Falcon and The Winter Soldier

[CosmiComic]

Ironically Tony got better villians once he stopped getting solo films.

Ultron, Zemo, Vulture and Mysterio all have cool aspects that the actual Iron Man villians should have. Change the last two character's gimmicks and you could've had them be the villians for Im2 and 3.

Fun fact- Thanos popped up in an Iron Man comic. So did Drax.

Haha, yeah, I've read that issue. My main point was more that Marvel Comics could've made IM's and other Avengers' as well as Spider-Man's, yet didn't. IMO one hero doesn't need to hog all the cool bad guys. Honestly, Green Goblin and Dr. Octopus could easily work as Iron man villains better Spider-Man ones.

But I digress. Most of those villains were bigger than the ones in the Iron man films, so maybe the screenwriters didn't have much to work with.

[Agent Z]

Malcolm Spellman on Lemar Hoskins's death.

According to showrunner/head writer Malcolm Spellman, the creative team was well aware of the murky territory it was wandering into with its characterization of Lemar. In a recent interview on the Fade to Black podcast, Spellman explained why, as he sees it, there was no real way to get Walker to where they wanted the character in the show without killing Lemar, despite the fact that doing that played into the very trope it’s meant to be pushing back against.

“From the movies I saw all from the beginning of the ‘80s all the way through now, the purpose of the Black character was either magical negro whose job is to service a white character, and once that white character has gone on their journey, the magical negro disappears,” Spellman said. “Or, the Black guy or girl, but 99% of the time, guy, who’s there to get killed somewhere near the end of act two.”

In Spellman’s view, The Falcon and the Winter Soldier was in the clear to kill off Lemar because “we earned it by telling all these other stories with heart,”

https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-falcon-a...-to-1846772211

[CosmiComic]

So they knew it was potentially problematic

[j9ac9k]

The writers also ended up dropping the ball on the female characters on this show, leaving them the least developed. (some would even say Sharon and Karli didn't even make sense)

[Killerbee911]

The writers also ended up dropping the ball on the female characters on this show, leaving them the least developed. (some would even say Sharon and Karli didn't even make sense)

Karli got lots development it was just bad. They clearly wanted her to be sympathetic but show need her to be a straight bad guy and they keep trying to skirt the line. And it didn't work she didn't need to be sympathetic just right in her cause. Yes they did drop the ball with her. Sharon by nature of storyline was never going to be developed because her being the power broker was supposed to be a big surprise. One simple flash back with what happened to her during the snap would have solve most of the issues but that wasn't purpose of the show. She was small piece and they had big pieces with Falcon, Bucky, Walker and Karli to tell.

[j9ac9k]

Karli got lots development it was just bad...Sharon by nature of storyline was never going to be developed because her being the power broker was supposed to be a big surprise. One simple flash back with what happened to her during the snap would have solve most of the issues....

It's a fine distinction, but in my mind the reasons you cite for it being bad is due to her being under developed, in that she became a device in service of the plot or Sam's development, but did not coalesce into a character that felt real.

And with Sharon, though she wasn't one of the leads, you say yourself that one flashback could have fixed the issues with her character. All characters on a show should make sense regardless of how important they are - and Sharon wasn't a bit player. I am hopeful we'll see her further developed down the line though.

[silvercover]

speaking of sharon, gotta give props to MCU for having one of the most misleading promos in comparison to the actual show/movie for this one. the trailers as well as that time you had kevin feige talk about the upcoming movies and shows, they painted zemo as being a villain while sharon is with the good guys, only for zemo to mostly end up being an ally and his only bad acts were essentially killing dangerous individuals anyway, whilst sharon was technically an ally but was making moves in the background for her own benefit. they also showed almost nothing about walker, you would have to be someone who knows comics or go to places where people discuss and analyze what the MCU is doing to know that there's that kind of character that will be in the show.

[CosmiComic]

Do you think she'll be a full-on villain from now on, or just a questionable anti-hero

[Frontier]

Malcolm Spellman on Lemar Hoskins's death.



https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-falcon-a...-to-1846772211

Did they need to kill him, though? I think I remember Lemar getting seriously injured during Walker's time as Cap in the comics, although it was Walker's parents death that threw him over the edge.

I mean, they didn't need to kill off Rhodey in Civil War to set Tony off, it just built up to it.

The writers also ended up dropping the ball on the female characters on this show, leaving them the least developed. (some would even say Sharon and Karli didn't even make sense)

Yeah, I liked Sara but she was mostly there to support Sam, and Walker's wife got, like, only two or three lines in the whole show.

[j9ac9k]

Yeah, I liked Sara but she was mostly there to support Sam, and Walker's wife got, like, only two or three lines in the whole show.

Yeah, this show is definitely more "Brothers before females." Even Zemo was more relevant. The main ladies on the show were mostly bad - either liars, killers or just mean with their pointy sticks making the boys feel bad by beating them up.

Speaking of Sara and her kids, remember the whole "Superheroes wear masks to protect the people they love" staple of the genre that has gone out the window for the MCU? I wonder if we'll see any repercussions of Sam's public identity for his family. I don't imagine we'll see it in any movies, but if there's another season of this show, I'd expect something.

[Immortal Weapon]

Yeah, this show is definitely more "Brothers before females." Even Zemo was more relevant. The main ladies on the show were mostly bad - either liars, killers or just mean with their pointy sticks making the boys feel bad by beating them up.

Speaking of Sara and her kids, remember the whole "Superheroes wear masks to protect the people they love" staple of the genre that has gone out the window for the MCU? I wonder if we'll see any repercussions of Sam's public identity for his family. I don't imagine we'll see it in any movies, but if there's another season of this show, I'd expect something.

I for one like the fact that the secret identity trope is dead in the MCU. It only serves to create forced melodrama and a bunch of contrivance to keep it going. Even if the whole world doesn't know a guy's identity their inner circle definitely should.

[Rincewind]

I for one like the fact that the secret identity trope is dead in the MCU. It only serves to create forced melodrama and a bunch of contrivance to keep it going. Even if the whole world doesn't know a guy's identity their inner circle definitely should.

I agree. The trope is overused in comics for those very reasons. Glad the live action MCU is minimizing the use of secret identities.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I agree. The trope is overused in comics for those very reasons. Glad the live action MCU is minimizing the use of secret identities.

I think it's more used sparingly, where it makes logical sense.

Sam was in the military before meeting Cap, was a fugitive for years, etc. No way he could really keep a secret ID.

I just hope we do away with the whole 'hero gets blamed for villain attacking family', if the family gets threatened

[PCN24454]

I for one like the fact that the secret identity trope is dead in the MCU. It only serves to create forced melodrama and a bunch of contrivance to keep it going. Even if the whole world doesn't know a guy's identity their inner circle definitely should.

Most characters don't have an inner circle that aren't super in some way, so that kinda hurts your point.

[Immortal Weapon]

Most characters don't have an inner circle that aren't super in some way, so that kinda hurts your point.

Who? Foggy and Karen know Matt is Daredevil for instance. The closest people to Danny are the ones who know about the Iron Fist and K'un-L'un. Aunt May, Ned and MJ know about Peter being Spider-Man.