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  1. #106
    Extraordinary Member DragonPiece's Avatar
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    If anything, Kara here is reminding me of Kate pryde in the marvel comics recently, who’s been getting drunk a lot and has a similar care free attitude.

  2. #107
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    He does in the comics, and he usually has a much closer relationship with Clark than either of the other two have. Even then Irons has sadly been sort of pushed to the edge, I hope he’ll be a more important player going forward. It really should be him and not Batman who is doing all this analysis stuff.
    I guess I'm used to certain Steel designs that don't have the S-shield, but they should definitely be making better use of other Metropolis heroes or characters than they have been.
    Sure but the same is true of Clark as Superman, yet they’re still giving Jon a try. They seem to be determined to shake things up in the Superman corner of the DCU. Kara seems to be changing the least frankly, compared to what Clark and Jon are undergoing. And it’s not like they’ve bothered to synergize all that strongly with the show, they never once had her and Lena meet in the comics despite how strongly the two are shipped on Twitter. If the Latina Supergirl hunch I have proves right, I’d say it’s moreso because of DC pushing for a more diverse universe now.
    Which I'm fine with even if I'm dubious about how they're going about it in certain respects.
    It’s a pretty easy sell though. Supergirl is Kara when she’s 16-20. Superwoman is Kara from 21 on. It’s not a hard concept to grasp at all, you don’t even really need to explain it to people like you need to explain Nightwing. That’s why most people don’t really seem bothered by this. Are you just unhappy with changing the name itself, because honestly I’m kind of surprised you feel strongly enough to object. Most Kara fans elsewhere don’t seem bothered by the idea of a change.
    But to introduce that this late in the game? When people are also used to a mid-to-late 20's Supergirl? This isn't like a Post-Crisis change that early adaptions can integrate like Nightwing when she's been Supergirl 100% of the time.

    I would assume most Kara fans would still think of/prefer her as Supergirl, unless they thing being Superwoman will lead to her being treated better or pushed more, but I don't think it'll make that much of a difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    I mean I’m pretty okay with this, I like the idea that Kara after turning 21, which by the way I’m pretty okay with her being 21 now after being 15 through 16 for the past decade. I like the idea that Kara after turning 21 flew off to another world, probably not to be around Clark since he’s be responsible, and had a fun night.

    I’m not reading like she’s trying to forget I’m reading that she’s partying like a 21 year old girl would on her birthday, only that she had to go somewhere that her powers wouldn’t get in the way (kind of like when Wolverine has to work really hard to get drunk).
    What a jump that she went from being 16 to 21 in only a few years. Like, not even 18, just straight-up 21 .

    I dunno, she comes off kind of depressed to me given how drunk she is.
    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    If anything, Kara here is reminding me of Kate pryde in the marvel comics recently, who’s been getting drunk a lot and has a similar care free attitude.
    Kara kissing a girl when ?

    I guess that's another name change that was made to signify some kind of newfound sense of maturity even though they'd been using their name into adulthood for a long while before that. And pretending like "Shadowcat" doesn't exist which is the whole point of why she goes by Kitty.

  3. #108
    Astonishing Member HsssH's Avatar
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    If it was me I'd probably wait a bit to see how Jon does in his new role before shuffling the board for Supergirl. I also don't really agree with comparisons to characters like Hawkwoman or Invisible Woman since they aren't really selling comics, while Supergirl often has a monthly book named after her so it is likely to introduce some brand confusion. And Superman was always Superman, Superboy was a backstory and never intended to replace anything.

  4. #109
    Extraordinary Member sifighter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I guess I'm used to certain Steel designs that don't have the S-shield, but they should definitely be making better use of other Metropolis heroes or characters than they have been.

    Which I'm fine with even if I'm dubious about how they're going about it in certain respects.

    But to introduce that this late in the game? When people are also used to a mid-to-late 20's Supergirl? This isn't like a Post-Crisis change that early adaptions can integrate like Nightwing when she's been Supergirl 100% of the time.

    I would assume most Kara fans would still think of/prefer her as Supergirl, unless they thing being Superwoman will lead to her being treated better or pushed more, but I don't think it'll make that much of a difference.

    What a jump that she went from being 16 to 21 in only a few years. Like, not even 18, just straight-up 21 .

    I dunno, she comes off kind of depressed to me given how drunk she is.

    Kara kissing a girl when ?

    I guess that's another name change that was made to signify some kind of newfound sense of maturity even though they'd been using their name into adulthood for a long while before that. And pretending like "Shadowcat" doesn't exist which is the whole point of why she goes by Kitty.
    I mean I’ve seen plenty of people just get wasted when they first turn 21
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  5. #110
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    Yep, put me in the camp that says she'll be going by Superwoman by the end of this.

    Now that we're seeing big moves like Jon being Superman being inspired by Future State, I don't see why one would doubt that Kara's Superwoman book wouldn't also be inspiration for her direction going forward in at the very least the name change.

    On top of that, the only other famous versions of Superwoman are now completely off the table. At the end of Bendis' run he firmly confirms that being a superhero was never for Lana, and Superwoman of Earth-3 is no longer named Superwoman. And on top of that the Supergirl show is ending. The lane is totally open for so rebranding.

    _________

    I do think they'll keep the Supergirl name alive, but I think they've already picked who gets it. Seems pretty clear that it'll be the young lady going on a True Grit adventure with Kara, Ruthye. Don't know if anyone else has been paying attention to King's tweets on the book, but they're mostly about her.

    Example:

    "Incredible alt cover for Supergirl Woman of Tomorrow #1 by @1moreGaryFrank Meet Ruthye, your newest favorite DC character. She’s got quite a future ahead of her. (Also, We’ve got a nice surprise coming for fan’s of the Frank/David Supergirl run. So this is kind of perfect.)"

    I find it particularly telling that he brings up the Frank/David run because that run had a non Kryptonian Supergirl, and I think that's where we're ultimately heading. I'm thinking that for a number of reasons, and one of which is how they've positioned every member of the Superman family in relation to Jon. Clark is dipping in power and soon to be off world for an extended amount of time. Conner is more or less exiled off to the SS, and there's apparently something wrong with him (possibly dealing with his powers if the stuff from Bendis makes it over). And if Future State is anything to go by Kara will likely be off world looking to create her own legacy.

    As I see it, it stands to reason that if they were to bring in a new Supergirl during this era, then making her non Kryptonian and not all that powerful (she may be mostly tech or weapon based honestly) would be in line with the trend.

    Plus, it would make a pretty strong contrast to what the Clark and Kara's legacies would be. Clark's is a dynasty, but Kara's seems to be about using the Supergirl names to be a constructive outlet for trauma, and it's for anyone who wants it because it doesn't come with the same burden and expectation.

    Earth may be this young lady's fresh start.
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!"

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  6. #111
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    Strange how we're almost back at Post-Crisis in a way.

    We'll have a young, single, more Earth centric (even Earth born) Superman who is the only one of his kind.

    A Supergirl who is neither related to our Superman nor even a Kryptonian

    The interesting part is that unlike Post-Crisis our Superman seems to be Superman power equivalent to Wally West, and all of the craziness that was written over in Post-Crisis is still here as part of the story. Plus, Kara is still very much a thing.

    __________

    Also here's another tweet where he's promoting the young lady more so than Kara.

    "FOC for Supergirl 1 is coming up. This means you have to tell your comic shop you want it or else they won’t have and you’ll miss the first appearance of Ruthye and Krem and also that thing when"

    And given Ruthye's age (12 or 13 max) she'd more obviously fit the Supergirl name. In addition to that, the Superman family now has a spot open for a preteen/young teen member. However, unlike our previous member, Ruthye has now parents, and her manner of speaking and the way she carries herself puts her in that cute small adult role. But she's not hyper competent, so she remains relatable while still being self sufficient.

    I imagine the book is called Supergirl at all in part because it's more or less about Ruthye getting the title (and Kara moving on from it).
    Last edited by Superlad93; 05-14-2021 at 08:39 AM.
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!"

    - The Digger

    We walk on the path to Secher Nbiw. Though hard fought, we walk the Golden Path.

  7. #112
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    Strange how we're almost back at Post-Crisis in a way.

    We'll have a young, single, more Earth centric (even Earth born) Superman who is the only one of his kind.

    A Supergirl who is neither related to our Superman nor even a Kryptonian

    The interesting part is that unlike Post-Crisis our Superman seems to be Superman power equivalent to Wally West, and all of the craziness that was written over in Post-Crisis is still here as part of the story. Plus, Kara is still very much a thing.
    The Batline has also been pretty much rolling back to the 00’s status quo. With millennials finally taking charge at DC (all the old editors getting fired, Tynion and his age group taking over the main books), it seems we’re seeing what “their” vision for the DCU will be. Don’t know how successful a non-human/Kryptonian Supergirl could be though, Linda and Matrix were still reliant on Kara’s “iconicism” for their looks since they were also blonde Supergirls who wore the S-shield and mimicked her powers, just with different sources for them.
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  8. #113
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    The Batline has also been pretty much rolling back to the 00’s status quo. With millennials finally taking charge at DC (all the old editors getting fired, Tynion and his age group taking over the main books), it seems we’re seeing what “their” vision for the DCU will be. Don’t know how successful a non-human/Kryptonian Supergirl could be though, Linda and Matrix were still reliant on Kara’s “iconicism” for their looks since they were also blonde Supergirls who wore the S-shield and mimicked her powers, just with different sources for them.
    We'll likely find out that Ruthye has some sort of power herself, or they'll give her enough equipment that she'll play more heavily on the "Supergirl...but what if she was Flash Gordon/Buck Rogers" idea. She may even get some psychic powers as a homage to Frank/David like King seems to imply? But I think the main idea will be to leave her fairly limited yet powerful.

    I'd say this would've been risky if she were the only one, but Kara will still be around, thus her "iconicism" stays around while a new things is allowed to happen. And I think the point of this particular passing of the torch is to go outside of the iconic. I think that's the intended contrast between Kara passing along her title and Clark passing along his. Superman is a family business/dynasty, but the Supergirl name seems to specifically be for and about those that need it save themselves from wallowing in the pitty of what they've lost.
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!"

    - The Digger

    We walk on the path to Secher Nbiw. Though hard fought, we walk the Golden Path.

  9. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    The Batline has also been pretty much rolling back to the 00’s status quo. With millennials finally taking charge at DC (all the old editors getting fired, Tynion and his age group taking over the main books), it seems we’re seeing what “their” vision for the DCU will be. Don’t know how successful a non-human/Kryptonian Supergirl could be though, Linda and Matrix were still reliant on Kara’s “iconicism” for their looks since they were also blonde Supergirls who wore the S-shield and mimicked her powers, just with different sources for them.
    Yeah, so is DC gonna give a Clark a daughter?

  10. #115
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I guess that's another name change that was made to signify some kind of newfound sense of maturity even though they'd been using their name into adulthood for a long while before that. And pretending like "Shadowcat" doesn't exist which is the whole point of why she goes by Kitty.
    She was always called Kitty, but you have it backwards. Shadowcat wasn't her original codename, she was Sprite originally. She only became Shadowcat after being trained as a ninja. Shadow because of the ninja thing, cat because of her name Kitty.

    The reason she doesn't use the Shadowcat name on Krakoa is because she's part of the Hellfire organisation now, as Red Queen (like Emma Frost's name, White Queen).
    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I just feel like most people are more likely to recognize or think of her as Supergirl, so I don't see the point in trying to make her as Superwoman happen. And for such a small change.

    I can't really see this being like a "Carol Danvers becomes Captain Marvel" moment when she literally had a TV show about her called Supergirl that ran for 6 seasons.
    I actually won't be shocked if Supergirl ends with Kara changing her codename to Superwoman. She's 30 now. And the only reason she's called Supergirl is because Cat Grant felt it would market better for CatCo. Kara wanted to be called Superwoman in the first place, being 24 already when she first revealed her existence and became a superhero.
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  11. #116
    Extraordinary Member sifighter's Avatar
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    So let me do some quick checking here

    So Kara is now 21 as of this miniseries

    Jon is 17 according to Tom Taylor

    I’m assuming Clark is around early to mid 40’s

    As for Conner he’s got issues of being a clone and reality warping but I’d assume he’s got to be at least in the range of 18-20 given how he looks in Suicide Squad.

    Would that make sense age wise for the Superfamily?
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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  12. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    So let me do some quick checking here

    So Kara is now 21 as of this miniseries

    Jon is 17 according to Tom Taylor

    I’m assuming Clark is around early to mid 40’s

    As for Conner he’s got issues of being a clone and reality warping but I’d assume he’s got to be at least in the range of 18-20 given how he looks in Suicide Squad.

    Would that make sense age wise for the Superfamily?
    The Suicide Squad solicitations describe Kon as a “teen clone”, so he’s 19 at most. Having Jon, Kon and Kara be two years apart from each other works fine. Whether Kon will continue to be called Superboy is the big question, especially if Jon and Kara are moving onto Superman and Superwoman. Seems a bit weird to leave him behind.

  13. #118
    Incredible Member Lvenger's Avatar
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    A Supergirl blogger that I follow isn't very happy about the preview of the first issue of Supergirl: Woman of Tomorrow. They criticise the portrayal of Kara getting drunk and picking fights with random alien jerks and other comments lament the lack of Kara's optimism and empathy in the preview. They also mentioned that King was basically copying True Grit in the preview sequence posted online: http://comicboxcommentary.blogspot.c...seen.html#more

    I haven't seen True Grit so I can't comment on whether that's accurate or not. For context on any replies, the blogger is a longtime Supergirl fan who's been reading and collecting comics since the Pre Crisis days.

  14. #119
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    I have no problem with her having some drinks for her 21st birthday, nor even getting drunk. If it were framed as a special day, a celebration, she got tipsy it could have even been funny/cute. But her being all alone seemingly drowning sorrows, and the attempt at badassery with a drunken bar fight does seem out of character for her. Its more reminiscent of the rebellious troublemaking teen we got pre-FP.

    And a Superwoman "upgrade" is completely superfluous. The difference in connotation between woman and girl simply is not the same as it is with man and boy. Not saying that's a bad thing, hell the reason for the difference is hyper masculinity anyway. But its particularly meaningless here. So like with Superman the past 5 years, this would be a change more to just accommodate some other legacy, not for Kara herself. Basically the entire problem with Infinite Frontier in a nutshell.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 05-14-2021 at 11:45 AM.
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  15. #120
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    Now that we're seeing big moves like Jon being Superman being inspired by Future State, I don't see why one would doubt that Kara's Superwoman book wouldn't also be inspiration for her direction going forward in at the very least the name change.
    So does that mean pants are also inevitable ?
    On top of that, the only other famous versions of Superwoman are now completely off the table. At the end of Bendis' run he firmly confirms that being a superhero was never for Lana, and Superwoman of Earth-3 is no longer named Superwoman. And on top of that the Supergirl show is ending. The lane is totally open for so rebranding.
    I wouldn't even say Lana was all that famous as Superwoman.

    I don't know if it's the perfect time for a rebranding though when the show is probably going to be fresh in people's minds...or virtually every other Supergirl media appearance. Maybe like a few years after the show ends.
    Plus, it would make a pretty strong contrast to what the Clark and Kara's legacies would be. Clark's is a dynasty, but Kara's seems to be about using the Supergirl names to be a constructive outlet for trauma, and it's for anyone who wants it because it doesn't come with the same burden and expectation.
    I suddenly understand why Tom King is writing this book.
    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    I actually won't be shocked if Supergirl ends with Kara changing her codename to Superwoman. She's 30 now. And the only reason she's called Supergirl is because Cat Grant felt it would market better for CatCo. Kara wanted to be called Superwoman in the first place, being 24 already when she first revealed her existence and became a superhero.
    I doubt she's an active Superhero by the end of the show, so I'm not expecting a name change.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    I have no problem with her having some drinks for her 21st birthday, nor even getting drunk. If it were framed as a special day, a celebration, she got tipsy it could have even been funny/cute. But her being all alone seemingly drowning sorrows, and the attempt at badassery with a drunken bar fight does seem out of character for her. Its more reminiscent of the rebellious troublemaking teen we got pre-FP.

    And a Superwoman "upgrade" is completely superfluous. The difference in connotation between woman and girl simply is not the same as it is with man and boy. Not saying that's a bad thing, hell the reason for the difference is hyper masculinity anyway. But its particularly meaningless here. So like with Superman the past 5 years, this would be a change more to just accommodate some other legacy, not for Kara herself. Basically the entire problem with Infinite Frontier in a nutshell.
    This is my problem with it as well.

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