Nightwing #78 Discussion/Spoilers

[Rakzo]

I suppose that after the years of the terrible editorially mandated "Ric Grayson", any kind of change would be welcomed, but could that change be made by any other writer that is not Tom Taylor?

Don't get me wrong, Tom Taylor can be good... when he's handling characters that are barely used and so he doesn't have any chance to get them wrong or a title where he can exploit his shock value and decompressed writing properly. I don't think Nightwing is necessarily the best book for him, particularly because I'm pretty familiar with the character after enjoying the successful Tom King/Tim Seeley's Grayson or Seeley's Nightwing.

Credit where credit is due though, I think Taylor gets Dick fine (sorry if this sounds like an insult) since the characterization is on-point with the protagonist being his classic kind self and is not like you can get too wrong a hero who is mostly known for being nice. Plus, there are a few connections to the past that are appreciated like The Flying Graysons and Blockbuster (a classic Nightwing rogue) reappearing.

That being said, the typical Taylor tics are also present here which makes this very predictable. For God's sake, just in the first two pages you have yet another example of "Taylor hating on rich people" which was initially a joke from me but at this point you have to understand this is the level of political complexity you have to expect from the author. Second, the forced "charming" moments like the introduction of a little dog who Nightwing saves which in other books would be a cool gesture but again, from Taylor this is just too common. Finally, the story ends way too quickly without much progress in the plot.

Bruno Redondo's artwork is amazing though, he's one of the artists I'm happy to see getting bigger gigs and he's definitely a great fit for Nightwing thanks to his creative storytelling that depicts every action scene perfectly.

Taylor doesn't surprise anymore sadly but is too soon to make a call for this, let's see how it goes.

[Godlike13]

Good start, but would have been better if I didn’t spoil so much of it with the marketing. But wha can you do, this book needed the marketing. This has the making for a good run. Its not reinventing the the wheel, but a clear return to form after the swing and the miss that was Ric. But it has writing that can make meaningful moments, and the art is next level. Hope they pull it off. The character is in desperate need for it.

Those ticks I don’t have a problem with. In fact Dick seems well suited to explore them. As his upbringing puts him in an interesting position of not coming from money to coming from money, and charming is a key character trait.

[Gaius]

I suppose that after the years of the terrible editorially mandated "Ric Grayson", any kind of change would be welcomed, but could that change be made by any other writer that is not Tom Taylor?

Don't get me wrong, Tom Taylor can be good... when he's handling characters that are barely used and so he doesn't have any chance to get them wrong or a title where he can exploit his shock value and decompressed writing properly. I don't think Nightwing is necessarily the best book for him, particularly because I'm pretty familiar with the character after enjoying the successful Tom King/Tim Seeley's Grayson or Seeley's Nightwing.

Credit where credit is due though, I think Taylor gets Dick fine (sorry if this sounds like an insult) since the characterization is fine with the protagonist being his classic kind self and is not like you can get too wrong a hero who is mostly known for being nice. Plus, there are a few connections to the past that are appreciated like The Flying Graysons and Blockbuster (a classic Nightwing rogue) reappearing.

That being said, the typical Taylor ticks are also present here which makes this very predictable. For God's sake, just in the first two pages you have yet another example of "Taylor hating on rich people" which was initially a joke from me but at this point you have to understand this is the level of political complexity you have to expect from the author. Second, the forced "charming" moments like the introduction of a little dog who Nightwing saves which in other books would be a cool gesture but again, from Taylor this is just too common. Finally, the story ends way too quickly without much progress in the plot.

Bruno Redondo's artwork is amazing though, he's one of the artists I'm happy to see getting bigger gigs and he's definitely a great fit for Nightwing thanks to his creative storytelling that depicts every action scene perfectly.

Taylor doesn't surprise anymore sadly but is too soon to make a call for this, let's see how it goes.

Yeah, this part in particular has started to become to me what "Bendis Speak" is for some people.

[Pohzee]

I'm glad that I haven't read enough Tom Taylor to get used to his writing tics. What I read from the first volume of Injustice Year One I thought would translate pretty well to a Nightwing series. The humor, the emotional beats, it works for Nightwing. I've got hopes for this series

[Arnoldoaad]

I felt very nostalgic reading this. I ended up not reading a single chapter of the Ric Grayson saga beyond chapter 1, I kinda knew almost exactly how it was going to conclude after reading the first issue, and from what I heard about it I wasn't wrong just thought it was going to reach that end sooner, like nothing even happen but even more drastic than that is that this feels closer to Nightwing of the late 00s rather than pre-Ric.

Random thoughts and Spoiler Alert

The flashback with Dick and Barbara is excellent, I have seen this type of trick of "actually, this is how they first meet" moment before and it's usually a hit or miss but here it's cute and short and very well written.

I also feel like this is like the 3rd time that we see Blockbuster as the big boss of Bludhaven after (maybe) dying, I was never a big fan but I really hope that something interesting comes out of this.

Melinda Zucco, Tony Zuccos's daughter is going to be a character on this run, and when I read that I got a strong feeling of deja vu like I felt this happen before but neither the name nor the face rang any bells so I google it.
It was on Black Mirror, Sonia Zucco was part of the plot involving Tiger Shark, easily the most forgettable part of that story and she was never used again by Snyder or anyone else on Nightwing, so this is either a sister of Sonia or the editorial also completely forgot about that part of Snyder's story, either way, I hope this becomes a more memorable part.

Speaking of daughters, I actually hope DC and Taylor didn't forget of Julia Pennyworth, Kind of surprised that Alfred left everything to Dick and nothing to anyone else including his own biological daughter. unless I'm somehow misreading it, Dick is the sole heir and I find it very questionable.

Damn good start I think.

[Blue22]

Maybe it's my bias for Tom Taylor's writing. Maybe I'm just excited that the Ric saga is finally over. But MAN, I can't get over how incredibly happy this issue made me. This is the Nightwing I missed. This is the Dick Grayson we never should have lost.

Speaking of daughters, I actually hope DC and Taylor didn't forget of Julia Pennyworth, Kind of surprised that Alfred left everything to Dick and nothing to anyone else including his own biological daughter. unless I'm somehow misreading it, Dick is the sole heir and I find it very questionable.

Yeah that part, while heartwarming, did leave me a tad uneasy. At this point I'm used to there being a jerk hidden underneath all of Alfred's charm. But damn. Did he really leave everything to just Dick? Has Julia even been present in any books since Alfred's death? And poor Damian. Alfred's death has arguably impacted him harder than any other Batfamily member (though there are a few reasons why I take issue with that) so I hope Dick's not the only one who got a touching "you are my son" letter.

I think someone said it best in the Dick thread. It was a good move on Taylor's part to have Dick read a personal letter from Alfred rather than the actual will, itself. Hopefully that means there are doors open for other writers to give him some parting words/gifts to the others.

[Stars & Stripes]

Time will tell if this'll wash away the stench of the whole Ric malarkey, but this is a good start.

[Riv86672]

I'm glad that I haven't read enough Tom Taylor to get used to his writing tics. What I read from the first volume of Injustice Year One I thought would translate pretty well to a Nightwing series. The humor, the emotional beats, it works for Nightwing. I've got hopes for this series

Same here.
Dick seems like himself again, he’s back in Bludhaven, Barbara is there, Blockbuster is there, there was a puppy...

[Arnoldoaad]

Has Julia even been present in any books since Alfred's death?

No, her last appearance was on the last issue of Batwoman, still serving as Kate's Alfred in that series(which was pretty good fit).

I think someone said it best in the Dick thread. It was a good move on Taylor's part to have Dick read a personal letter from Alfred rather than the actual will, itself. Hopefully, that means there are doors open for other writers to give him some parting words/gifts to the others.

That sounds like a pretty good idea but I doubt it will happen, Alfred's death seems to have a pretty important point on Nightwing, after all investing all that money super early on bitcoin definitely paid off for his inheritance to Dick but unless each of the other Robins get an arc or a moment that reflects on Alfred on a similar way there wont be any point to bring up.
In other words unless they do it big they shouldn't do it and here they are doing it big.

[Bruce Wayne]

Time will tell if this'll wash away the stench of the whole Ric malarkey, but this is a good start.

It really helps that DC is actually making an effort here and that the eic/publisher aren't actively sabotaging the book.

[ZuLuLu]

Speaking of daughters, I actually hope DC and Taylor didn't forget of Julia Pennyworth, Kind of surprised that Alfred left everything to Dick and nothing to anyone else including his own biological daughter. unless I'm somehow misreading it, Dick is the sole heir and I find it very questionable.

I am surprised that DC is ignoring Julia, at the time she was fairly well-received (except for the meeting between her and Catwoman).

I think that if they are going to keep Alfred dead (for now) having his daughter who was just reconnecting with him would add emotional gravity to this death.

That said, today's Nightwing issue was a nice palate cleanser and it did what it was meant to do, get people like me who had dropped Nightwing during the Ric saga back on board.

[9th.]

I really enjoyed this, especially Alfred's letter. The colors in this issue really put it over the top for me.

[9th.]

No, her last appearance was on the last issue of Batwoman, still serving as Kate's Alfred in that series(which was pretty good fit).




That sounds like a pretty good idea but I doubt it will happen, Alfred's death seems to have a pretty important point on Nightwing, after all investing all that money super early on bitcoin definitely paid off for his inheritance to Dick but unless each of the other Robins get an arc or a moment that reflects on Alfred on a similar way there wont be any point to bring up.
In other words unless they do it big they shouldn't do it and here they are doing it big.

What? That's so weird she went from regular appearances to nothing.

[Frontier]

Maybe it's my bias for Tom Taylor's writing. Maybe I'm just excited that the Ric saga is finally over. But MAN, I can't get over how incredibly happy this issue made me. This is the Nightwing I missed. This is the Dick Grayson we never should have lost.



Yeah that part, while heartwarming, did leave me a tad uneasy. At this point I'm used to there being a jerk hidden underneath all of Alfred's charm. But damn. Did he really leave everything to just Dick? Has Julia even been present in any books since Alfred's death? And poor Damian. Alfred's death has arguably impacted him harder than any other Batfamily member (though there are a few reasons why I take issue with that) so I hope Dick's not the only one who got a touching "you are my son" letter.

I think someone said it best in the Dick thread. It was a good move on Taylor's part to have Dick read a personal letter from Alfred rather than the actual will, itself. Hopefully that means there are doors open for other writers to give him some parting words/gifts to the others.

It would be nice if other books touched on what Alfred left for the rest of the Batfamily.

[Zaresh]

It would be nice if other books touched on what Alfred left for the rest of the Batfamily.

What other books? Robin? Because besides Damian, the others don't have one. Jason has a mini, 6 issues where he shares time with Bruce, and it's about their relationship mostly. Not going to have time for much on that note, if at all. And Babs wasn't that close to Alfred, was she?

Ideally, yeah. But I see it unlikely to happen.
And I doubt this is going to be an idea explored by other writers, to be honest.