Joss Whedon and Avengers: Age of Ultron

[CTTT]

With the recent allegations that came out about his treatment of Buffy stars and allegedly Ray Fisher, I was curious about AOU. Personally, I liked the movie, was pretty enjoyable. Loved seeing Vision and Wanda make their onscreen appearances, James Spader was a great Ultron. A lot that I liked about it. Since his behavior on JL stemmed from his frustration with Avengers 2, what happened with the production or end result that he was dissatisfied with?

[Midvillian1322]

With the recent allegations that came out about his treatment of Buffy stars and allegedly Ray Fisher, I was curious about AOU. Personally, I liked the movie, was pretty enjoyable. Loved seeing Vision and Wanda make their onscreen appearances, James Spader was a great Ultron. A lot that I liked about it. Since his behavior on JL stemmed from his frustration with Avengers 2, what happened with the production or end result that he was dissatisfied with?

Studio interfered a bit from what I understand. And he was under so much stress that it made sick apparently. Nothing came out between him and the actors.

[Coal Tiger]

With the recent allegations that came out about his treatment of Buffy stars and allegedly Ray Fisher, I was curious about AOU. Personally, I liked the movie, was pretty enjoyable. Loved seeing Vision and Wanda make their onscreen appearances, James Spader was a great Ultron. A lot that I liked about it. Since his behavior on JL stemmed from his frustration with Avengers 2, what happened with the production or end result that he was dissatisfied with?

Where are you getting this from?

[Midvillian1322]

Where are you getting this from?

That's Ray Fishers claim. That He took his frustration from AoU out on Justice League .

[AndrewCrossett]

AoU made a crapload of money and, while it wasn't as good as Avengers 1 it was not bad. Certainly nothing for Whedon to feel angry or ashamed of. IIRC his biggest beef was the studio forcing him to put in the lame Thor-in-the-cave scene as a trade off for the scene at Hawkeye's farm... a scene which also earned Whedon the ire of many fans for revealing that Black Widow couldn't have children. (Apparently Joss really doesn't like it when women get pregnant.)

In any case... unless Joss stomped on to the JL scene one day and bellowed "I'm gonna make your lives hell because I'm pissed off about a successful movie I made years ago," Ray Fisher would have precisely no insights into that. Which doesn't surprise me. Fisher is the broken clock that's right twice a day.

[Kirby101]

I am not defending what Whedon did on Buffy or JL, we really don't have the full story but I stand with Carpenter. But I have not heard anything negative about him on Firefly or Avengers.

[The Cool Thatguy]

AoU made a crapload of money and, while it wasn't as good as Avengers 1 it was not bad. Certainly nothing for Whedon to feel angry or ashamed of. IIRC his biggest beef was the studio forcing him to put in the lame Thor-in-the-cave scene as a trade off for the scene at Hawkeye's farm... a scene which also earned Whedon the ire of many fans for revealing that Black Widow couldn't have children. (Apparently Joss really doesn't like it when women get pregnant.)

It was more the general idea that Nat saying that being sterilized made it easier for her to be the killing machine that she was, that people took issue with.

[Castle]

His frustration was more about the direction of the movie. It had nothing to do with his personal life.

By Age of Ultron, the actors were already very established. Sam L Jackson and RDJ were legends at this point, Whedon would never dare try to intimidate them and even new comers like Elizabeth Olsen would be off limits because she has powerful sisters

[Pinsir]

Ironically, it was the movie that fractured Joss 'Two Tones Lighter' Whedon's feminist image. Even though I think a lot of the claims about Black Widow being a monster was miss characterization. Black Widow is a poorly written character in the film though, but she has been in every MCU film I've seen, every movie implies that she is interested in a different guy.

[The Gold Stream]

that house of hawkeye stuff was so corny

[Cyke]

If Whedon did something messed up on the set (and there's no real evidence pointing that way), credit still goes to everyone else who worked their asses off on that film to make it happen despite/in spite of any damage Whedon might have done.

That aside though, AoU was a pretty messy hodge podge all around, and to me among the last of the mediocre-to-bad MCU films. Too much going on. At least it would be a turning point for more consistent quality going forward.

[John Venus]

Nobody on that cast was someone he could mess with and expect to get away with. Except for Aaron Taylor Johnson which, hmmmm.....

According to his wife, Joss mostly messed around with young, inexperienced actresses looking for a big break. Charisma Carpenter fit that mold. ScarJo and E. Olsen don't.

One of the more bizarre stories about Whedon that came out shortly before Charisma Carpenters IG post was that he *really* wanted concept art of Vision's penis. Really pushed for it and it took Fiege, Louis D'Esposito and several Marvel staff to talk him out him.

Whedon is a well known control freak and when he burnt out so did the movie. Russo bros are more collaborative and can adapt to every actors mentality and needs hence they were able to direct three huge films back-to-back.

Whedon's two Avengers films felt like Tony/Banner movies* with BW meant to have a bigger role in the second but Whedon fumbled, first with the bizarre Hulk/Widow romance, the 'monster' line, the polarising farm scene, his defanging of Ultron as a threat, the movie had a lot of problems and was definitely a big missed opportunity.

*I see Avengers 1 & 2 as Tony/Banner movies, Cap3 as an Cap/IM movie, Avengers 3 as an IM/Thor movie and Avengers 4 as Cap/IM movie.

[Frobisher]

Age Of Ultron is definitely the most disjointed feeling MCU film. From opening with the Avengers just back together again with no explanation and Iron Man out of his self-imposed career break from the end of Iron Man 3, to introducing three new Avengers during the story and killing one of them off immediately, to Black Widow and Hulk are suddenly an item, the Avengers are bessies with a pioneering plastic surgeon who disappears again after this story, a self-replicating murder bot is freely rampaging around the globe and no-one seems to care, side-quest advert for Infinity War, Black Widow is a monster because she can't have children, introducing Baron Von Strucker as a major villain and killing him off within ten minutes, Ultron is all daddy-issues all of the time, Korean Tourist Board scene... there's a lot that feels like perverse choices, or strangely disconnected from what came before. But we know know there was the whole creative committee power struggle back then, and now it seems Whedon was in the full swing of his megalomania.

[DebkoX]

It's an ok movie. Nothing majorly special. I really feel that Whedon botched Ultron badly. The trailers depicted him as a ruthless cyborg and then he was dropping comedy lines. I'm also not sure if Spader was the right voice as he just didn't come across as too serious. I liked how they treated the Hulk in that movie but the part where SHIELD came in to save the day was just eh.

It was fun to see the Avengers go international but a lot was just off. It felt very 'cartoony'.

[DebkoX]

His frustration was more about the direction of the movie. It had nothing to do with his personal life.

By Age of Ultron, the actors were already very established. Sam L Jackson and RDJ were legends at this point, Whedon would never dare try to intimidate them and even new comers like Elizabeth Olsen would be off limits because she has powerful sisters

I also feel that Feige and Disney would have put him in his place quick.