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  1. #811
    Mighty Member Grinning Soul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Or Mr Sinister and all his clones.
    Oh, you’re right.

    Real question, though: can we consider Sinister as character at this point? He reads more like a caricature, a plot device… What do you think?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes, this was the moment to show how awesome was Kurt and David, not to make a half hearted effort to redeem Fabian. If that was the point I think he could have used more issues showing more of his qualities and less about how horrible he can be.
    This was the issue to make Onslaught a frightening threat and then kick his ass.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    To repeat the same action and expect different results is madness indeed, It´s like they forgot how to plan and fight.
    And they had never had more resources at their disposal! It’s infuriating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I miss all the humans allies, Valerie Cooper, Kavita, Moira, Gabrielle, Stevie, we just need more allies to make up for them or they should come back in some way..
    Yes! But they have no place in Krakoa. What would be the point?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I think he wanted to give Apocalypse a deeper motivation and that´s alright with me, what I didn´t like was other characters acting like he was just misguided when in reality he can and will still be very brutal to other mutants and humans for his own ends. Depth also means allowing the characters to keep being themselves and to actually allow them face the music if the story calls for it. Not just do a quick, everything is good again, without any kind of effort or regret from the character in question, it cheapens the story because its not believiable. So I liked his take on A, I just want the other characters to react according to who he´s actually and what he´s done.
    I suppose we’ll have to disagree on that then, Lucy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Probably but Hickman is also an Emma fan and that first scene on Inferno gave me all the feels of a girl power moment and I didn´t like it but we will see what happens.
    I think it’s more about Emma than girl power. But indeed, we’ll see.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Thank you, I honestly hope next week Leah leaves alone what´s left of Lorna and Magneto relationship and focuses on Wanda instead. So far her handle of her and the mystery around her dead has been good.
    Fingers and toes crossed, sweetie.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    My hair would look bad if I tried this too, it´s too dark, it would just look a little red at the ends so thanks Scott for helping us :)
    He’s such a good boy! :)



    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I think his job interview was the Secret Wars crossover, from then on, Hickman is being allowed a lot of freedom. I liked that crossover, no problem from me on that point but it only increases my pessimism to see how he could have handled the X-men better than he did or maybe I am not getting what he´s trying to do but I definitely would have liked if he didn´t transform Moira or forced the characterization of other characters, so I hope he at least ends on a good note.
    Cable seems to think it will, so I guess that’s the current intention. How it will be executed, though? Will the current plans remain the same?

    Who knows?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I recomend you his FF run, it´s very human and plain fun and I hoped to see touches of this on his X-men, his Avengers story was just a continuation of his FF story and his New Avengers was him totally making the illuminati doing a heel turn but mostly in character.
    I don’t think I’ll have it me to give it a try. Certainly not in a long, long while.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes, its special.
    I’m glad I’m not the only one who thinks so.

    Music is a funny thing. Sometimes a song becomes special to you not because of the song itself, but because of the moment when you heard it.

    I remember once I was driving to college and I was feeling free and happy and that song “Cruisin’” started playing on the radio. I never really particularly liked or disliked it, but something about it fit the moment so well it gained a special place in my heart.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I hope we see him soon ;P
    I doubt it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I guess given how krakoa doens´t use traditional tecnology, this is supposed to be a new facility made by Krakoa.
    Well, one more reason to add to the list of why Krakoa sucks, then. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    That was my idea too but I guess we still have to wait to see what happened.
    I’m not sure if Percy remembers or hasn’t deliberately abandoned that plot. It happened more than a year ago.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    That sometimes they use too much the shock and awe and then forgot how to send the genie back into the bottle? I, like many other readers, just like to read a good story and shock and awe alone is not enough, definitely.
    Agreed.

    Shock and awe aren’t necessary for a good story at all. So, logically, they can’t be enough to carry a good story by themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Thank you, is really great to have this space :D
    And it’s really great that you’re here. :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Beatiful images of Jean and Scott btw
    Yeah. Even when badly/meh-ly written, they still look amazing together.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I enjoyed the issue, mostly because of Jean reasons to join the X-men team, I am looking forward to see Lorna´s argument on issue #5
    I thought Jean’s characterization was over the place and, as such, there were some good moments. But also some really bad ones.

    Her reason to join the X-Men was nice and I fully agree (and have written) she would think and say such a thing. The reason she decided to tell Nightmare of all people? Totally nonsensical and arrogant, even.
    Last edited by Grinning Soul; 10-16-2021 at 05:24 AM.

  2. #812
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Soul View Post
    I don’t think you’re wrong, Lucy. But I really hope so, ‘cause I might rage quit this sh** already if that’s the case.
    If this happens I will be here to hear all of it

    Tell that to Percy and Hickman, please.
    I will but I hope they hear me.

    Make Scott Miserable Again! :P
    I prefer to see him happy but I agree he needs to stop being Stepford Scott

    WaitÂ… when did we ever retrieve a magic metal from the place where a Cosmic Force and its hosts heals?
    Lol, I was talking more about the currency idea, not the origin of Mysterium, I am still waiting for something blowing over this because, yes, they are kind of looking for trouble now and I wonder is Abiagail knows she´s getting herself into, like girl when Magneto tells you, you are going too far, is that you really are out there.

    Since weÂ’re talking about characterizations, since when Johana is a calm and collected person?
    Since X-men Legacy by Mike Carey, she started her journey towards redemption, she was the wife of Scott on an AU created by Legion mind, after they were out of it, Scott told her they never really were married, she was deppressed for a while but decided she liked the person she was on that world so she began to truly try to become part of the X-men on her own initiative, that´s when she and Erik had that talk about them growing as people. At the end of X-men Legacy she was considered an X-men by Rogue ,Magneto, Gambit, Charles, even Exodus recognized she changed even if he doesnt approve of her taste in men :P and so she´s now on Sword, because she´s quite capable and doesn´t neccesarily has a close link to Krakoa, the QC or the X-men which makes her a perfect candidate for Abigail and her team and she takes her work very seriously.


    Yes. What I loved was that even though, as a genie, she called him master and lived to please him, she was actually the boss. The way she would twist things around was so funny.
    Agreed and all those troubles they causes trying to keep her secret was so fun, part of why I liked WandaVision was because they took from this shows and to try to keep the whole "secret magic powers" under control.


    I honestly do not know what the hell was going on and I can only roll my eyes at it at this point.
    Me too, I honestly don´t know and I am not sure if I want to know. :P

    But again: itÂ’s an X-Force book. It just doesn’t fit the thematic.
    I think it fits because Betsy was this for Remender´s X-force even if she kind of also started using the same means.

    Speaking of Emma and Kitty… *sigh*
    They started their semi-friendship on Astonishing X-men and later on Bendis books but yes, they were not like they are pictured on Duggans Marauders.

    Well, I’m glad that BS is over. Now it’s a matter for bracing for the Wolverine event and hope for the best.
    That´s the actitude. :P

    His portrayal is a bit like Onslaught, right?

    Onslaught - psychic monster. ThatÂ’s all you need to know.
    Kurt - Catholic priest. ThatÂ’s all you need to know.
    Yes and the more ironic thing is that Kurt was not written particulary catholic for a long time, like writers just didn´t made it part of the narrative yet Spurrier seemed to not be able to let go of this idea that Kurt´s beliefs somehow make him get in conflict with himself which just led all kurt fans scratching their head, because you know, he has been dead before, so it´s not like he´s unfamiliar with ressurection and he also has been quite sexually active since his excalibur days so he would notice right away the problem was Krakoa´s lack of care for life and lack of responsibility towards one´s children, not just be kind of surprised by all this, yet Simon wrote him like this was such a huge discovery for him, so sigh, I hope the second series is better.

    If there is no trial I’ll be mad about how deceitful they were, but really not surprised.

    I do agree about everything else you said here. And it pisses me off, even though I’m not a Mags fan.
    Yes they really put their publicity to work on this and yes, I am still pissed off about them talking as if this was a Mags story when it´s really far from it, at least there´s pretty art.

    But the fact this has happened so many times already should be reason for them never to do it again, instead of an excuse to keep doing it. I really admire your patience.
    In one word, I just like his character too much and when he´s written well, he´s so awesome, so I stay mostly for this. I had to deal with Bob Harras trying to destroy him and calling him hitler and Morrison bassically doing his best in destroying everything about him so I have developed a thick skin :P

    We have talked about how Charles and Erik tigger each other right?, well Magneto´s character provokes this on some writers and I am not sure marvel themselves get completely what´s so special about him but like how popular he´s so they try to use his name to sell comics but also often write him trying to take away what made him such a compelling character in the first place so they often try to put him in one role or another, forgetting he doesn´t quite fit those at all, that he´s more complex than this and is not evil for the sake of being evil, or manipulative because he enjoys it despite his flaws, but they don´t get why or how. I am an old school Magneto fan who became a fan for stories like AoA or Mutant Genesis or TAS, way before the movies got there, so there are not much of us left who are still comic fans but hopefully better writting can make the older ones to come back and the new ones to know him beyond his appareances on the movies. It´s already happening but it´s a slow process.

    The problem is that they think it is. But they picked the wrong people to try to impose such BS on.
    Definitely, like I try to be polite but I don´t recomend them try to talk about this to my compatriots , If a vocal bothers them so much they are not prepared for this conversation at all.

    Well… it’s apparently really hot. But no place is perfect, right?
    Exactly.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 10-17-2021 at 11:08 AM.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  3. #813
    Extraordinary Member DragonPiece's Avatar
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    Duggan must really be a fan of Scott and Jean together, feels like we've gotten more from them with this series than we have most of the krakoa era so far.

  4. #814
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Grinning Soul;5776843]About Jean and Scott: they have other issues/flaws. Those were just examples of things that are not very positive about them, but those things are still very endearing to me because they make the characters feel like real people.

    As for Erik, the throne (and the cape - let’s not forget the cape) is just a symbol of his weird but delicious relationship with power. His nuance and complexity when it comes to that (not the big chair) makes him interesting even if that’s not one of the most admirable traits about him. So, please, when I say throne, read the whole pathos around it. Not the piece of furniture itself.
    OK, I get your meaning now Yes I also love those characters because they felt human, they act like human people who had to deal with all those experiences and I guess this is why writters often have trouble writting the X-men, because fans are used to seeing them act like real people with all this past and they don´t know all those characters like we as fans do.

    I agree, his relationship with power it´s interesting because he didn´t always had it, far from it and is precisely why he appreciates having it and the repeated use of his mutant powers has made him confortable with it, as Fraction said on an X-book but I think he also had or developed this inner power since a young age, that´s not truly linked to his mutant powers, he still feels and acts powerful even when he´s depowered, like after M-Day and one of my favorite interactions of him with the X-men in the 90´s was when Evolutionary took all mutants powers and he was like "X-men go and fight HE to bring the mutant powers back, I would do it but I am fighthing a civil war here" and the X-men were like "but we don´t have powers anymore" and he was like "Then what do you use all that Shiar tecnology for?" so they went and won and the rest is story.

    Imo I think, as you said, what makes him so magnetic is his inner power, story and emotional strenght, which gets other people to pay him attention and listen to him and it doesn´t hurt he looks great with that cape and helmet :P.

    tumblr_a7ffab9751edb3bdf02f13d245ed7f39_0eaba20c_540 (2).jpg




    I actually prefer him in the grey zone too. If he could just be written in a little less insufferable way in this Krakoa era, IÂ’d appreciate it.
    I have found he works great as an ally and also a teacher for the younger generation because this allows for a pretty varied povs when it comes to how to deal with the problem of coexistence and also brings a lot of new stories.

    Yes, there has been times on this Krakoa era where I have been like What?, he would not say that, like that moment on Israel and his whole "You have new gods now" which doesn´t rings true for a character who says the words "by the eternal" when he´s upset or that loves and appreciates his culture even if he has become distant to his faith and that personally lived on Israel, so I can only take this words as him messing with the ambassadors from the most powerful countries, to what end, I don´t know scare them? Hickman is a Magneto fan and usually gets his voice right but here, I think he really missed. It´s when I say the writers perception gets in the way of his characterization or what makes sense for the character imo.

    part of it is really not his fault. As weÂ’ve established, the man is magnetic. He turns around and that cape sweeps majestically and everyone goes: “whoa!”

    And I don’t blame them. Do you?
    Not at all :P or when he goes around with an energy ball around him, talking, fighting and calling others to fight, the man just has a presence that calls other people to attention, even Charlesn noticed this right away when they meet because he could not read his toughts.

    That’s good. But it’s also fun when we don’t agree. I believe it was due to a disagreement that tea became a recurrent joke between us. And it turns out we were being prophets!
    Yes I inmediately thought about our arguments over the tea when I read Inferno, I was like "Is Hickman reading our forum?" ;P

    I’d describe it as delicious because it’s so contradictory at first sight!

    It’s canon and we agree that they truly admire each other. Normally, this makes men more prone to work together. What is weird is that it doesn’t work like that for them. And when you add the fact that they can work with other people, it seems even odder.

    So there *must* be something else there. Something that is actually very irrational.

    Charles being a telepath and a psychiatrist and an intellectual is probably very aware of it. And yet, he cannot prevent this dynamic from happening. That shows you how this stuff must come from a really primitive, really instinctual part of the brain.

    Now, you could say: “thatÂ’s definitely a pent-up sexual tension”, but I find this explanation boring and reductive. IÂ’m a woman, but of all the males in my life I wouldnÂ’t pick a single one and say: “he’s motivated by sex and nothing else”. ‘Cause you know, attached to the testicles thereÂ’s a whole human being, who is also complex and who has a mind that works and process information and actions on multiple levels of awareness.

    So how do I see this, really? I think their admiration makes them recognise the ultimate mutant leader in the other. ThatÂ’s why they trigger each other.

    They see the ultimate mutant leader and they disagree with his ideology on principle, so they can’t help each other because they know that if they do, such a leader would crystallize that ideology with tragic consequences.

    They trigger in each other the primal instinct of protecting the tribe, which is very typical of the male brain (part of the male competitiveness BS I joked about before). And it’s not conscious and they can’t help it exactly because it actually comes from that most primitive part of their brains.

    Does it make sense?
    It makes a lot of sense and I completely agree with you there, yes making jokes about the sexual tension is fun, especially for movie fans but it´s a disservice to the complexity of the characters, they truly care for each other and for mutants, they want to bring to the table the best path forward for them and they fear the other being wrong as much or more than they fear being wrong themselves. So they can´t help but fight over it because in their mind they are not only fighting for their ideas, they are fighting for the future and survival of the group.

    This is also why I always felt they would be a unstoppable force if they managed to get to a balance on this, they truly would be fearful togather and this is also what got my attention on the Krakoa idea at first, them truly getting to explore this potential but I don´t think Hickam or the X-writers have truly began to explore this, is like they began on the first issue then turned left without exploring what this monumental change means for them as people and for the other people that followed them at one point or another and this lack of character exploration is hurting the story because they all felt like "Yes, sure, this is what we do now" but don´t explain their previous persona would get to this conclusion and in a story about a people developing their own society, you can´t stop telling this story and even Onslaught and the ressurrection protocols don´t explain them not fighting the idea of crucible or thinking it´s ok to have a colliseoum.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 10-17-2021 at 12:19 PM.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  5. #815
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    As I’ve written above, the “trigger” wouldn’t have happened in a conscious level. Now, back then, none of them were thinking of leading mutantkind or that the the other would try that eventually. But it’s the seed, the inception of that struggle between them.
    I think both of them understand each other deeply. And yet, they misunderstand each other in a tragic way.
    Agreed, they often talk past each other but don´t quite notice they are doing that and I do think it´s about their past and what this past let them know about the world around them.

    Please, do remember you asked for it. Here we go:
    After we confessed ourÂ… *ahem* admiration for both men, IÂ’d risk saying that if we added Moira to the game and played fu**, marry or kill, it’d would be obvious that weÂ’d kill Moira. :P
    If you ask me who IÂ’d marry, my answer would be: Jean-Luc Picard.

    The spray bottle might not be enough here
    Lol Sorry Moira, it´s stronger than us :P

    I also would not marry them, they are way too married to the cause even if I wish Lilandra or Magda came back to help them not get too drained by it but boy isn´t it good to look at them? I think I will also go to that tub you prepared Soul, the spray bottle will never quite make it for this one.


    I think it fundamentally changes their motivations and the X-Dream itself. But I donÂ’t have it in me to articulate why anymore, mostly because IÂ’m so fed up with this story that I just want it to end already so we can pretend it never happened.
    I honestly think if Inferno doesn´t manages to get on board the still doubtfull fans, this time will probably not be remembered much, it had great potential but you have to write the characters IC to sell the story, it´s also something AOA did very well, yes they were living on a dystopic world with different origins but you would recognize who those people were and what made them, them, Krakoa needs some of this too.

    I was really lucky.
    I think that episode shaped my personality in more ways than I can tell. ItÂ’s really weird to think about it because I was very young when it happened.
    Those experiences truly shapes us when they happen on a young age, I am glad you are well and that it didn´t harm you. Live is hard but also teaches us a lot as we grow up.


    You mean, the goal the leader has in mind?
    In part yes the goal can be something worth fighting for despite the flaws of the leader, so the people are willing to sacrifice themselves for this one goal.

    Yes! And thatÂ’s why I think they shouldnÂ’t ever write any story for AoA after that one. Let their world end so the 616 could exist again. Epic and heroic!
    It´s the best part, because they could have lived a confortable life as generals of Apocalypse but refused to do so, they are truly heroic and Epic.

    I also agree they ruined the story past this point but I can see where writers were coming from, those characters were so heroic that it was sad to see them just end like that, so I get the perception that they tried to give them their happy ending but of course, later marvel managed to ruin in once again, also forgetting what made this world so especial.

    You want to watch my having to explain myself? :P
    Tha would be nice :P
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 10-17-2021 at 11:12 AM.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  6. #816
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Soul View Post
    Oh, you’re right.
    Real question, though: can we consider Sinister as character at this point? He reads more like a caricature, a plot deviceÂ… What do you think?
    He began being interesting but yes, he used to have a little more dept than now, he just looks like he´s doing all this for no reason, yes, I get he´s fun to read but he doens´t make sense as a character, I hope Hickman goes to his original plan with him being a traitor to the X-men and Krakoa and working for Orchis in secret, because otherwise he really doens´t make sense.

    This was the issue to make Onslaught a frightening threat and then kick his ass.
    Exactly.

    And they had never had more resources at their disposal! It’s infuriating.
    Yess, they have time travel, dimension hoping, reality manipulation, elemental forces, telepathy, telekinesis, sorcery at their disposal anything they want. This just makes them look like fools and bad leaders if they can´t handle a spacial station with all those powers at their dispossal.

    But you know what? I think I dont want to see them use those powers, I would just love to see Xavier and Magneto go all out with Orchis station, I think it would be a good and epic end for their period as Krakoa leaders. Like we have never see them truly work together for a mission and get stuff done, I so would love to see this.

    Yes! But they have no place in Krakoa. What would be the point?
    They should, didn´t all mutants bring their human families to live there? of course they can invite them over but I guess their existence contradicts part of the narrative, still it´s neccesary for them to be there to present a balance on human perception. Like Briar Raleigh was living with Magneto on Asterid M along with the Acolytes and she cant live on Krakoa? it doesn´t make sense. This is definitely something Genosha has over Krakoa, there, there was not a ban on humans living there.

    I suppose weÂ’ll have to disagree on that then, Lucy.
    I agree with you he overdid it with the Orchis doctor but with Apocalypse I can see some good reasons for this, he was a good villain but sometimes too 2D one, he was bad but he didn´t look like someone who lived 4 millennia ago, his Arakko characterization is not perfect but it makes more sense with a character of his past. That said I never thought this would mean other writers and characters would take this as him being misguided, like no, he definitely wasn´t.

    I think it’s more about Emma than girl power. But indeed, weÂ’ll see.
    Yes Emma is definitely a fan favorite character by writers as well, I like to read about her but I also like characters to have challenges to their initiatives. Otherwise thinks are too easy, as you said, too convenient but well, we only saw that scene and we don´t know what happens after or before it, so I will wait and see hoping it´s something good.


    HeÂ’s such a good boy!
    He´s :P

    Cable seems to think it will, so I guess thatÂ’s the current intention. How it will be executed, though? Will the current plans remain the same?

    Who knows?
    Hickman said plans changed so yes, I think we will see some changes but Krakoa will stay around for the next few years, I hope the execution and character work is better because the idea itself has great potential.


    I donÂ’t think IÂ’ll have it me to give it a try. Certainly not in a long, long while.
    I understand and it probably is better to first take your mind off this era before reading them.

    IÂ’m glad IÂ’m not the only one who thinks so.

    Music is a funny thing. Sometimes a song becomes special to you not because of the song itself, but because of the moment when you heard it.

    I remember once I was driving to college and I was feeling free and happy and that song “Cruisin” started playing on the radio. I never really particularly liked or disliked it, but something about it fit the moment so well it gained a special place in my heart.
    Exactly, songs are especial because they made us remember the special moments in which we listened to them for the first time, totally agree with you there.


    Well, one more reason to add to the list of why Krakoa sucks, then. :P
    Lol I will need to see it more before making a judgment.I like the idea of a forest with traps as part of the danger room training.

    IÂ’m not sure if Percy remembers or hasnÂ’t deliberately abandoned that plot. It happened more than a year ago.
    Lest hope he remembers.

    Shock and awe arenÂ’t necessary for a good story at all. So, logically, they can’t be enough to carry a good story by themselves.
    Exactly, shock and awe are a result of the story, not the other way around.

    And itÂ’s really great that youÂ’re here.
    Thank you


    I thought JeanÂ’s characterization was over the place and, as such, there were some good moments. But also some really bad ones.

    Her reason to join the X-Men was nice and I fully agree (and have written) she would think and say such a thing. The reason she decided to tell Nightmare of all people? Totally nonsensical and arrogant, even.
    Well given Nightmare is quite arrogant himself, I just saw this as her getting him to loss control of himself as a way of defeating him, the traditional, make them mad so they began to make mistakes.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 10-17-2021 at 11:14 AM.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  7. #817
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    Duggan must really be a fan of Scott and Jean together, feels like we've gotten more from them with this series than we have most of the krakoa era so far.
    Agreed, he does seem to have Jean and Scott at the center on all those issues.
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 10-17-2021 at 10:53 AM.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  8. #818
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    Duggan must really be a fan of Scott and Jean together, feels like we've gotten more from them with this series than we have most of the krakoa era so far.
    I noticed that too, hopefully that trends continues onward, been the best parts for me (still like it overall) Loooooove the couple, any iteration, my love for both of them goes beyond relationships and the status quo, but ideally them together monogamous would be my endgame. I'm all with the sewing of the oats tho
    Last edited by Neocide; 10-17-2021 at 10:53 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    If this happens I will be here to hear all of it :)
    Thank you. But I think I’ll rage silently. Not sure the world is prepared for a vocal wrath from my part. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I will but I hope they hear me.
    You are a charitable soul. I think you’ll be wasting your time, though. Fanboys will be fanboys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I prefer to see him happy but I agree he needs to stop being Stepford Scott :D
    It’s a like a shock therapy, you know? We overshoot on the misery, then his Red comes and makes him healthy-happy again, like he used to be pre-Apocalypse. Then we get to see those rare, but beautiful and genuine smiles of his again. :)



    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Lol, I was talking more about the currency idea, not the origin of Mysterium, I am still waiting for something blowing over this because, yes, they are kind of looking for trouble now and I wonder is Abiagail knows she´s getting herself into, like girl when Magneto tells you, you are going too far, is that you really are out there.
    I was talking about how convenient it is they find magic metal *just* when the galaxy needs and *right* at the moment where they can use it to buy support (quite literally).

    Moreover: when *Doom* thinks you went to far… :D

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Since X-men Legacy by Mike Carey, she started her journey towards redemption, she was the wife of Scott on an AU created by Legion mind, after they were out of it, Scott told her they never really were married, she was deppressed for a while but decided she liked the person she was on that world so she began to truly try to become part of the X-men on her own initiative, that´s when she and Erik had that talk about them growing as people. At the end of X-men Legacy she was considered an X-men by Rogue ,Magneto, Gambit, Charles, even Exodus recognized she changed even if he doesnt approve of her taste in men :P and so she´s now on Sword, because she´s quite capable and doesn´t neccesarily has a close link to Krakoa, the QC or the X-men which makes her a perfect candidate for Abigail and her team and she takes her work very seriously.
    I know of her journey. I’m not questioning whether or not she deserves a place in the book. It’s more about her personality. Throughout everything you described, she wasn’t exactly calm and collected. And not exactly suited to act in a diplomatic role.

    But I’m an old lady. I may have forgotten something important here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Agreed and all those troubles they causes trying to keep her secret was so fun, part of why I liked WandaVision was because they took from this shows and to try to keep the whole "secret magic powers" under control.
    I still haven’t watched it. Since Marvel canceled my beloved Daredevil Netflix series, I decided I’d boycott their streaming service. I've never even subscribed to it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Me too, I honestly don´t know and I am not sure if I want to know. :P
    There was a time I really wanted to know wth was going on. Now I just don’t care, as long as they really drop it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I think it fits because Betsy was this for Remender´s X-force even if she kind of also started using the same means.
    Nah… She wasn’t really there because of any ethics. She was there because of Warren, romantically but also to check on his mental health because they were going after Apocalypse and he was already struggling with his Archangel persona.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    They started their semi-friendship on Astonishing X-men and later on Bendis books but yes, they were not like they are pictured on Duggans Marauders.
    Not at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes and the more ironic thing is that Kurt was not written particulary catholic for a long time, like writers just didn´t made it part of the narrative yet Spurrier seemed to not be able to let go of this idea that Kurt´s beliefs somehow make him get in conflict with himself which just led all kurt fans scratching their head, because you know, he has been dead before, so it´s not like he´s unfamiliar with ressurection and he also has been quite sexually active since his excalibur days so he would notice right away the problem was Krakoa´s lack of care for life and lack of responsibility towards one´s children, not just be kind of surprised by all this, yet Simon wrote him like this was such a huge discovery for him, so sigh, I hope the second series is better.
    The only part I’d understand he’d be shocked is mutants abandoning their babies which, incidentally, was the consequence of the law *he* suggested. Most Catholics would feel guilty about not having explained better or, at least, not having followed up on the law they created to make sure people understood what it meant. But I digress.

    The point is that his characterization was weird and it really felt like everything sprung from this one piece of information: “he’s a Catholic priest”.

    For his fans’ sake, I hope the next book is better too, but I won’t be reading.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes they really put their publicity to work on this and yes, I am still pissed off about them talking as if this was a Mags story when it´s really far from it, at least there´s pretty art.
    Do you think there’s hope the next issues will be so brilliant it will make up for the horrible first ones?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    In one word, I just like his character too much and when he´s written well, he´s so awesome, so I stay mostly for this. I had to deal with Bob Harras trying to destroy him and calling him hitler and Morrison bassically doing his best in destroying everything about him so I have developed a thick skin :P

    We have talked about how Charles and Erik tigger each other right?, well Magneto´s character provokes this on some writers and I am not sure marvel themselves get completely what´s so special about him but like how popular he´s so they try to use his name to sell comics but also often write him trying to take away what made him such a compelling character in the first place so they often try to put him in one role or another, forgetting he doesn´t quite fit those at all, that he´s more complex than this and is not evil for the sake of being evil, or manipulative because he enjoys it despite his flaws, but they don´t get why or how. I am an old school Magneto fan who became a fan for stories like AoA or Mutant Genesis or TAS, way before the movies got there, so there are not much of us left who are still comic fans but hopefully better writting can make the older ones to come back and the new ones to know him beyond his appareances on the movies. It´s already happening but it´s a slow process.
    Yeah… The problem with those writers putting their “take” on the character whenever they want and ignoring whatever they need to make it happen is that it makes the character less defined. ‘Cause if that happens often enough, at some point, it’s hard to numerically justify that your “old school” (as you put) perception is what is still in-character for him.

    We’re not there yet. But it’s a dangerous game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Definitely, like I try to be polite but I don´t recomend them try to talk about this to my compatriots , If a vocal bothers them so much they are not prepared for this conversation at all.
    Mmm… is it wrong of me to want to watch they try, though?



    Yeah. Yeah. It’s wrong. I know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Exactly.
    Vulcan, here we go! :)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    OK, I get your meaning now :) Yes I also love those characters because they felt human, they act like human people who had to deal with all those experiences and I guess this is why writters often have trouble writting the X-men, because fans are used to seeing them act like real people with all this past and they don´t know all those characters like we as fans do.

    I agree, his relationship with power it´s interesting because he didn´t always had it, far from it and is precisely why he appreciates having it and the repeated use of his mutant powers has made him confortable with it, as Fraction said on an X-book but I think he also had or developed this inner power since a young age, that´s not truly linked to his mutant powers, he still feels and acts powerful even when he´s depowered, like after M-Day and one of my favorite interactions of him with the X-men in the 90´s was when Evolutionary took all mutants powers and he was like "X-men go and fight HE to bring the mutant powers back, I would do it but I am fighthing a civil war here" and the X-men were like "but we don´t have powers anymore" and he was like "Then what do you use all that Shiar tecnology for?" so they went and won and the rest is story.

    Imo I think, as you said, what makes him so magnetic is his inner power, story and emotional strenght, which gets other people to pay him attention and listen to him and it doesn´t hurt he looks great with that cape and helmet :P.

    tumblr_a7ffab9751edb3bdf02f13d245ed7f39_0eaba20c_540 (2).jpg

    Exactly. I really don’t mean to mock him (well, a little, but that’s because I’m impossible :P). I really think his weird relationship with power makes him a cooler character.

    And yes: that cape is goalz. I think he is the best cape-wearer of the MU.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I have found he works great as an ally and also a teacher for the younger generation because this allows for a pretty varied povs when it comes to how to deal with the problem of coexistence and also brings a lot of new stories.
    I don’t dislike him as a teacher, but I think it’s wasted potential for his character. He fits better on other roles and I prefer him occupying them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes, there has been times on this Krakoa era where I have been like What?, he would not say that, like that moment on Israel and his whole "You have new gods now" which doesn´t rings true for a character who says the words "by the eternal" when he´s upset or that loves and appreciates his culture even if he has become distant to his faith and that personally lived on Israel, so I can only take this words as him messing with the ambassadors from the most powerful countries, to what end, I don´t know scare them? Hickman is a Magneto fan and usually gets his voice right but here, I think he really missed. It´s when I say the writers perception gets in the way of his characterization or what makes sense for the character imo.
    There were other instances where I was: “Mags, dear? Tone that down. You’ve been there and done there. You should know better now”.

    As for Hickman… that scene with Moira in Inferno… argh… I don’t know which of the three characters I wanted to slap the most. But I think it was probably the men because of that bug in Moira’s tea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Not at all :P or when he goes around with an energy ball around him, talking, fighting and calling others to fight, the man just has a presence that calls other people to attention, even Charlesn noticed this right away when they meet because he could not read his toughts.
    Even though he’s not one of my favourites, I have no problem admitting that he’s a powerhouse both in terms of mutant power and of gravitas as a character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes I inmediately thought about our arguments over the tea when I read Inferno, I was like "Is Hickman reading our forum?" ;P
    If there’s no data page in the next issue, I’ll entertain the possibility! :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    It makes a lot of sense and I completely agree with you there, yes making jokes about the sexual tension is fun, especially for movie fans but it´s a disservice to the complexity of the characters, they truly care for each other and for mutants, they want to bring to the table the best path forward for them and they fear the other being wrong as much or more than they fear being wrong themselves. So they can´t help but fight over it because in their mind they are not only fighting for their ideas, they are fighting for the future and survival of the group.
    Yep. It’s not simply due to a bruised ego (though, there’s a little bit of that too) that mutants would be following the other man. It’s really for being concerned about what that means for the group as a whole.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    This is also why I always felt they would be a unstoppable force if they managed to get to a balance on this, they truly would be fearful togather and this is also what got my attention on the Krakoa idea at first, them truly getting to explore this potential but I don´t think Hickam or the X-writers have truly began to explore this, is like they began on the first issue then turned left without exploring what this monumental change means for them as people and for the other people that followed them at one point or another and this lack of character exploration is hurting the story because they all felt like "Yes, sure, this is what we do now" but don´t explain their previous persona would get to this conclusion and in a story about a people developing their own society, you can´t stop telling this story and even Onslaught and the ressurrection protocols don´t explain them not fighting the idea of crucible or thinking it´s ok to have a colliseoum.
    But I don’t think they can truly ever, fully cooperate, without one of them making some serious compromise. Krakoa is a serious compromise to Xavier’s dream. A mutant island where very few humans can live is not exactly an example of co-existence, any more than shrugging and saying "well, we're sharing the planet, I guess" is.

    I agree with you, though, about the rest. The lack of clear motivation for the characters and the turn the story took did have a negative impact in the original concept of Krakoa. Two years into this story and several wasted opportunities after? I just don’t care anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Agreed, they often talk past each other but don´t quite notice they are doing that and I do think it´s about their past and what this past let them know about the world around them.
    Yes. It’s really about the future and what it means to mutantkind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Lol Sorry Moira, it´s stronger than us :P

    I also would not marry them, they are way too married to the cause even if I wish Lilandra or Magda came back to help them not get too drained by it but boy isn´t it good to look at them? I think I will also go to that tub you prepared Soul, the spray bottle will never quite make it for this one.
    *Scoots over and adds some ice to the tub*

    Join me, hun! :D

    Now that you’re here, let’s talk this over: if you’re going to kill Moira, you have to marry someone. Personally, I think an ambitious, driven man is sexy af [*adds some more ice cubes to the tub*] and, as a workaholic myself, I don’t require too much pampering.

    (Though, I have to admit, this game has always been a little too vague for me.)

    So maybe we let Moira live and find a way to bring Lilandra and Magda back? That should keep those guys safe from us.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I honestly think if Inferno doesn´t manages to get on board the still doubtfull fans, this time will probably not be remembered much, it had great potential but you have to write the characters IC to sell the story, it´s also something AOA did very well, yes they were living on a dystopic world with different origins but you would recognize who those people were and what made them, them, Krakoa needs some of this too.
    I’m ready for it to burn down. Team Mystique all the way. Oh… she brought Destiny back. No need to burn the damn island down, I guess… Never mind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    In part yes the goal can be something worth fighting for despite the flaws of the leader, so the people are willing to sacrifice themselves for this one goal.
    Yep. That’s it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    It´s the best part, because they could have lived a confortable life as generals of Apocalypse but refused to do so, they are truly heroic and Epic.

    I also agree they ruined the story past this point but I can see where writers were coming from, those characters were so heroic that it was sad to see them just end like that, so I get the perception that they tried to give them their happy ending but of course, later marvel managed to ruin in once again, also forgetting what made this world so especial.
    I know, right? Sometimes the best you can do is to leave a good story end at its end. Another example that comes to mind? Matrix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Tha would be nice :P
    Wanting to see me having to get out of a tight spot? You are a true friend! :D

    And I’m not being sarcastic! :D

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    He began being interesting but yes, he used to have a little more dept than now, he just looks like he´s doing all this for no reason, yes, I get he´s fun to read but he doens´t make sense as a character, I hope Hickman goes to his original plan with him being a traitor to the X-men and Krakoa and working for Orchis in secret, because otherwise he really doens´t make sense.
    That’s how I felt about him in Hellions: he’s fun, but not really a character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Exactly.
    But he shifted the focus from the threat so much that the whole CrubiBall thing felt super meh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yess, they have time travel, dimension hoping, reality manipulation, elemental forces, telepathy, telekinesis, sorcery at their disposal anything they want. This just makes them look like fools and bad leaders if they can´t handle a spacial station with all those powers at their dispossal..
    I know, right?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    But you know what? I think I dont want to see them use those powers, I would just love to see Xavier and Magneto go all out with Orchis station, I think it would be a good and epic end for their period as Krakoa leaders. Like we have never see them truly work together for a mission and get stuff done, I so would love to see this.
    After all the idiotic things they have done? Why not? At least it would look cool-- actually, nope: it would be hot!

    We would probably need to jump back in the tub to read such issue, though. :P

    What do you think? We make some Pińa Coladas for the occasion? :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    They should, didn´t all mutants bring their human families to live there? of course they can invite them over but I guess their existence contradicts part of the narrative, still it´s neccesary for them to be there to present a balance on human perception. Like Briar Raleigh was living with Magneto on Asterid M along with the Acolytes and she cant live on Krakoa? it doesn´t make sense. This is definitely something Genosha has over Krakoa, there, there was not a ban on humans living there.
    I don’t think so. Scott made it clear that Franklin had a place in Krakoa, but Valeria didn’t. And his parents were never invited either. And those are high profile people, imagine what it’s like for the nobody’s. (Same with Carmen in CoTA.)

    I think very few humans (like Kyle) are allowed to live there. But at this point, if a writer decides to tell me there’s whole neighbourhood in Krakoa where the filthy flatscans live? My reaction will be: “sure, why not? This is not the most nonsensical thing of this era anyway.” Also, I bet we’d be informed of it in a data page!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I agree with you he overdid it with the Orchis doctor but with Apocalypse I can see some good reasons for this, he was a good villain but sometimes too 2D one, he was bad but he didn´t look like someone who lived 4 millennia ago, his Arakko characterization is not perfect but it makes more sense with a character of his past. That said I never thought this would mean other writers and characters would take this as him being misguided, like no, he definitely wasn´t.
    I actually think it’s the other way around: I find the Orchis doctor more believable. Apocalypse… *sigh* I don’t even know what to say. In some ways, the characterization “corrected” some stuff that was added to his original concept, but I think that was the case where not correcting was actually a better option.

    In other ways, his characterization was bland and insulting to the character he originally was.

    So let’s just say I can’t get behind that mess. And the fact that Hickman used marriage to try to make one his characters more sympathetic again? It just reads lazy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Yes Emma is definitely a fan favorite character by writers as well, I like to read about her but I also like characters to have challenges to their initiatives. Otherwise thinks are too easy, as you said, too convenient but well, we only saw that scene and we don´t know what happens after or before it, so I will wait and see hoping it´s something good.
    I think no matter what happens, at least her fans should be happy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Hickman said plans changed so yes, I think we will see some changes but Krakoa will stay around for the next few years, I hope the execution and character work is better because the idea itself has great potential.
    I agree with you about the fact that it will still be around for years. I was saying this even before they announced Inferno. But I can’t help wishing this thing we end and we can forget about this weird time in the X-Men history where the flagship book was not about heroes (Hickman’s X-Men).

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    I understand and it probably is better to first take your mind off this era before reading them.
    Yeah. I prefer to just read old comics at this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Exactly, songs are especial because they made us remember the special moments in which we listened to them for the first time, totally agree with you there.
    I’ve always loved this song, but once I heard it at a night club very late in the night and it made me cry and hug my friend who was nearby. We were both there about to send another of our best friend abroad for 4 years. Really friends. Things were never romantic between any of us. But the “I can’t let you go” was just too much at the time. We were happy, we were dancing, we were crying… Oh, well… “Life is crazy”. :)



    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Lol I will need to see it more before making a judgment.I like the idea of a forest with traps as part of the danger room training.
    In Wolverine #1, Percy tried to sell the idea. The sequence looks quite cool, but it doesn’t really land as a Danger Room training.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Lest hope he remembers.
    I don’t think it makes much sense to go back to it now. The whole point of resurrections being fishy seems to have been dropped.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Exactly, shock and awe are a result of the story, not the other way around.
    Yeah. And some stories are awesome without ever generating either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Thank you :D
    I mean it, Lucy. :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Well given Nightmare is quite arrogant himself, I just saw this as her getting him to loss control of himself as a way of defeating him, the traditional, make them mad so they began to make mistakes.
    Okay, I swear I went back to the issue and tried to read it this way. But I really couldn’t. I’m not saying you’re wrong. It just doesn’t feel like she had planned to make him lose control…

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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    Duggan must really be a fan of Scott and Jean together, feels like we've gotten more from them with this series than we have most of the krakoa era so far.
    Not so sure about it. He could have used them more often than he did in Cable, for instance. It seems to me he’s writing them as a couple because that’s what they became during XoS. Before it was more of a “yeah, they’re married, but who knows what that means?” case.

    It also helps that both are finally part of the main cast of the same book.

    But, hey, whatever the case, I’m not complaining we’re getting to see them together more often!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lucyinthesky View Post
    Agreed, he does seem to have Jean and Scott at the center on all those issues.
    While this is a group book, Jean and Scott are too strong of characters not to take a central role. I can’t really blame him. But I’d like to see the other characters a bit better, most especially Laura who has been neglected so far.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neocide View Post
    I noticed that too, hopefully that trends continues onward, been the best parts for me (still like it overall) Loooooove the couple, any iteration, my love for both of them goes beyond relationships and the status quo, but ideally them together monogamous would be my endgame. I'm all with the sewing of the oats tho :p
    Hey, we’re running a family-oriented-children’s-friendly thread here. Says, Grinning Soul, from the icy tub where she’s cooling down with Lucyinthesky after a conversation about killing Moira and marrying Captain Picard! :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Soul View Post
    Exactly. I really donÂ’t mean to mock him (well, a little, but thatÂ’s because IÂ’m impossible :P). I really think his weird relationship with power makes him a cooler character.
    And yes: that cape is goalz. I think he is the best cape-wearer of the MU.[/QUOTE]

    Lol, I get it and that cape, yess! I honestly think artist have so much fun drawing it.

    My first big impression of him was him looking down at Hank from an energy ball on TAS and I was like "Who´s that cool guy?" then he went and talked about his past and that he would not stand by and let it repeat again and I was "Hi, favorite new character, I don´t care you are the villain, I like you" :P then I went into comics and developed my hate/love relationship with marvel.

    I donÂ’t dislike him as a teacher, but I think itÂ’s wasted potential for his character. He fits better on other roles and I prefer him occupying them.
    I agree that him being a teacher can be used to put him in a corner a little, I have good memories of his time with the New mutants because there were some truly heartwarming moments between them and I also like to see him more active. I am curious to know, on what roles you would like to see him?

    There were other instances where I was: “Mags, dear? Tone that down. You’ve been there and done there. You should know better now”.
    Agreed but this was the biggest one for me, I was like, Hickman please, remember who are writting about.

    As for HickmanÂ… that scene with Moira in InfernoÂ… arghÂ… I donÂ’t know which of the three characters I wanted to slap the most. But I think it was probably the men because of that bug in MoiraÂ’s tea.
    I have disconnected from inferno and was way too happy to see him on a good mood and drinking again, so mostly Moira bothered more out of the three lol but I get your point, I mostly have that urge when Hickman´s tackles characters, they all sound way too arrogant sometimes but there are also usually good ideas around, so it´s a mixed experience for me.

    Even though heÂ’s not one of my favourites, I have no problem admitting that heÂ’s a powerhouse both in terms of mutant power and of gravitas as a character.
    Exactly and I believe this is why he still has fans, despite some writters best efforts and marvel mishandling him so much, the guy is still too magnetic to resist sometiems. (sorry for my bad pun)

    If thereÂ’s no data page in the next issue, IÂ’ll entertain the possibility! :P
    It´s done then, we will see if next issue of Inferno doesn´t have data pages.

    Yep. ItÂ’s not simply due to a bruised ego (though, thereÂ’s a little bit of that too) that mutants would be following the other man. ItÂ’s really for being concerned about what that means for the group as a whole.
    Exactly :P they can´t help but worry and even when they do take a break there´s always something happening that brings them back, one of my favorite moments like this was when Magneto and Alytis Forrester(Scott´s former girlfriend) were just about to kiss and Charles comes with his giant astral head and tells Magneto he has to join the X-men and fight off Beyonder asap while Erik is like, sigh, such timing you have old friend.

    ]But I donÂ’t think they can truly ever, fully cooperate, without one of them making some serious compromise. Krakoa is a serious compromise to XavierÂ’s dream. A mutant island where very few humans can live is not exactly an example of co-existence, any more than shrugging and saying "well, we're sharing the planet, I guess" is.
    I agree with you, though, about the rest. The lack of clear motivation for the characters and the turn the story took did have a negative impact in the original concept of Krakoa. Two years into this story and several wasted opportunities after? I just donÂ’t care anymore.
    I agree it´s a serious compromise and it should be treated as one, something the Krakoa era has not truly tackled imo but well, Magneto already did this when he joined the X-men so I was looking forward to see Charles doing a similar compromise and he actually went to help Mags to bring back Genosha, so there´s a background to this idea, what´s lacking is the character voices imo.


    Yes. ItÂ’s really about the future and what it means to mutantkind.
    Exactly

    *Scoots over and adds some ice to the tub*

    Join me, hun!

    Now that youÂ’re here, letÂ’s talk this over: if youÂ’re going to kill Moira, you have to marry someone. Personally, I think an ambitious, driven man is sexy af [*adds some more ice cubes to the tub*] and, as a workaholic myself, I donÂ’t require too much pampering.

    (Though, I have to admit, this game has always been a little too vague for me.)

    So maybe we let Moira live and find a way to bring Lilandra and Magda back? That should keep those guys safe from us.
    Well I think I would kill Moira, variant Moira I have not problem with, original Moira, I would just put her to sleep XD
    Fuck Charles and Marry AoA Magneto, he obviously was able to keep a family around despite his mission and I would marry 616 Mags with happines and Storm or Medusa, sadly they are already taken and it´s my problem with him, I think Briar is not good for him but at least they have fun together.

    IÂ’m ready for it to burn down. Team Mystique all the way. OhÂ… she brought Destiny back. No need to burn the damn island down, I guessÂ… Never mind.
    I don´t know, Are you sure that´s really Destiny? (evil smile) I don´t want Krakoa burned down but I would like to see it change for the better and for Genosha to come back.


    I know, right? Sometimes the best you can do is to leave a good story end at its end. Another example that comes to mind? Matrix.
    It was so epic I didn´t even mind all the issues I had to buy, it was that good. Marvel should remember if they want to sell, they need to bring this epicness and character work back, edginess on it´s own is just enough to seel #1 issues.


    Wanting to see me having to get out of a tight spot? You are a true friend!

    And IÂ’m not being sarcastic!
    I enjoy having debates with you, do you think I don´t enjoy reading you other debates? and I also enjoy reading Havok´s povs
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  14. #824
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Soul View Post
    Thank you. But I think IÂ’ll rage silently. Not sure the world is prepared for a vocal wrath from my part. :P
    If you want to send a private message I would not mind

    You are a charitable soul. I think youÂ’ll be wasting your time, though. Fanboys will be fanboys.
    Yes I have learned this the hard way but once in a while it works.

    ItÂ’s a like a shock therapy, you know? We overshoot on the misery, then his Red comes and makes him healthy-happy again, like he used to be pre-Apocalypse. Then we get to see those rare, but beautiful and genuine smiles of his again.

    Whatever brings Scott back is fine for me, I personally think he will not be exactly like he was in the past, too much has happened but Jean can always bring a smile to his face and I am looking forward to seeing more of them.

    I was talking about how convenient it is they find magic metal *just* when the galaxy needs and *right* at the moment where they can use it to buy support (quite literally).

    Moreover: when *Doom* thinks you went to farÂ…
    Well it´s fine by me because Abigail did this on purpose, I am sure she has been looking for the metal for some time but didn´t have the means until now to get it,she´s a speacer, she knows her way around it and about Victor well, I agreed with his warning but I disliked him trying to manipulate them with it. Still I think Storm and Abigail could have managed it better and I am still waiting to see a new interaction between him and my boy, they are just epic when they fight or join forces.

    I know of her journey. IÂ’m not questioning whether or not she deserves a place in the book. ItÂ’s more about her personality. Throughout everything you described, she wasnÂ’t exactly calm and collected. And not exactly suited to act in a diplomatic role.

    But IÂ’m an old lady. I may have forgotten something important here.
    Ewing took down her actitude a bit but context explains her role, other ambassadors are Super Skrull and Gladiator and on space diplomacy sometimes is done by trial of combat so yes, Frenzy is right at home there and I honestly think the Skrull representative has a thing for her.

    I still havenÂ’t watched it. Since Marvel canceled my beloved Daredevil Netflix series, I decided IÂ’d boycott their streaming service. I've never even subscribed to it.
    I suscribed for Wanda mostly and really enjoyed it, if you have time, maybe you should look it over. I also liked Falcon and the Winter Soldier series.

    There was a time I really wanted to know wth was going on. Now I just donÂ’t care, as long as they really drop it.
    Same honestly, I just want them to get away from that concept, it didnt made sense.

    NahÂ… She wasnÂ’t really there because of any ethics. She was there because of Warren, romantically but also to check on his mental health because they were going after Apocalypse and he was already struggling with his Archangel persona.
    Agreed but her role sometimes involved ethics, I expected this role to fall to Jean, it would have been an interesting role for her but well, it never happened so I should move past that.

    Not at all.
    This is another case in which you can have the same plot and story but need to get the characters voices right to sell the story imo.

    The only part IÂ’d understand heÂ’d be shocked is mutants abandoning their babies which, incidentally, was the consequence of the law *he* suggested. Most Catholics would feel guilty about not having explained better or, at least, not having followed up on the law they created to make sure people understood what it meant. But I digress.
    Which brings me back to the criticism he himself made about crucible, I was like "You are part of the goverment and can bring your own initiatives Kurt" get to work mister.

    The point is that his characterization was weird and it really felt like everything sprung from this one piece of information: “he’s a Catholic priest”.
    He almost was and there´s nothing wrong with that but he never really became one and Spurrier needs to get over it honestly

    For his fansÂ’ sake, I hope the next book is better too, but I wonÂ’t be reading.
    Agreed, I want them to have Kurt back as himself.


    Do you think thereÂ’s hope the next issues will be so brilliant it will make up for the horrible first ones?
    I am conflicted because not everything has been terrible, it´s just her handle of Mags the thing I can´t deal with and Leah talked about doing some catharsis for the characters so I can only hope that also involves Mags in some way, like I hope for the best but I can see how bad this still can turn into. I just love the art, there´s no conflict on me from that point.

    Yeah… The problem with those writers putting their “take” on the character whenever they want and ignoring whatever they need to make it happen is that it makes the character less defined. ‘Cause if that happens often enough, at some point, it’s hard to numerically justify that your “old school” (as you put) perception is what is still in-character for him.

    WeÂ’re not there yet. But itÂ’s a dangerous game.
    Specially with a character like Magneto who´s hard to write in balance, this is why I will always give credit when it´s due and despite marvel bad handling on him and allowing Morrison write him that way, writers like Mike Carey, who truly care about the X-men and are just brilliant, as Hickman said, Fraction, Gillen, Bunn, Duggan, Hickman and Bendis have managed him back into a certain balance that I think is the best spot for the character and I am grateful for their work there. It makes the bad moments more palatable and while I haven not liked everything they have done with him, I can see how they are giving him deeper levels of depth.

    MmmÂ… is it wrong of me to want to watch they try, though?



    Yeah. Yeah. ItÂ’s wrong. I know.
    Lol you can, from a safe distance ;P


    Vulcan, here we go!
    Spock better be ready ;P
    Last edited by Lucyinthesky; 10-17-2021 at 05:15 PM.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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  15. #825
    Astonishing Member Lucyinthesky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Soul View Post
    ThatÂ’s how I felt about him in Hellions: heÂ’s fun, but not really a character.
    Exactly, he needs to be a character again, with motivations and goals or probably he just have not seen them yet.

    But he shifted the focus from the threat so much that the whole CrubiBall thing felt super meh.
    Yes when he suggested the idea I was excited but the excution could have been better if he showed more how big, extremely big danger Onslaught is so the end would have feel more satisfying.

    I know, right?????
    I get the sense their former selves who didn´t have even half they have now, would be like "you fools" XD well Magneto would be, Charles would try to take over Krakoa´s Charles mind and do things right. ;p

    After all the idiotic things they have done? Why not? At least it would look cool-- actually, nope: it would be hot!

    We would probably need to jump back in the tub to read such issue, though. :P

    What do you think? We make some Piña Coladas for the occasion? :P
    I would not mind this at all, I saw art from Inferno with them both looking at a door, like getting ready to attack together and I was like, I need that spray Soul, right now ;P

    I donÂ’t think so. Scott made it clear that Franklin had a place in Krakoa, but Valeria didnÂ’t. And his parents were never invited either. And those are high profile people, imagine what itÂ’s like for the nobodyÂ’s. (Same with Carmen in CoTA.)

    I think very few humans (like Kyle) are allowed to live there. But at this point, if a writer decides to tell me there’s whole neighbourhood in Krakoa where the filthy flatscans live? My reaction will be: “sure, why not? This is not the most nonsensical thing of this era anyway.” Also, I bet we’d be informed of it in a data page!
    I honestly don´t take the crossover with the FF4 as canon when he have seen Kyle and Jubes child around without a care in the world but I agree we need confirmation, how many humans are currently living on Krakoa and how many bans are there for them living there?

    I actually think it’s the other way around: I find the Orchis doctor more believable. Apocalypse… *sigh* I don’t even know what to say. In some ways, the characterization “corrected” some stuff that was added to his original concept, but I think that was the case where not correcting was actually a better option.

    In other ways, his characterization was bland and insulting to the character he originally was. So letÂ’s just say I canÂ’t get behind that mess. And the fact that Hickman used marriage to try to make one his characters more sympathetic again? It just reads lazy.
    On this front I agree, he needs to be back into being a menace older than the world, we can keep his background and family and he needs to be a character worthy of his name again, Dark Ages bassically put the reset button on him so I expect X-books to bring something like this back.


    I think no matter what happens, at least her fans should be happy.
    Agreed, at least her fans will be happy.

    I agree with you about the fact that it will still be around for years. I was saying this even before they announced Inferno. But I canÂ’t help wishing this thing we end and we can forget about this weird time in the X-Men history where the flagship book was not about heroes (HickmanÂ’s X-Men).
    Well it didn´t feel like a villain book either, more like a travel book to see some main points for the era, which yes, is a terrible waste of the flagship comic Mr Hickman. I will admit even Morrison did better on the opportunity to write it.

    Yeah. I prefer to just read old comics at this point.
    I confess I do this when I felt sad, it´s nice to remember and read again the awesome stories of older comics.

    I’ve always loved this song, but once I heard it at a night club very late in the night and it made me cry and hug my friend who was nearby. We were both there about to send another of our best friend abroad for 4 years. Really friends. Things were never romantic between any of us. But the “I can’t let you go” was just too much at the time. We were happy, we were dancing, we were crying… Oh, well… “Life is crazy”.

    Song have this exact effect on me, they either make me remember such awesome times with friends or bad times being better thanks to this songs. Music is like magic


    In Wolverine #1, Percy tried to sell the idea. The sequence looks quite cool, but it doesnÂ’t really land as a Danger Room training.
    I think they should bring back Danger, she´s a good ally and can be pretty good at training the kids. X-men Blue suggested this role for her but we didn´t quite see it being done.


    I donÂ’t think it makes much sense to go back to it now. The whole point of resurrections being fishy seems to have been dropped.
    Agreed

    Yeah. And some stories are awesome without ever generating either.
    Exactly, quite stories can be so strong and memorable on their own.

    I mean it, Lucy.
    I know

    Okay, I swear I went back to the issue and tried to read it this way. But I really couldnÂ’t. IÂ’m not saying youÂ’re wrong. It just doesnÂ’t feel like she had planned to make him lose controlÂ…
    I will have to read the issue again but it would not be the first time Jean uses this strategy to take down opponents. On the other hand, the story also felt like a fairly tale for me so maybe Duggan didn´t overthinked about it.
    "To the X-men then, who don´t die the old fashioned way and no matter how hard we try, none of us die forever" Uncanny X-Men #270, Jean and Ororo


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