Scott was abused by the person who had agreed to be his therapist. He wasn't forced to have an affair, but he was violated during a moment of enormous emotional fragility and he gave in, like many victims of abuse do. But I won't expand on that, because, for you, I guess, it doesn't matter what is actually written in the story. Instead you prefer to focus on an interview with the writer.
So I suppose there's no point in discussing it either. I just wanted to register it, really, in case a new reader is lurking here.
I abhor that sort of "storytelling", like something actually unique or transgressive is accomplished by doing that; so I won't be reading that series ever. Again, if I'd been reading New X-Men as it was being published, and especially if I had been reading the comics in the years before, I'd probably have hated the affair. I certainly don't like what it did to Scott's character in the eyes of casual or lapsed fans, or that Jean was sidelined if Marvel thought that was a prerequisite for their plans.
The only other work of note by Morrison at Marvel was the eponymous Marvel Boy mini-series; I almost picked it up years ago from a used bookstore, but couldn't afford any more impulse buys. JG Jones was the artist, and I liked their work together in Final Crisis, but I couldn't tell you if Marvel Boy is any good or not.
Does it need doing?
Yes.
Then it will be done.
Yeah, in that case, don't read the book anytime soon; it was just that our talk of trying soda reminded me of that scene.
I make sure to save money and have budgets, but sometimes I can't help but go a little overboard. And Marvel is actually reprinting many of their X-Men omnis, so I just have to get them, it's out of my hands.
I was only 20 or so feet away from him when he fell. On instinct you wanna check on the guy, but you have to make sure it's safe to approach first; he tried to get up but we told him to wait, we gotta make sure he isn't seriously injured. Thankfully he was about as okay as could be expected; just goes to show how important safety inspections are.
It's a shame.
This squares with me.
Have Jean and Ororo spent much time together in this era?
I agree about the love point: I don't think there was any love between Scott and Emma during Morrison's run. And with Jean around, it would have been much harder to make their relationship work, but I think it could've been interesting.
To the point about Magneto, I agree that his bowing was too much; I would simply have had him offer a nod of his head, or the good old offer of a handshake. And there were definitely times where the narrative got a little sycophantic - I've defended Scott because I've felt his detractors aren't usually interested in context, but I'm not blind to the flaws of the Utopia Era.
I guess I'll have to watch it to see for myself, describing a sport can only do so much.
Thanks, I definitely think about that regularly. I want to try to get them to read more often, and spend time not glued to a computer or cellphone screen. Exceptions must be made for X-Men cartoons of course.
Yeah, X-Men Evolution is great, and I'll be watching it for the first time in years with my nieces and nephew.
Does it need doing?
Yes.
Then it will be done.
Yeah, I'm right there with you, I guess I just meant that there's quite a bit of change going on in society and we aren't all on the same page yet.
That's funny to think about. I wonder what other odd or silly things we could come up with?
Adaptability is very important, although funny enough, I sometimes find sudden plans more stressful than plans that have fallen through or aren't working out. Oh, and I keep a bag with a few items (first-aid kit, spare clothes, some hygiene products, etc) that I might need in my car.
Hit it!
Yeah, we've brought this up a few times: there's a door right there, and the creatives have already said they've got a "put the toys back" mentality.
If I've said it once, I've said it a million times: I want the X-Books to work towards integration between human and mutantkind. That's the story I want to see.
Does it need doing?
Yes.
Then it will be done.
I appreciate the tip. Thanks. :)
That’s also why we save money, right? :)
Oh, I hadn’t even consider that. But indeed, not giving in to the instinct of rushing to help must be really hard. Besides, spine and neck injuries often happen after the accident. That’s why the recommendation is not to move the person and wait for the paramedics whenever possible.
Nope. Ororo was there for the weird ritual of we-just-resurrected-you-and-though-you’re-sticky-and-naked-say-your-name-so-we-can-all-cheer-you-like-the-weird-cult-we-are. Then there was the rehearsal of Morrison’s silent issue but, this time, Jean and Emma got into Ororo’s mind. After that, Jean comforts her a bit. And then Ororo is with the group drinking tea and playing pool/snooker in the Summer House. They don’t interact in Planet-Size, so other than a few cameos together in the Hellfire Gala and some QC scenes (where they’re basically working), I think those were the only comics in which they appeared together.
Very few interactions as friends, though.
But then again, after X-Men: Red, I’d expect Jean to be closer to Laura and Gaby too. She also didn’t interact with Trinary and most of her old friends. She had family dinners, but didn’t really interact with Rachel either, so…
Add that to her behaviour in the X-Force and you’ll probably get why I call her zombie Jean.
I don’t think even (pre-Inferno) Claremont would make Scott and Emma work, after Morrison’s run, if Jean was still alive. It would feel forced, like any relationship he tried to put Scott in felt forced. And that was a writer who actually took some time to develop relationships.
But then again, forcing stuff down the reader’s throat never stopped any Marvel writer, so it could have been done.
As for Utopia, you used the perfect word: “sycophantic”. Like I said, I’m okay-ish with Scott’s portrayal and even the stuff he was doing, because when I read this character in the context of his continuity, it makes sense. What annoys me about Utopia is the usage of all the other characters around him, adoring him like a saviour, supporting him no matter what… basically, serving as mouth-pieces of the writers who are telling us how we’re supposed to feel about their story.
And because of that, I can see a bright side on Jean’s being dead.
Yeah. It might not be for you either.
Do they have to read for school?
The book assignments I got almost turned me off of reading altogether. The selection was so bad. Fortunately, once I bought a book on my own and I decided to read it. And I loved it. And from there I bought others and read some we had in the house too.
As I got older the book assignment for school became classic literature and I liked most of them.
One day, if I even get to meet my niece (stupid pandemic), I’ll ask her parents if I can take her to a book shop, let her choose a book she’d like to read and buy it for her. Then we can go to a toy shop. :)
That’s for sure.
All it takes is respect. But just because it’s simple, it doesn’t mean it’s easy…
One that has bugged me for a long time: how can Logan have *any* wrist flexibility when he pops his claws? The claws aren't flexible at all and they’re too long to fit along the metacarpal bones. Besides, they’re normally drawn as nested along the radius and the ulna, right?
If so, when the claws are out, they have to be extended out enough so they become anchored in the hands instead, otherwise he can’t have any wrists flexibility. All right, so they’re on the hands now, right? But unlike other bones, they are completely out of the place where they rest and there’s *nothing* but retracting muscles (and maybe very long ligaments) attached to them. Even the metacarpals, the bones that would be around them at this position, move too much to stabilize the claws (that’s why you can make a shell shape with your hand and drink water) . That means that those claws should actually be very wobbly, not to mention that they should burst out of his skin every time he slashes against anything harder than it - the skin heals, but is not made out of adamantium: it tears if enough force is applied on it.
For the claws to be anchored well, you’d need to have extra bones (well secured in place by very strong tendons and muscles) that would work as a tunnel where the claws would go through and theirs ends would lock. But those would have to be in the forearm (and rotate with the bones there), which takes us back to no wrist flexibility.
That doesn’t surprise me at all. :D
Before the pandemic, I didn’t use to make a list for the supermarket because we often bought more or less the same stuff. But if I was shopping for a party or a special dinner, then I’d make a list and I’d order it according to the natural route of the super market.
Now, that’s not to say that I couldn’t take a leisure stroll to the supermarket where you’re relaxed and you figure out what to buy once you’re there. It can be part of the date and it can be fun too.
But if I’m on a mission, I’m on a mission! :D
Taking into consideration that I’m a Scott Summers fan, does that surprise you at all? :D
"Oh? For love of the X-men, you sacrificed your life. For love of me, you resurrected yourself. For love of the whole universe, you almost died a second time to save it. Know nothing of love?! Jean, you are love!"
Be still, my heart! :D
Meaning that they’ll fix this mess when they’re done playing?
Me too… At least one group should be working on integration… Should we send MLK’s “Love your Enemies” speech to them? Do you think it might be more eloquent than we can be? :D
“But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them that despitefully use you(…) And over the centuries, many persons have argued that this is an extremely difficult command. (…) But far from being an impractical idealist, Jesus has become the practical realist. The words of this text glitter in our eyes with a new urgency. Far from being the pious injunction of a utopian dreamer, this command is an absolute necessity for the survival of our civilization. Yes, it is love that will save our world and our civilization, love even for enemies.”
If a mutant nation is ever to succeed, co-existence has to be achieved before the nation can be successful. The “mutant nation” dream is even more impractical than co-existence. And it’s amazing that no mutant has figure it out yet.
When I read X-Men: Red, I thought Jean had figured it out. But zombie Jean forgot about that for… reasons…
Last edited by Grinning Soul; 07-19-2021 at 02:00 AM.
Even though it is set post Dark Phoenix, I really enjoyed the Scott/Jean content in the X-Men anime. They are pretty much the only canon comic book couple that I care about staying together. I also like them in the movies (especially the alternate timeline ones), X-Men: TAS, and X-Men Evolution. They were also sweet in X-Men Legends together.
Also, Grant Morrison is nonbinary and uses they/them pronouns.
I'm a Jott fan...and I love the Morrison run and his take on the state of their relationship back then.
Couples go through relationship issues and drama. X-Comics, as canonically written, are fraught with soap opera-relationship melodramatics...with Jott being the epitome of that. Emma coming was a very interesting twist...though I only read any of it in Whedon's AXM and none of it during the Fraction UXM...I liked it. Now seventeen years later, Jean and Scott are back together. That's comics. I'm here to read Duggan's version of the relationship irrespective of how and what the previous authors wrote.
Lord Ewing *Praise His name! Uplift Him in song!* Your divine works will be remembered and glorified in worship for all eternity. Amen!
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I have no problem with that, Devaishwarya. :)
It's not just about Scott and Jean's relationship, though. It's about comics in general.
I actually admire people who can dissociate current runs from previous and enjoy what's good about them regardless of contradictions and whatnot. Who am I to tell them that they are wrong and they're not suppose to enjoy something they like?
But I confess it's really annoying when I'm told that I'm wrong for caring about continuity. If I can accept that some people don't mind not having the consistency I'd like to see in the books, why can't they extend the same courtesy?
You know what I mean?
Absolutely G-Soul...100 %
Regardless of what anyone says in these threads... you do you. Nobody gets a say in how you read and enjoy your comics. No. Body!
While I can and do separate current runs from the previous...I am still always mindful of what I've read before...and how other writers have written them in the ongoing continuity.
Do I like/love everything that was written? No. But I don't hate or find great fault with the ones I didn't, either. It's just different writers selectively drawing from what came before and taking it further and adding their own spin.
I wouldn't expect Duggan to go back and read every written appearance of Jott to be able to write them as a couple who love each other and with shared goals. Because Duggan may have his own ideas about how that would look and read regardless of what Claremont and Byrne established. Would I LOVE everything he brings to Jott in his X-Men...I'll see...but I'm not here to read Duggan's version of what Claremont and Byrne, Louise Simonson or Morrison have written. If I wanted that...I'll just go back and read those runs/eras.
Last edited by Devaishwarya; 07-19-2021 at 10:16 AM.
Lord Ewing *Praise His name! Uplift Him in song!* Your divine works will be remembered and glorified in worship for all eternity. Amen!
Yeah, I'm not one of those continuity fanatics that obsess about the smallest details. I really don't expect Duggan to have read everything and, even if he had read it, he probably wouldn't remember some details or stories. I mean, I certainly haven't read everything and I don't remember everything I've read either. It would be hypocritical of me.
For me, it's more important that the overal feel of the characters is there, that they are easily recognizable.
Scott and Jean in particular haven't been in a book together in a loooooong time, especially if you consider they barely interacted during Morrison's run. So I'd love to see again some elements that were very common for them: talking to each other about problems and/or doubts and/or plans and/or dreams, being affectinate, fighting holding hands, etc...
I understand it's a group book so I don't expect seeing something meaningful between them every issue. Not even in the 90s that would happen. But I love them together and just a little something like their walking holding hands as they move around the treehouse (like we had last issue) would already make me happy.
Like I said before: I'm happy they're together and I want to enjoy while it lasts.
It's early to judge Duggan's portrayal of their relationship (especially because he didn't use Jean much in Cable), but I've liked what I've seen so far and I hope it keeps getting better and we get to share many new panels of their iconic love here. :)
Yupp.
I'm hoping for familiar but also new and interesting.
Lord Ewing *Praise His name! Uplift Him in song!* Your divine works will be remembered and glorified in worship for all eternity. Amen!
It's the first time they're co-leading a team and I'd love for the team itself to evolve into a bigger enterprise, something that has to do with the dreams for their lives and their roles as X-Men. I wrote this here recently: they were supposed to be the heirs of Xavier's dream. Krakoa is still his dream, just different.
I'd love to see Scott and Jean taking charge of their own destinies, finding their own paths and leading people who are like-minded.
That would be really interesting to me and it would be, in my opinion, worthy of the gravitas of those two characters. Especially, if it would feel like a natural progression of what they've lived so far (that aspect of continuity that I love).