruce in a thread where they actually aren't doing that.

[The True Detective]

First of all, you accusing me of being condescending is the pot calling the kettle black.

As a matter of fact I have posted in non-Batjerk threads. I've even defended versions of Batman that got bashed on like Nolan or Affleck. Hell, I've even defended Bruce in Batman Beyond. I have also been very critical of Superman, Wonder Woman and other characters and have not defended them all the time.

Now if you see no reason to bother contributing to positive discussion about Bruce, that's your right. But you don't get to go on tirades about how there is no positive talk about Bruce in these boards especially when you derail a discussion to talk about people hating on Bruce in a thread where they actually aren't doing that.

This is the last post I'm making in this thread and probably this section because it just isn't worth it but I'll just say most of your posts in general are negative and condescending and not just Batman one's but I can admit I too can be condescending and negative so whatever on that.

Sorry I derailed the thread/even posted in it in the 1st place so I'll be going now.

[The tall man]

This is the last post I'm making in this thread and probably this section because it just isn't worth it but I'll just say most of your posts in general are negative and condescending and not just Batman one's but I can admit I too can be condescending and negative so whatever on that.

Sorry I derailed the thread/even posted in it in the 1st place so I'll be going now.

100% agree with all your posts and sentiments concerning Bruce and how he is largly viewed here. I am a huge Batman/Bruce fan and have come to the point where I just shrug and say whatever when it comes to the hate he receives. When one is on top many want to see them fall hard, Batman is top dog at DC and many don't like it; so he gets criticized for any and everything. He's an easy target for people to go after and nothing short of a total reinvention of the character will appease them, maybe not even that. Just laugh if off and continue to enjoy Bruce's stories. The only fear is that some writers may attempt to fundamentally change who Batman is, to try and alter his character to appeal to the haters, which would be the worst thing they could do. Batman became and continues to be #1 by being exactly who he is. Because some people don't like that Bruce isn't "nice" enough or he's too competent and skilled or that he outshines their faves is not Batman's nor his fans problem. The negative threads and post will continue, it is what it is. Just continue the positive posts and defend the character where you see fit to.

[Comics N' Toons]

In my headcanon, Batman isnt a jerk. I dont read stories where he is an @$$hole. If Batman doesnt smile sometimes, he's not MY Batman! Paul Dini's Detective is the last Batman I read. The further away he gets from the Jose Louis Garcia Lopez Batman as seen in the style guide, the less I care! They can't even draw him properly anymore!

I believe that Grant Morrison and the Bat-God syndrome is to blame! I dont want a reinvention of Batman. I want him t return to how he was in the 70's and be played exactly how he was from that time into the early 90's. That is Batman! Not this whiny guy with 50 million Bat-family sidekicks.

But Gotham has also changed. It used to look like Burton's Gotham City... Then, in the comics, at least the art I've seen online, everything looks like a real city... like Atlanta, GA or is indistinguishable from NY or Los Angeles. The days of Bruce, Dick, Todd-Dead, Tim and Babs (Oracle) have been replaced by something that is just... not what it used to be! YUCKY!

[SiegePerilous02]

It's not like calling someone a hater is a slur or something and of course with all the nonstop negativity towards Bruce on the forum his fans will eventually snap and get sick of it. Not just this thread but any thread having to do with him is eventually turned into "this is why modern Bruce sucks" discussion 1,000,000. The thread simply asking how a relationship between him and Wonder Woman would go predictably had the usual suspects going on about how awful he is and that Wonder Woman would never be friends with him or tolerate him let alone date him.

It can't be that hard to just avoid threads about a character you don't like anymore, I don't like most of the Batfamily so I just steer clear of their threads, apparently it's too hard to do the same for Bruce. And even when he's written as the complete opposite of Batjerk or Batgod the threads don't have much discussion. Batman: Universe was not dark, grim, gritty Batgod so you'd think everyone sick of that characterization would flock to praise it or at least discuss it as a breath of fresh air. Well, you'd be wrong. Batman: Universe discussion was all but nonexistent here.

So it's just annoying that people enjoy discussing what's wrong with Bruce, but then when they're given what they claim to want they're silent and all of a sudden don't want to talk about him. I just want a little consistency.

People in general tend to not discuss what they love in great detail because they know where they stand with it, and there aren't many conflicted feelings. Current/new stuff also generates more discussion. I'm not going to discuss a lot of Bronze Age or BTAS stuff in detail because it's not current, and I'm fully satisfied with those portrayals so I can only gush on them so much.

The "usual suspects" answered the question the topic posed. They don't like the WonderBat ship because it doesn't make sense for the characters. You're ignoring the fact that that doesn't mean they don't like Diana and Bruce as friends, but it all depends on which versions of the characters we're talking about. Hell, the Superman fans who bash modern Batman portrayals are often just as critical (if not more so) of modern versions of Superman. They just hate him for different reasons.

I've also never seen you make a post that wasn't in some way connected to defending Bruce from his "haters," and while I've agreed with some of them, it does seem like you never want to engage in any other topics.

In my headcanon, Batman isnt a jerk. I dont read stories where he is an @$$hole. If Batman doesnt smile sometimes, he's not MY Batman! Paul Dini's Detective is the last Batman I read. The further away he gets from the Jose Louis Garcia Lopez Batman as seen in the style guide, the less I care! They can't even draw him properly anymore!

I believe that Grant Morrison and the Bat-God syndrome is to blame! I dont want a reinvention of Batman. I want him t return to how he was in the 70's and be played exactly how he was from that time into the early 90's. That is Batman! Not this whiny guy with 50 million Bat-family sidekicks.

Agree with the bolded, but hard disagree with the Morrison comment. They are the only writer besides Dini who can write a modern Bruce, precisely because they returned him to how he was in the 70s. If we're looking for people to blame, it's the cumulative effect of Frank Miller, Mike W. Barr, Chuck Dixon, Greg Rucka, Ed Brubaker, etc.

[Tzigone]

But Gotham has also changed. It used to look like Burton's Gotham City... Then, in the comics, at least the art I've seen online, everything looks like a real city... like Atlanta, GA or is indistinguishable from NY or Los Angeles. The days of Bruce, Dick, Todd-Dead, Tim and Babs (Oracle) have been replaced by something that is just... not what it used to be! YUCKY!

As far as I know, the gothic, Burton-esque look began not too long off when Burton made his movie. It was then something that was "not what it used to be". Frankly, I thought the Gothic look got a bit stale and boring over time, though certainly it grants more obvious "flavor" than any real-life city has (not that they don't have flavor and the ones you listed are certainly different from each other). Not a huge fan of gargoyles, etc., though it's not a deal-breaker for me. Of course, I'm not a fan of "cursed Gotham," either.

People in general tend to not discuss what they love in great detail because they know where they stand with it, and there aren't many conflicted feelings.

True. I'm much more likely to hang out on character threads for characters I either want to get to know or mildly like than the ones I love, since I like to get ideas with them, and I already know what I like on my favorites. And definitely a true on positive v. negative feelings. And not only for fiction - ever look at product reviews? Put aside from the fakes and the "I just got it" reviews, and look at the "I've had it a while reviews" and you'll get a much higher proportion of negative than positive, because people don't bother to comment when everything's working well.