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  1. #61
    Eye-rolling bajuszbetyár The Invincible Beawulf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    It is frustrating that when people suggest an established character come out as LGBT people protest, don't "change" this character make a new character.
    And then here you have Jon, who's been a blank slate sexually until very recently, and they're making him straight.
    Things are improving but we still don't have high profile queer men with DC. Nothing anywhere as prominent as Jon would be. A gay Jon Kent would be a headline making breakthrough character.
    DC is suggesting Tim is gay or bi, we'll see if they have the stones to make it clear and not just hints, and then the next step would be whether they'll also let Conner come out as well.
    My theory is that the Superboy in the SS is a clone & if there's any chance that DC will make a Super-family member non-straight, it will be him, not the 'original' Conner.
    BL and comics fan. 🌈 ----- For those saying BL is "pandering to fujos! Too girly! It's fetishization!!!" --> https://www.fujoshi.info/ (a website with academic resources on Queer Media Studies in Asia and LGBTQIA+ history)


    The queer body has been used as a battleground, has been criminalized, ostracized, and many times erased from their own histories. -- Alesha Byrne (University of San Francisco)

  2. #62
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    And then here you have Jon, who's been a blank slate sexually until very recently, and they're making him straight.
    Yup, Very true

  3. #63
    Mighty Member witchboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Invincible Beawulf View Post
    My theory is that the Superboy in the SS is a clone & if there's any chance that DC will make a Super-family member non-straight, it will be him, not the 'original' Conner.
    That's an interesting suggestion. I'm not sure how that works.
    Does the Super family have room to keep the Conner clone around? I'm skeptical he won't die or otherwise be gone soon once he's exposed as Conner's clone.
    If the clone has Conner's DNA and memories, it seems like they'd share a sexual orientation and/or feelings for Tim.
    I'd rather it be actual Conner who is with Tim, but I'd still put this in the win column if the clone is with Tim and sticks around as a regular character somewhere.

  4. #64
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    My opinion, Dick Grayson will never be queer. They haven’t even solved the choice between Starfire and Barbara Gordon yet.

  5. #65
    Post Editing OCD Confuzzled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Evans View Post
    My opinion, Dick Grayson will never be queer. They haven’t even solved the choice between Starfire and Barbara Gordon yet.
    I don't know about never being queer but I know they will NEVER make a definitive choice between Kori and Babs. They are fine with making them Dick's own Betty and Veronica.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    I don't know about never being queer but I know they will NEVER make a definitive choice between Kori and Babs. They are fine with making them Dick's own Betty and Veronica.
    Which is why, like Archie, he’ll never be anything but straight.

  7. #67
    Post Editing OCD Confuzzled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will Evans View Post
    Which is why, like Archie, he’ll never be anything but straight.
    Not necessarily. Constantine/Zatanna gained popularity but DC was fine with revisiting John's bisexuality in recent years.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    Not necessarily. Constantine/Zatanna gained popularity but DC was fine with revisiting John's bisexuality in recent years.
    Yeah James Tynion IV's Constantine series had him date a man and that was like 5 years ago. And he's definitely bisexual on Legends, having spells with both men and women even if he is depicted as more hetero-romantic.

    I personally could use more Thomas Blake/Catman, ideally with the Secret Six but I feel like a good writer could easily get a mini out of him.

    So many of Gotham's ladies are queer in comparison to the men. I think Ghost-Maker is it and he's been around for like a year? Then there's Selina, Ivy, Harley, Kate, Renee, Harper. Oh, I guess Cullen counts.

  9. #69
    Mighty Member witchboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shimbo View Post
    Yeah James Tynion IV's Constantine series had him date a man and that was like 5 years ago. And he's definitely bisexual on Legends, having spells with both men and women even if he is depicted as more hetero-romantic.

    I personally could use more Thomas Blake/Catman, ideally with the Secret Six but I feel like a good writer could easily get a mini out of him.

    So many of Gotham's ladies are queer in comparison to the men. I think Ghost-Maker is it and he's been around for like a year? Then there's Selina, Ivy, Harley, Kate, Renee, Harper. Oh, I guess Cullen counts.
    There is a clear double standard with how queer men and women are portrayed in the Bat-verse/DC. At one time most of the women were gay or bi while all of the men were straight. Even now we've only got newbie Ghost Maker (a big improvement over nothing) and Cullen, one of the more obscure supporting characters.
    I'm really hoping they'll do better going forward.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    And then here you have Jon, who's been a blank slate sexually until very recently, and they're making him straight.
    Slightly off topic but have we ever seen a super hero go through puberty. Imagine if instead of instantly aging up Jon to a young adult they gave him accelerated aging and we got to see Jon dealing with going through Super puberty as a half Kryptonian half human, see him discovering his sexuality and growing up.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    There is a clear double standard with how queer men and women are portrayed in the Bat-verse/DC. At one time most of the women were gay or bi while all of the men were straight. Even now we've only got newbie Ghost Maker (a big improvement over nothing) and Cullen, one of the more obscure supporting characters.
    I'm really hoping they'll do better going forward.
    Unfortunately, this is a thing that can be seen happening in other wheelhouses and literature and media properties as well. The LGBTQIA+ representation is filled predominately or entirely by women/girls, where most if not all the men/boy characters are straight as an arrow. The "why" behind it can be seen as a bit of a complex that can include the straight-male dominance in creative teams of said literature and media properties and the tendency to see female queerness as "safer", "less 'real'" or "more permissible" than male queerness. The latter can be compounded when you consider the habit of bisexual female characters and their stories concocted rather clearly from the male gaze. (Bisexual females in fiction tend to have it hard in this way, as can real life bisexual or even gay females/fems, due to the concept of performative bisexuality.)

    That's why the Bat-verse, as one example, has a slew of queer female characters and has only just now gotten their second queer male — and their first one of billed story significance, since their first queer male was the brother supporting character to someone else who has only recently had a slight surge in appearances over the past few months, after having spent practically half a decade in limbo.

  12. #72
    Eye-rolling bajuszbetyár The Invincible Beawulf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shimbo View Post
    I personally could use more Thomas Blake/Catman, ideally with the Secret Six but I feel like a good writer could easily get a mini out of him.
    I wanna him so bad in a comic book!
    Catman.jpg


    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    There is a clear double standard with how queer men and women are portrayed in the Bat-verse/DC. At one time most of the women were gay or bi while all of the men were straight. Even now we've only got newbie Ghost Maker (a big improvement over nothing) and Cullen, one of the more obscure supporting characters.
    I'm really hoping they'll do better going forward.
    This.
    Ghost-Maker's an interesting addition to the Bat-fam bc he's depicted as an equal to Bruce in combat skills, strategic thinking, & gadgets, plus, once Bruce regarded (still seems to regard) him as a brother. Not a son or a ward.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning63 View Post
    Slightly off topic but have we ever seen a super hero go through puberty. Imagine if instead of instantly aging up Jon to a young adult they gave him accelerated aging and we got to see Jon dealing with going through Super puberty as a half Kryptonian half human, see him discovering his sexuality and growing up.
    That's why I don't really care about Jon, but time (& Taylor's comic book) will tell... I hope Taylor can somehow remedy the sh*t Bendis did to Jon - and no, I don't mean de-aging... pple should finally get over Teenager Jon... Just let him progress & develop an actual personality.
    BL and comics fan. 🌈 ----- For those saying BL is "pandering to fujos! Too girly! It's fetishization!!!" --> https://www.fujoshi.info/ (a website with academic resources on Queer Media Studies in Asia and LGBTQIA+ history)


    The queer body has been used as a battleground, has been criminalized, ostracized, and many times erased from their own histories. -- Alesha Byrne (University of San Francisco)

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. D. Guy View Post
    Unfortunately, this is a thing that can be seen happening in other wheelhouses and literature and media properties as well. The LGBTQIA+ representation is filled predominately or entirely by women/girls, where most if not all the men/boy characters are straight as an arrow. The "why" behind it can be seen as a bit of a complex that can include the straight-male dominance in creative teams of said literature and media properties and the tendency to see female queerness as "safer", "less 'real'" or "more permissible" than male queerness. The latter can be compounded when you consider the habit of bisexual female characters and their stories concocted rather clearly from the male gaze. (Bisexual females in fiction tend to have it hard in this way, as can real life bisexual or even gay females/fems, due to the concept of performative bisexuality.)

    That's why the Bat-verse, as one example, has a slew of queer female characters and has only just now gotten their second queer male — and their first one of billed story significance, since their first queer male was the brother supporting character to someone else who has only recently had a slight surge in appearances over the past few months, after having spent practically half a decade in limbo.
    You expressed that so well and beautifully.

    It's basically fetishization of lesbians by the primarily straight dudes that write about Gotham/DC that is also easily deniable/erasable anyway because most of those queer women are bisexual.

  14. #74
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Invincible Beawulf View Post

    Ghost-Maker's an interesting addition to the Bat-fam bc he's depicted as an equal to Bruce in combat skills, strategic thinking, & gadgets, plus, once Bruce regarded (still seems to regard) him as a brother. Not a son or a ward.
    It's cool that there's a gay male character in gotham, but I wish it was Clownhunter. Ghostmaker is so boring, whereas Bao Pham has the potential to be a lasting addition to the batman universe.

  15. #75
    Eye-rolling bajuszbetyár The Invincible Beawulf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    It's cool that there's a gay male character in gotham, but I wish it was Clownhunter. Ghostmaker is so boring, whereas Bao Pham has the potential to be a lasting addition to the batman universe.
    Ghost-Maker is bisexual.

    Actually, I hope both Clownhunter & Ghost-Maker will remain recurring characters in the Bat-verse
    BL and comics fan. 🌈 ----- For those saying BL is "pandering to fujos! Too girly! It's fetishization!!!" --> https://www.fujoshi.info/ (a website with academic resources on Queer Media Studies in Asia and LGBTQIA+ history)


    The queer body has been used as a battleground, has been criminalized, ostracized, and many times erased from their own histories. -- Alesha Byrne (University of San Francisco)

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