Spider-Man 3: No Way Home

[ZeroBG82]

I think the Octavius joke is in the same vein as “Heh he said doodie”. As in it’s just a stupid joke that kids would find funny. It’s definitely not a knee slapper for me (and I didn’t even find that kind of joke funny as a kid).

So none of you guys watch these movies anymore, huh?

Not defending the name joke, it's dumb. And obvious.

But it's also MCU Peter's thing. This is a recurring joke, people. It's a direct reference to the Doctor Strange "Oh we're using our made up names" joke from Infinity War. This isn't some stupid joke for the sake of being stupid, which really just shows a lot of you reaching for anything to try and lampoon the MCU over. This is a recurring, reused element of characterization. It's in exactly the same vein as the "Have you seen this really old movie" jokes from Civil War and Infinity War.

It's still a dumb gag, assuming that it's even in the film and not the result of trailer editing. But character consistency is now being labelled bad writing. You people straight crack me up. What tiny detail will you find to complain about next?

[Frontier]

So none of you guys watch these movies anymore, huh?

Not defending the name joke, it's dumb. And obvious.

But it's also MCU Peter's thing. This is a recurring joke, people. It's a direct reference to the Doctor Strange "Oh we're using our made up names" joke from Infinity War. This isn't some stupid joke for the sake of being stupid, which really just shows a lot of you reaching for anything to try and lampoon the MCU over. This is a recurring, reused element of characterization. It's in exactly the same vein as the "Have you seen this really old movie" jokes from Civil War and Infinity War.

It's still a dumb gag, assuming that it's even in the film and not the result of trailer editing. But character consistency is now being labelled bad writing. You people straight crack me up. What tiny detail will you find to complain about next?

I'm hoping for some good quips this go around for Holland, but I'm not expecting them. Aside from maybe Garfield.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

So none of you guys watch these movies anymore, huh?

It's more important to watch other kinds of movies, to be honest. Have outside frames of reference.

Not defending the name joke, it's dumb. And obvious.

Thank you.

But it's also MCU Peter's thing.

MCU Peter is naive but polite and earnest. Outright making fun of people's names isn't something he's done before. That's a Tony Stark thing, and even there he'd do insulting nicknames rather than outright laugh at people's faces.

[The_Sneezing_Stormtrooper]

So none of you guys watch these movies anymore, huh?

Not defending the name joke, it's dumb. And obvious.

But it's also MCU Peter's thing. This is a recurring joke, people. It's a direct reference to the Doctor Strange "Oh we're using our made up names" joke from Infinity War. This isn't some stupid joke for the sake of being stupid, which really just shows a lot of you reaching for anything to try and lampoon the MCU over. This is a recurring, reused element of characterization. It's in exactly the same vein as the "Have you seen this really old movie" jokes from Civil War and Infinity War.

It's still a dumb gag, assuming that it's even in the film and not the result of trailer editing. But character consistency is now being labelled bad writing. You people straight crack me up. What tiny detail will you find to complain about next?

Was that really a thing that was worth turning into a recurring joke though? Really?

[Lukmendes]

MCU in general, and MCU fans in particular, don't know how to handle "popularity backlash".

Spielberg and Lucas multiple times reflected on the fact that being the biggest thing in pop culture meant that it brought a level of discomfort among people and they decided to face it on the chin, like champs. George Lucas is a famously good sport, helping Mel Brooks out with Spaceballs, and reacting joyfully with the Weird Al parodies, and never using his enormous power on the RLM bad-take factory. Both Lucas and Spielberg enjoyed the Southpark spoofs of them.

Whereas MCU in general cultivates this bubble where anyone who disses them for all kinds of reasons is a "hater". You see it with their thin skins about how anytime a major director expresses reasonable criticisms and worries about the dominance of a single genre at the expense of everything, which you'd think comics folk would be used to since non-superhero comics artists have made that point since the 1950s.

And you see it especially when a joke is obviously bad, and falls flat is defended not on the real world empirical experience of cinema but instead people defend it, and people pointing out is cringe and the fact that the trailer featured it prominently as a big deal are somehow wrong and so on.

To be fair, that's a difference between how the producers, directors or whatever react, compared to how fans react, 'cause Star Wars fans are known for being bitchy too, though, in a different way, since it's joked that to be a Star Wars fan, you have to hate Star Wars lol.

One problem with the MCU is that generally speaking they try and maintain a single house style whereas in 616 comics, after Stan Lee stepped down from active writing he encouraged other writers to come in with different writing styles and approaches and that renewed comics. Like with Spider-Man, the writing is different with Stan Lee as opposed to Conway (much more realistic and nuanced, especially female characters), Roger Stern, JMD and so on. Whereas in the MCU, they aspire to maintain a common "house style" so everyone sounds the same and all characters and movies sound the same and have the same kind of "Whedon Style" mid-2000s humor.

Yeah it's noticeable, I probably only watched like, 5 MCU movies, but they feel like the same thing... It's why I avoid to watching them, unless I'm invited to.

I can understand why they do that, it's safe, people are okay with it and it makes money, so why take the risk?

Of course, to put it more bluntly, they're cowards, but big projects like this are like that, even the so beloved PS4 Spidey goes the coward's route and made that generic as fuck gameplay.

Watch all this dialogue about the "No seriously, what's your real name" scene end up being for nothing when it turns out they really laughing at Electro's goofy ass instead. Or hell, maybe the scenes sequence is flipped and Otto introduces himself as "Dr Octopus" first which leads to the group to laughing it off and than Otto tells his real name.

Or maybe it plays out exactly like the trailer suggests and nobody cares because there's far more interesting stuff to talk about instead once its out.

Man if it could be less cringe and they intentionally edited it to be that way, that's a really moronic decision, trailers are supposed to hype up the product, or at least try to.

Would make even less sense. In Spider-Man 2 (and for that matter Spider-Man 1), none of the villains call themselves by their titles. The titles are dropped as Daily Bugle sensationalized nicknames, never something adopted by the villains themselves.

Otto in Spider-Man 2 given that he's a normal scientist whose brain is hijacked by AI tentacles would obviously never socially introduce himself as Doctor Octopus. It would be ridiculously OOC for that version.

I'm honestly not sure if the characters are actually from Raimi's movies, or at least I doubt Otto is.

The trailers show him knowing that Spidey is Peter, and he starts to attack Spidey, which's baffling, considering Raimi's Otto decided to do his redemption because he learned that Peter is Spidey, so now all of a sudden he's a villain again?

It's possible he's from a similar, but with different enough differences from Raimi's universe, which if it's the case, I can only wonder why they'd be pretending it's Raimi's Otto... Well, nostalgia aside.

Could also just be bad writing, who knows.

I think it depends on the style, tone, and premise of the manga.

It does, but my point is that killing villains hardly means a story is gonna take a super dark route, specially big villains who are a threat to everyone by just existing.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

To be fair, that's a difference between how the producers, directors or whatever react, compared to how fans react, 'cause Star Wars fans are known for being bitchy too, though, in a different way, since it's joked that to be a Star Wars fan, you have to hate Star Wars lol.

Well the difference is that the MCU creatives lean into that in a way George the Great never did.

I'm honestly not sure if the characters are actually from Raimi's movies, or at least I doubt Otto is.

Well so far the trailers are implying that it's the same guy but obviously they're not gonna do the full movie in the trailer.

It could be they aren't the characters we know. But maybe they're not.

Maybe the twist is that Otto who seems like a nice guy and ally (as implied in the second trailer) is actually the main villain by the end.

[Frontier]

I assume the villains are intended to be the same versions, more or less, to justify Maguire and Garfield being there but they won't go too in-depth with their characterization or what happened to them in those movies.

[PizzaTime2099]

MCU in general, and MCU fans in particular, don't know how to handle "popularity backlash". MCU in general cultivates this bubble where anyone who disses them for all kinds of reasons is a "hater". You see it with their thin skins

Maybe it goes both ways, maybe some of you are getting upset that others don't agree with you, maybe you're caricaturizing the "MCU fanboy" in an attempt to discredit their opinion, maybe you are presenting you own as more objective than it is, but I digress.

[David Walton]

I'm honestly not sure if the characters are actually from Raimi's movies, or at least I doubt Otto is.

The trailers show him knowing that Spidey is Peter, and he starts to attack Spidey, which's baffling, considering Raimi's Otto decided to do his redemption because he learned that Peter is Spidey, so now all of a sudden he's a villain again?

In context, "You're not Peter Parker" could be Ock's disappointment because he's looking for his Spider-Man to help him make sense of what's happening.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

In context, "You're not Peter Parker" could be Ock's disappointment because he's looking for his Spider-Man to help him make sense of what's happening.

The comment "You're not Peter" debunks the idea Holland is subbing in for the other Spider-Man (which people previously voiced), and it confirms that there are multiple Spider-Man which Strange's quote "They all died fighting Spider-Man" confirms.

Obviously there's stuff there that might or might not be explained later.

[David Walton]

The comment "You're not Peter" debunks the idea Holland is subbing in for the other Spider-Man (which people previously voiced), and it confirms that there are multiple Spider-Man which Strange's quote "They all died fighting Spider-Man" confirms.

Obviously there's stuff there that might or might not be explained later.

Sure, I just meant in context it might be that Ock isn't actually looking to hurt Spider-Man but he's desperate to get his attention.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Sure, I just meant in context it might be that Ock isn't actually looking to hurt Spider-Man but he's desperate to get his attention.

Ah okay...yeah.

[PizzaTime2099]

Sure, I just meant in context it might be that Ock isn't actually looking to hurt Spider-Man but he's desperate to get his attention.

If that is the case, I wonder how he will react to seeing Osborn. Otto was working for Harry in Spider-Man 2, I cant recall if he ever says anything about knowing his father.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

If that is the case, I wonder how he will react to seeing Osborn. Otto was working for Harry in Spider-Man 2, I cant recall if he ever says anything about knowing his father.

I think Otto would know of Norman as this big time businessman-scientist, and would recognize his face at least since Norman was a public figure in that world. But seeing Dafoe's Norman and Molina's Otto interact on screen would be pretty neat.

So far all we have is this behind this scenes where Dafoe shows up on stage and hams up in Molina's outfit.



I wonder if Raimi seriously thought, "Can I get Dafoe to play all the bad guys in each movie?" at some point.

[PizzaTime2099]

I think Otto would know of Norman as this big time businessman-scientist, and would recognize his face at least since Norman was a public figure in that world. But seeing Dafoe's Norman and Molina's Otto interact on screen would be pretty neat.

Ya they could easily play it off that they knew each other, after all, Norman was something of a scientist himself. I gotta say, the interactions between Goblin and Ock is one of the things I'm looking forward to the most in this film.

I wonder if Raimi seriously thought, "Can I get Dafoe to play all the bad guys in each movie?" at some point.

Into The DafoeVerse