Falcon and The Winter Soldier

[CosmiComic]

You're pretty much saying that unless it's an absolute tank or a god-tier character than Spider-Man can take them...and yet making it seem dismissive.

I don't mean to be dismissive of him, but most of those Avengers have powers which I think could negate Spider-Man's. He's smart, so he could possibly defeat them, but I think they're equally capable of taking him out. Although characters like Dr. Strange and Scarlet Witch aren't as physically durable as he is

[josai21]

Tony basically said to peter that if Cap had wanted him dead, he would be.

I think that's a reference to the fact that Cap has the strength and speed and experience necessary to take down peter. Sam has the experience, but not the strength or speed. Bucky might have enough of all three if you have him prepared to fight Peter, but my money's on Peter.

An experienced Spider-man in the MCU will likely be able one of the most powerful avengers second only to the reality benders or Captain Marvel.

Speaking purely MCU here obviously.

[Killerbee911]

I don't mean to be dismissive of him, but most of those Avengers have powers which I think could negate Spider-Man's. He's smart, so he could possibly defeat them, but I think they're equally capable of taking him out. Although characters like Dr. Strange and Scarlet Witch aren't as physically durable as he is

Other than Thor,Hulk,Cap Marvel, and Vision. Spiderman has the possibility of beating just about everyone else. Spiderman is a combat precog with good range abilities which great mix but this Winter Solider and Falcon thread no make it a versus thread.

On topic the director of the show says in this upcoming episode they are introducing a Marvel character that has been seen before and is important with a hint they should be good friends with Thor.

[CosmiComic]

Tony basically said to peter that if Cap had wanted him dead, he would be.

I think that's a reference to the fact that Cap has the strength and speed and experience necessary to take down peter. Sam has the experience, but not the strength or speed. Bucky might have enough of all three if you have him prepared to fight Peter, but my money's on Peter.

An experienced Spider-man in the MCU will likely be able one of the most powerful avengers second only to the reality benders or Captain Marvel.

Speaking purely MCU here obviously.

I think MCU Spider-Man appears weaker because he's younger, but I suspect he'll show his real strength as he evolves, possible in NWH

[CosmiComic]

Other than Thor,Hulk,Cap Marvel, and Vision. Spiderman has the possibility of beating just about everyone else. Spiderman is a combat precog with good range abilities which great mix but this Winter Solider and Falcon thread no make it a versus thread.

On topic the director of the show says in this upcoming episode they are introducing a Marvel character that has been seen before and is important with a hint they should be good friends with Thor.

Yeah, I won't derail the thread further, so I'll go back to topic. I'll just say, I think most of those Avengers have ways of defeating Spider-Man

[Kieran_Frost]

Question (but trying to avoid spoilers). Really loved WandaVision, tried the first episode of this and... my god, I thought it was terrible. Does it get better, or if I didn't like episode one, is it just more of the same?

[G. Boney]

Spider-man in the comics is stronger than cap or anyone with a super soldier serum. He supposedly when ranked can lift 10 tons which puts him in Luke cage territory in the comics.

Nah, Cage can lift much more than 10 tons. These days, anyway. Back when I was a kid he was ranked in the 3 ton range according to marvel handbooks. I'm glad he's been upgraded over the years, I always thought it was stupid that a guy named Power Man was so low powered. The guy named after a bug was stronger than him lol.

[Lunawolf]

Question (but trying to avoid spoilers). Really loved WandaVision, tried the first episode of this and... my god, I thought it was terrible. Does it get better, or if I didn't like episode one, is it just more of the same?

Episode 1 is basicly the first half of act 1 if you look at it from a movie standpoint, would watch episode 2 and decide on that.
Does it get better? Depends what you are looking for, the story moves forward, more characters get introduced.

For me the weakness of the show is the story, but that can change by the end of the season, how wel they wrap everything up, sticking the landing.

[80sbaby]

Question (but trying to avoid spoilers). Really loved WandaVision, tried the first episode of this and... my god, I thought it was terrible. Does it get better, or if I didn't like episode one, is it just more of the same?

It's more of the same. What didn't you like about it?

[inisideguy]

Nah, Cage can lift much more than 10 tons. These days, anyway. Back when I was a kid he was ranked in the 3 ton range according to marvel handbooks. I'm glad he's been upgraded over the years, I always thought it was stupid that a guy named Power Man was so low powered. The guy named after a bug was stronger than him lol.

Oh is he stronger than that now? Ok you know now that you mention it I do remember the 3 ton thing to. I mean 3 ton is nothing to sneeze at. And he was a street level hero which was more than enough to deal with most threats.

[godisawesome]

Question (but trying to avoid spoilers). Really loved WandaVision, tried the first episode of this and... my god, I thought it was terrible. Does it get better, or if I didn't like episode one, is it just more of the same?

As others have said, it depends on what your problems with episode one was.

If, for instance, it was the pacing and civilian life aspect, those aren’t nearly as prevalent in the next episodes, as the action ratchets up and the chemistry between Sam and Bucky takes center stage over their “home life” struggles. Plus, that’s when “NuCap” enters the story and starts adding in significantly more layers and tension, and before Zemo does as well.

[Kieran_Frost]

It's more of the same.

Ah. Good to know, thank-you. I'll skip it then. Bring on Loki, whoop whoop!

What didn't you like about it?

Oh my goodness, pretty much everything. I felt both characters were completely different from who we met in the films. Falcon's entire 'we have no money' was incredibly unbelievable, both from the bank point-of-view and the fact he knows multiple billionaires. We're supposed to believe Pepper wouldn't give him $15,000 of her trillion dollar fortune? Winter Soldier was imbued with toxic masculinity meets emo teenager; that entire psychiatrist scene was... beyond lazy writing and incredibly cliche. It made me not root for such a whiney brat. In an attempt to make Falcon 'kewl' they have him murder multiple people at the start, and so much of that dialogue... basic action writing 101, ughhh. Shoving in characters we've never met then putting them in scenarios where they are in danger is NOT how you make us care for them, nor root for them. And I loath lazy exposition "like the time in Washington... ha, remember that time in New Guinea... oh yeah, like that time in Moscow." Ugh. You're Marvel, hire better writers. OH AND THE CLIFFHANGER. Big dramatic build up. Ominous music. "I don't want nor will accept this job (even though that whole moment in Endgame implied I would, so it makes it pointless, bet let's just skip over that a second)..." big dramatic music continues. Everyone watching TV. Dramatic dramatic. OH MY GOD!!! This guy we've never met took the job I turned down, CLIFFHANGERRRRRRRRRRR! No. You're not an idiot, you turned down a job, and so they gave that job to someone else. That's what happens with jobs. They don't just never fill it, because you said no. Maybe your financial situation does make more sense, since you're grasp of jobs and what is involved seems non-existent. LOL! And the fact THAT was the cliffhanger took any and all motivation from me to watch anymore.

Literally the only think I liked about it was the Winter Soldier flashback, because it felt like the MCU character.

Episode 1 is basicly the first half of act 1 if you look at it from a movie standpoint, would watch episode 2 and decide on that.
Does it get better? Depends what you are looking for, the story moves forward, more characters get introduced.

Oh. That's sad to hear. What I loved about WandaVision (and these, theoretical, one-season Marvel shows) is doing stuff that couldn't just be a movie, telling stories that really don't fit into a 2 hour segment. Oh well...

[Immortal Weapon]

Ah. Good to know, thank-you. I'll skip it then. Bring on Loki, whoop whoop!


Oh my goodness, pretty much everything. I felt both characters were completely different from who we met in the films. Falcon's entire 'we have no money' was incredibly unbelievable, both from the bank point-of-view and the fact he knows multiple billionaires. We're supposed to believe Pepper wouldn't give him $15,000 of her trillion dollar fortune? Winter Soldier was imbued with toxic masculinity meets emo teenager; that entire psychiatrist scene was... beyond lazy writing and incredibly cliche. It made me not root for such a whiney brat. In an attempt to make Falcon 'kewl' they have him murder multiple people at the start, and so much of that dialogue... basic action writing 101, ughhh. Shoving in characters we've never met then putting them in scenarios where they are in danger is NOT how you make us care for them, nor root for them. And I loath lazy exposition "like the time in Washington... ha, remember that time in New Guinea... oh yeah, like that time in Moscow." Ugh. You're Marvel, hire better writers. OH AND THE CLIFFHANGER. Big dramatic build up. Ominous music. "I don't want nor will accept this job (even though that whole moment in Endgame implied I would, so it makes it pointless, bet let's just skip over that a second)..." big dramatic music continues. Everyone watching TV. Dramatic dramatic. OH MY GOD!!! This guy we've never met took the job I turned down, CLIFFHANGERRRRRRRRRRR! No. You're not an idiot, you turned down a job, and so they gave that job to someone else. That's what happens with jobs. They don't just never fill it, because you said no. Maybe your financial situation does make more sense, since you're grasp of jobs and what is involved seems non-existent. LOL! And the fact THAT was the cliffhanger took any and all motivation from me to watch anymore.

The scene at the bank is the most realistic thing I've seen in the MCU. Financial institutions have been thrown completely out of wack since the the blip and the landscape became extremely competitive. Yea, Falcon saved half the universe but he wasn't paid a single dime the entire time he was an Avenger. I doubt he can just call up Pepper and ask for money because he was never buddies with Tony. Would you give someone who's mostly an acquaintance to you any money? I'm sure Pepper has to deal with her own problems like grieving for Tony to be bothered to be a piggy bank for someone else.

Sam is a soldier. You expect a soldier to go into a combat situation against terrorists and not kill people? That's ridiculous. Especially since he's going into that mission solo. He's gotta take them out before he gets taken out.

What is this toxic masculinity you getting from Bucky?

Sounds you completely missed the point of the cliffhanger if that's how it made you feel.

[80sbaby]

Oh my goodness, pretty much everything. I felt both characters were completely different from who we met in the films. Falcon's entire 'we have no money' was incredibly unbelievable, both from the bank point-of-view and the fact he knows multiple billionaires. We're supposed to believe Pepper wouldn't give him $15,000 of her trillion dollar fortune? Winter Soldier was imbued with toxic masculinity meets emo teenager; that entire psychiatrist scene was... beyond lazy writing and incredibly cliche. It made me not root for such a whiney brat. In an attempt to make Falcon 'kewl' they have him murder multiple people at the start, and so much of that dialogue... basic action writing 101, ughhh. Shoving in characters we've never met then putting them in scenarios where they are in danger is NOT how you make us care for them, nor root for them. And I loath lazy exposition "like the time in Washington... ha, remember that time in New Guinea... oh yeah, like that time in Moscow." Ugh. You're Marvel, hire better writers. OH AND THE CLIFFHANGER. Big dramatic build up. Ominous music. "I don't want nor will accept this job (even though that whole moment in Endgame implied I would, so it makes it pointless, bet let's just skip over that a second)..." big dramatic music continues. Everyone watching TV. Dramatic dramatic. OH MY GOD!!! This guy we've never met took the job I turned down, CLIFFHANGERRRRRRRRRRR! No. You're not an idiot, you turned down a job, and so they gave that job to someone else. That's what happens with jobs. They don't just never fill it, because you said no. Maybe your financial situation does make more sense, since you're grasp of jobs and what is involved seems non-existent. LOL! And the fact THAT was the cliffhanger took any and all motivation from me to watch anymore.

Literally the only think I liked about it was the Winter Soldier flashback, because it felt like the MCU character.

Hmm, I don't think anyone was out of character. Sam has never had an issue with killing people. Did you forget the opening to Civil War? And the money issue makes sense when you factor in Sam's pride. It isn't so much that he can't get someone to help out, it's that he would never ask. I know plenty of people like that. hell, I'm like that! I'll give a friend the shirt off my back and be disappointed if they needed help but didn't ask me. However, me going to them for something similar takes a lot.

As for Bucky, I'm not sure what "toxic masculinity" you're referring to? He's also been pretty emo from the time he came back to his senses in CW. I'm not sure how different you'd expect the psychiatrist scene to go?

Then the idea of Sam not wanting to become Captain America was actually set up in Endgame, hence him feeling like the shield belonged to someone else. It's not like he was gung-ho about becoming the new Cap there.

But yeah, if those are your complaints, then it's probably best to skip this one.

[Username taken]

The scene at the bank is the most realistic thing I've seen in the MCU. Financial institutions have been thrown completely out of wack since the the blip and the landscape became extremely competitive. Yea, Falcon saved half the universe but he wasn't paid a single dime the entire time he was an Avenger. I doubt he can just call up Pepper and ask for money because he was never buddies with Tony. Would you give someone who's mostly an acquaintance to you any money? I'm sure Pepper has to deal with her own problems like grieving for Tony to be bothered to be a piggy bank for someone else.

Sam is a soldier. You expect a soldier to go into a combat situation against terrorists and not kill people? That's ridiculous. Especially since he's going into that mission solo. He's gotta take them out before he gets taken out.

What is this toxic masculinity you getting from Bucky?

Sounds you completely missed the point of the cliffhanger if that's how it made you feel.

Yeah, Falcon was a fugitive because of Iron Man.

He's definitely not asking Pepper for money.

And Sam has killed before in the MCU. It's not something they just introduced.