Better Bromance: Spidey and Daredevil or Spidey and The Human Torch?

[K7P5V]

Over the decades, Spider-Man has had close bonds with a number of heroes for a few issues. He and X-Man Nate Grey were a duo for some issues in the late-90s with Spidey as a kind of mentor/older brother for him, and then during Civil War they made Peter-Tony bromance happen. Peter-Captain America is an off-and-on, the two get on well whenever they appear when written by writers who like both characters (Dematteis, JMS) but otherwise not so much.

And don't forget Deadpool, although that always felt like someone when Marketting caught wind of how popular "SpiderPool" was online and wanted to capitalize on it. lol

Let's also remember the special bond both Spidey & Logan share with one another...

Johnny also helped lead to the invention of bag-man

Correct, Frontier. Definitely a classic (IMHO):

[staptik777]

Neither of them

[Jewel Runner]

Neither of them are especially close to Peter (who can never have truly close male friendships).

It's amazing how wrong that is

[Sutekh]

Who do you think has the better friendship?

Definitely Spidey and Torch. I don't feel like Daredevil does 'bromance.' (And if he did, has stronger relationships with Stick or even Iron Fist, although Iron Fist is definitely bromancing Luke Cage, more than Spider-Man!)

Torch also has bromances with Wyatt Wingfoot, Iceman and Daken, kinda / sorta, and Spidey with Deadpool, Wolverine and, much more rarely, the Prowler.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

A new CBR list has some interesting stuff to say about this.
https://www.cbr.com/marvel-superhero...mics-together/

One thing it points out Daredevil and Spider-Man have appeared in each other's books far more than Iron Man, Hulk. Human Torch isn't on the list.

So hard empirical data settles this debate.

[Frontier]

A new CBR list has some interesting stuff to say about this.
https://www.cbr.com/marvel-superhero...mics-together/

One thing it points out Daredevil and Spider-Man have appeared in each other's books far more than Iron Man, Hulk. Human Torch isn't on the list.

So hard empirical data settles this debate.

Not necessarily. I think actual content matter moreso than just quantity of appearances, and I'd say as far as actual content Peter and Johnny are closer on a personal level than Peter and Matt even if Peter and Matt relate to each other a lot.

[CrimsonEchidna]

Neither of them are especially close to Peter (who can never have truly close male friendships).

That's kind of one of those things where I never put to much thought into but it's more accurate than people would care to admit lol.

Though the entire mythos Peter's closest male friend has consistently been Harry Osborn and it almost always comes with the caveat of him becoming a super villain. Up until Jonah a couple of years ago Peter never willing shared his identity to any of his male civilian friends either.

Even the MCU movie had to straight up lift Ganke Lee, likely because they were self aware that they couldn't do the Harry Osborn story for a third time in a row. lol

[Revolutionary_Jack]

That's kind of one of those things where I never put to much thought into but it's more accurate than people would care to admit lol.

Though the entire mythos Peter's closest male friend has consistently been Harry Osborn and it almost always comes with the caveat of him becoming a super villain. Up until Jonah a couple of years ago Peter never willing shared his identity to any of his male civilian friends either.

Even the MCU movie had to straight up lift Ganke Lee, likely because they were self aware that they couldn't do the Harry Osborn story for a third time in a row. lol

He's a complicated man, and nobody understands him but his women. (Shaft!).

He's always going to be a wife guy at his core.

[Frontier]

I mean, MJ gets him a lot but I don't really see her hanging out and teaming-up with him the way Johnny does. Johnny doesn't get Peter?

That's kind of one of those things where I never put to much thought into but it's more accurate than people would care to admit lol.

Though the entire mythos Peter's closest male friend has consistently been Harry Osborn and it almost always comes with the caveat of him becoming a super villain. Up until Jonah a couple of years ago Peter never willing shared his identity to any of his male civilian friends either.

Even the MCU movie had to straight up lift Ganke Lee, likely because they were self aware that they couldn't do the Harry Osborn story for a third time in a row. lol

There's also Flash when he stops being a bully.

The whole Ganke thing was just the movies being uninspired. There were plenty of characters they could have used in Peter's social circle instead of lifting from Miles.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I mean, MJ gets him a lot but I don't really see her hanging out and teaming-up with him the way Johnny does.

Their couple-y jaunts up ESB, as recently as in Tom Taylor's FNSM#1 proves otherwise.

Johnny doesn't get Peter?

Johnny has some insight into Spider-Man and Peter from the outside, and that's valid and true in the sense that people who don't know you can reveal something about you. This bit here is quite true and insightful about Spider-Man.



But he doesn't really know Peter. Having that remote observation isn't the same as actually knowing someone.

Remember how in Spider-Man/Human Torch, Johnny was really sad and disappointed to find out that Spider-Man never told him his secret identity for ages, and that Reed knew before he did.

There's also Flash when he stops being a bully.

Who Peter never told his identity to either.

I don't think anyone can claim to know Peter or truly be friends with Peter without knowing his identity and being part of his life and understanding where he comes from and why he does what he does. In that respects, neither Harry nor Flash were ever all that close to him. Mary Jane is both his wife, his lover, and his best friend, as he repeatedly called her several times in JMD-Buscema's run.

[Frontier]

Their couple-y jaunts up ESB, as recently as in Tom Taylor's FNSM#1 proves otherwise.

That's entirely different from what I'm talking about.

Johnny has some insight into Spider-Man and Peter from the outside, and that's valid and true in the sense that people who don't know you can reveal something about you. This bit here is quite true and insightful about Spider-Man.



But he doesn't really know Peter. Having that remote observation isn't the same as actually knowing someone.

Remember how in Spider-Man/Human Torch, Johnny was really sad and disappointed to find out that Spider-Man never told him his secret identity for ages, and that Reed knew before he did.

Johnny's been there for most of Spider-Man's development as a hero and he's gotten to know Peter a lot since then.

Who Peter never told his identity to either.

I don't think anyone can claim to know Peter or truly be friends with Peter without knowing his identity and being part of his life and understanding where he comes from and why he does what he does. In that respects, neither Harry nor Flash were ever all that close to him. Mary Jane is both his wife, his lover, and his best friend, as he repeatedly called her several times in JMD-Buscema's run.

But that would invalidate most of his relationships.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

But that would invalidate most of his relationships.

That's Spider-Man.

[Frontier]

That's Spider-Man.

Not really? At least I don't see it that way because Spider-Man is predicated on a balance of relationships and identities, not one being less genuine than the other.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Not really? At least I don't see it that way because Spider-Man is predicated on a balance of relationships and identities, not one being less genuine than the other.

What you say is right but most of the Spider-Man cast know him as Spider-Man (villains, superheroes, Jameson, allies in the force), or as Peter (family, friends, Jameson, and others).

Only a few know both are the same, and the real guy, and only one person really knew both longer than anyone else.

[Frontier]

What you say is right but most of the Spider-Man cast know him as Spider-Man (villains, superheroes, Jameson, allies in the force), or as Peter (family, friends, Jameson, and others).

Only a few know both are the same, and the real guy, and only one person really knew both longer than anyone else.

But both are genuine parts of who Peter Parker is, and if we're talking males Johnny is probably the one who knows both sides best.