Falcon And Winter Soldier

[Killerbee911]

But Walker is clearly a sociopath stand in for murderous police when he kills a terrorist who moments before killed his friend and was trying to kill him.

I wish people would stop bring up bad things being ignored as if it excuses other bad things , Would you accept someone go into court and go "Judge I saw men raping that woman and they got away it, Therefore I should get away with as well". No all of those other bad things you mention should be ridicule too because people didn't do it then does not make it right now. Killing people surrendering is wrong, killing people surrendering being wrong doesn't change because one got less attention.

We have the full context Walkers actions before, We see Walker slowing losing it. We have context walker action after, He tried to kill Falcon and Bucky for trying to take the shield back from him and his lack of remorse in court. You are right it is interesting about Walker but how people are missing show clear coding and running with Walker actions as being right.

[steel_atlas]

I wish people would stop bring up bad things being ignored as if it excuses other bad things , Would you accept someone go into court and go "Judge I saw men raping that woman and they got away it, Therefore I should get away with as well". No all of those other bad things you mention should be ridicule too because people didn't do it then does not make it right now. Killing people surrendering is wrong, killing people surrendering being wrong doesn't change because one got less attention.

We have the full context Walkers actions before, We see Walker slowing losing it. We have context walker action after, He tried to kill Falcon and Bucky for trying to take the shield back from him and his lack of remorse in court. You are right it is interesting about Walker but how people are missing show clear coding and running with Walker actions as being right.

You cut out my points and focused on what you want to.

No one judges the GIs in Saving Private Ryan rightly because they understand the context.

There werent articles on collided about how the rebels in Rogue 1 were killing defenseless Stormtroopers.

[Frontier]

I've always been curious/uncomfortable with droids and their (lack of) rights. And as far as I know, at no point in Star Wars history has droid rights ever been a major issue; not the Old Republic, nor the New, certainly not the Empire. Maybe I just missed it?

The last Alphabet Squadron novel featured a planet of Droids that had rebelled and taken it over.

[Killerbee911]

You cut out my points and focused on what you want to.

No one judges the GIs in Saving Private Ryan rightly because they understand the context.

There werent articles on collided about how the rebels in Rogue 1 were killing defenseless Stormtroopers.

A war crime is a war crime, It does not change because you didn't see anyone complaining about it to level of F&WS. Also there isn't rightful understand context of the scene because the two surrendering soldiers where saying

"“Please don't shoot me! I am not German, I am Czech, I didn't kill anyone! I am Czech!".

So no most of the audience didn't have proper context because they don't speak Czech so scene that was kinda distasteful to the audience but the audience could do mental gymnastics hey those guys were German soldiers aka the evil empire who just got killed. Is actually worse than they realize because two men were Czech forced to go out there and where innocent men.



Nobody watches that scene and goes that is fine and I am pretty sure now that I am give them full context of the scene they find it extremely distasteful actions done in the scene. Your point is people didn't complain as loud about a wrong thing some how makes the wrong thing okay. No all the things from Saving Private Ryan, Rogue One and F&WS are all wrong.

[Confuzzled]

Those Stormtroopers would have become a danger to the Rebels and their plan in Rogue One pretty soon even if they were defenseless in that one moment so I don't think that exactly fits with the rest of these examples. Unlike Walker, the Rebels were on a do or die mission. Walker killed Nico out of pure anger and revenge. The Stormtroopers could have screwed up the Rebels' plans which they couldn't afford at all. These two things aren't the same.

[MindofShadow]

But Walker is clearly a sociopath stand in for murderous police when he kills a terrorist who moments before killed his friend and was trying to kill him.

Karli killed him. Not that dude.

It was stupid to kill thta dude all around. Taking him into custody and interrogating him would have been so much more useful.

If he wanted "justice" for lemar, then takig him in so he could find Karli would have been much more beneficial.

Instead, he snapped. Partly because of the serum, and partly, I imagine, they took a guy with three medal of honor (aka he's seen some ****) who may or may not done some dirty things in the sandbox (lemar conversation) and then put a bunch of pressure on him by naming him captian america... and then he took a serum which can make you mentally unstable.

and his punishment for executing a bad guy was... he lost his job. Not too bad really lol. Former medal of honor winner who was Captain America? dude would be hired by a military contractor in 4 minutes lol.

no one got mad that he shot thatone flagsmasher in the head when he rescued Bucky. But surrendering is a whole other thing. Even in war, you aren't supposed to blow away surrendering troops.

[Clea]

Karli killed him. Not that dude.

It was stupid to kill thta dude all around. Taking him into custody and interrogating him would have been so much more useful.

If he wanted "justice" for lemar, then takig him in so he could find Karli would have been much more beneficial.

Instead, he snapped. Partly because of the serum, and partly, I imagine, they took a guy with three medal of honor (aka he's seen some ****) who may or may not done some dirty things in the sandbox (lemar conversation) and then put a bunch of pressure on him by naming him captian america... and then he took a serum which can make you mentally unstable.

and his punishment for executing a bad guy was... he lost his job. Not too bad really lol. Former medal of honor winner who was Captain America? dude would be hired by a military contractor in 4 minutes lol.

no one got mad that he shot thatone flagsmasher in the head when he rescued Bucky. But surrendering is a whole other thing. Even in war, you aren't supposed to blow away surrendering troops.

Back in the Captain America movie, Dr. Erskine told Steve Rogers that the serum amplifies everything that is already in the man. A good man becomes great. A bad man becomes worse. He also made Rogers promise to always stay who he was. "Not a perfect solder, but a good man."

In some ways I feel sorry for John Walker. He's obviously tried to be a perfect soldier, but at the cost of being a good man. Or maybe he never really was a good man to start with, he was just a good soldier. He seemed more interesting in just getting the job done, even if that meant fighting dirty and doing questionable things. He didn't take the super soldier serum to fight for justice, he took it because he was furious and wanted revenge against the terrorists who killed his partner. He still doesn't seem to understand why people are ticked off about what he did. It seems that his idea of being a 'perfect soldier' means that it's perfectly acceptable to murder anyone with an overwhelming display of force whenever he thinks it's justified. His superiors also seemed to have questionable motives, too. I got the feeling that they busted him because he embarrassed them and messed up their PR campaign, not because he murdered someone.

[Chris0013]

Back in the Captain America movie, Dr. Erskine told Steve Rogers that the serum amplifies everything that is already in the man. A good man becomes great. A bad man becomes worse. He also made Rogers promise to always stay who he was. "Not a perfect solder, but a good man."

In some ways I feel sorry for John Walker. He's obviously tried to be a perfect soldier, but at the cost of being a good man. Or maybe he never really was a good man to start with, he was just a good soldier. He seemed more interesting in just getting the job done, even if that meant fighting dirty and doing questionable things. He didn't take the super soldier serum to fight for justice, he took it because he was furious and wanted revenge against the terrorists who killed his partner. He still doesn't seem to understand why people are ticked off about what he did. It seems that his idea of being a 'perfect soldier' means that it's perfectly acceptable to murder anyone with an overwhelming display of force whenever he thinks it's justified. His superiors also seemed to have questionable motives, too. I got the feeling that they busted him because he embarrassed them and messed up their PR campaign, not because he murdered someone.

He took the serum before that happened. I don't think he took the serum for selfish reasons at all. He took it to better perform his duties and New Cap.

I think something missing from the last episode is public reaction...yes there are going to be those who feel John was wrong to shwack the guy the way he did....but others are going to support him.

[Clea]

He took the serum before that happened. I don't think he took the serum for selfish reasons at all. He took it to better perform his duties and New Cap.

I think something missing from the last episode is public reaction...yes there are going to be those who feel John was wrong to shwack the guy the way he did....but others are going to support him.

Good point about the timing of when he took the serum. I still think that killing that terrorist was purely an act of anger and revenge, not justice.

[MindofShadow]

He took the serum before that happened. I don't think he took the serum for selfish reasons at all. He took it to better perform his duties and New Cap.

Yup.

Which wasn't entirely his fault. The got thrown into Captain America duties and then sent to deal with people who were all bigger, stronger, and faster than him. He had no chance at all at succeeding.

then he got his ego crushed by getting his ass kicked by Doras and it pushed him to find a way to win.

[Clea]

Yup.

Which wasn't entirely his fault. The got thrown into Captain America duties and then sent to deal with people who were all bigger, stronger, and faster than him. He had no chance at all at succeeding.

then he got his ego crushed by getting his ass kicked by Doras and it pushed him to find a way to win.

And he still doesn't understand why he lost his Captain America gig. He thinks he was just doing his job, or at least that's what he's convinced himself to justify murdering someone.

[Chris0013]

Now for an interlude...
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[Frontier]

Yup.

Which wasn't entirely his fault. The got thrown into Captain America duties and then sent to deal with people who were all bigger, stronger, and faster than him. He had no chance at all at succeeding.

then he got his ego crushed by getting his ass kicked by Doras and it pushed him to find a way to win.

"They weren't even Super Soldiers."

Walker's had a rough few days.

[Chris0013]

I seem to remember Karli talking about 'getting kicked out of her home' after everyone came back....

But that raises a question for me.

Was she kicked out of her home that was hers since before the snap....or was she given a home after Thanos's snap that belongd to someone else and when that someone else came back she was kicked out so the original homeowner got his home back??

[MindofShadow]

I seem to remember Karli talking about 'getting kicked out of her home' after everyone came back....

But that raises a question for me.

Was she kicked out of her home that was hers since before the snap....or was she given a home after Thanos's snap that belongd to someone else and when that someone else came back she was kicked out so the original homeowner got his home back??

I think it was the second thing.

The whole point of flag smashers was that, after half the world disapeared... countries openly welcomed "undesirables" and refugees and stuff to help rebuild and occupy places.

So, a bunch of people who had nothing and were looked down upon finally had homes, communities, ect.

Then, magically, everyone came back, and the governments told these people to GTFO and go back to where they came from basically.

the GRC right now is meeting to put these people in camps or whatever.

You can see both sides of it, which makes fo ra healthy debate on WTF to do, but it is definitely being framed as "government/GRC bad..." which is probably why they had karli blow up a building just to make sure we knew she was bad lol