Snyder Cut V Theatrical Cut: Which Cut Handled Supes Better?

[raidensix]

Actually, that's not true. The comics (the original story as told in the 90's) explicitly stated he was dead-dead. The Eradicator even tells him "You were categorically deceased, Kal-El. Such a feat (resurrection) would not be possible again."

To my knowledge, I believe it was Judd Winick in "Under the Hood" who first made the retcon that Superman was in some sort of healing coma. But make no mistake, in the comics he was dead-dead.
...
.

True, but when Clark asked if the Eradicator restored him back to life, he responded that conditions were ideal for "the recuperative process" (not a resurrection attempt) and he got there just in time.

Someone mentioned the soil rising at the end of B v M which I also thought was meant to imply Superman was still alive.

A single line during the team debate (like the Kryptonian computer chiming in) would have sufficed but instead it was: Burn down house, house turns to smoke and Mother box can turn smoke back to house.

Just my 2 cents.

CnE..jpg.

[CosmiComic]

To answer the Op's question, can i say neither? He was barely in the movie and had little characterization in either version, except in the Whedon version when he makes a 180 ti the Silver Age

[Powerboy]

The Snyder Cut is out! And what a journey it was to get there. Now that we have two versions of JL to enjoy or loathe depending where you fall on either version, I wanted to know which out of the two existing versions of Justice League do you guys think handled Superman/Clark Kent/Kal-El the best?

The parts involving Superman are not that much different. The thing I liked most about the theatrical cut was that he diverted from the main task to save the lives of innocents.

In the theatrical cut, I loved how powerful he was. The only problem was Wonder Woman. With everybody else, it would be expected. He would be far more powerful than Cyborg and Aquaman and almost as fast as the Flash. I wish Superman and WW had been portrayed as a bit more equal. But that didn't stop the vicarious thrill of Superman seeming to be sort of Silver Age compared to everyone else. I also liked the race at the end, reminiscent of the Silver Age and showing Superman with a sense of humor.

spoilers:

I loved how the SC did the voice-over with Jor-El and Jonathan Kent about him being s symbol of hope. But then he goes and puts on the black costume instead of the blue and red that would inspire hope if it weren't for the %$^# grey filter on the camera. Also, although he was pretty much invincible in the theatrical version, I thought it hit that note just right. He used his speed to avoid the axe. He put some effort into a serious blast of super cold breath. In the SC, he just completely no-sold an all-out, direct hit from the axe. Then, with the slightest breath, no effort whatsoever, he froze the axe. Somehow, the nonchalant arrogance, I'm invincible and I know it, was just one step too far.

end of spoilers

Overall, the SC was a vastly superior version but, strictly regarding Superman, I liked the theatrical version more although some combination would be great.

[manwhohaseverything]

Avoiding the axe means it would hit cyborg.Also,superman being a bit arrogant works for me.The silverage guy thought he could take on spectre.

[Robanker]

While I loved the Flash/Superman race and the "slow poke" scene, I can't think of a single addition that Whedon made that improved things. Now, I'm sure the shitty CGI moustache removal may have a lot to do with that, but that's certainly how I'm feeling now.

I think Whedon was trying too hard to pivot Cavill's Superman into the one we all know and love and that simply wasn't the guy who Snyder had established in the previous two films. Clearly, those were his marching orders from Geoff Johns, but it never felt organic to the story being told. It felt like an abrupt course correction, rather than a genuine change in his character, which could have worked, but they didn't have the time to make it work within that ridiculous 2 hour runtime that the studio mandated.

This.

Plus it has my favorite badass Superman moment in cinema now,his entrance into the Steppenwolf fight.

"I'm not impressed "

More or less this. I want to say the Theatrical Cut because it didn't end on the wet fart that was the Knightmare future (which does nobody any favors), but Snyder's Justice League just had a better outing for Clark otherwise.

Even with that silly session where everyone circlejerks Superman pretty hard.

[SiegePerilous02]

Horrible lips aside, I'm going with the theatrical cut. The overall Snyder Cut was vastly better than Whedon's hatchet job, but Cavill getting to act like a Silver Age Superman was refreshing even if it was a total 180 from what came before. But what came before sucked anyway, so no biggie.

The farm scene was better in the Snyder Cut, but the Knightmare stuff drags down any good in the Snyder version. So both versions have knocks against it, but the Snyder cut has more considering what it's setting up.

[Powerboy]

Avoiding the axe means it would hit cyborg.Also,superman being a bit arrogant works for me.The silverage guy thought he could take on spectre.

Yes, because it was written that way, specifically to show that Superman was absolutely invincible. It could have just as easily been written that he grabs the axe handle as Steppenwolf starts to swing or pushes him aside.

[Powerboy]

More or less this. I want to say the Theatrical Cut because it didn't end on the wet fart that was the Knightmare future (which does nobody any favors), but Snyder's Justice League just had a better outing for Clark otherwise.

Even with that silly session where everyone circlejerks Superman pretty hard.

If we just went as far as the scene where the Justice League stands posing or even the scene where Bruce meets the Martian Manhunter and then skipped to the closing credits, we would be left with a feeling that this was a very positive movie that made us, metaphorically, leave the theatre feeling better than we did when we went in. Admittedly, the epilogue undercuts all of the positive feelings the movie had built up and makes us feel that, had this been the next movie, it would be right back to morbid and depressing. It's not important now since it's a movie that probably will never be made. I'm thinking about watching it again, maybe a part a day, and just stop after the Batman/ MM scene.

[Powerboy]

Horrible lips aside, I'm going with the theatrical cut. The overall Snyder Cut was vastly better than Whedon's hatchet job, but Cavill getting to act like a Silver Age Superman was refreshing even if it was a total 180 from what came before. But what came before sucked anyway, so no biggie.

The farm scene was better in the Snyder Cut, but the Knightmare stuff drags down any good in the Snyder version. So both versions have knocks against it, but the Snyder cut has more considering what it's setting up.

I would say the same specifically regarding Superman. Yes, it's a 180 that's badly inconsistent with the previous two movies. Yes, there is some dialogue there that is horrible. Yes, the overall product was a hack job disaster.

But as you said, getting to see a recognizable Superman who is powerful and confident (both versions), takes the time to think about and save innocent bystanders (theatrical), says cool catch phrases like I believe in truth and I'm also a big fan of justice (theatrical) and races the Flash in a Silver Age nod (theatrical) was just too much of a relief and a vicarious thrill after the previous two movies. For the Superman parts, theatrical all the way.

[manwhohaseverything]

Yes, because it was written that way, specifically to show that Superman was absolutely invincible. It could have just as easily been written that he grabs the axe handle as Steppenwolf starts to swing or pushes him aside.

Or it was written to show Clark is instinctively altruistic.man of steel-”Hiding is not option for you. is it?you have to help people" .Clark jumped in between shielding cyborg without knowing whether he would get cut or not.More importantly,That's not his modus operandi.superman puts himself between the strong and the weak.he always has and will.why do you think he gets hit by bullets when he can dodge them? Honestly, that's pretty standard.Yes,it's a bit cocky.But,he either backs that up or gets hurt.either way,the people he protects gets shielded.Superman doesn't work like a tactician.he works like a stoic or a tank if you will that smiles.it is that simple.

[Powerboy]

Or it was written to show Clark is instinctively altruistic.man of steel-”Hiding is not option for you. is it?you have to help people" .Clark jumped in between shielding cyborg without knowing whether he would get cut or not.More importantly,That's not his modus operandi.superman puts himself between the strong and the weak.he always has and will.why do you think he gets hit by bullets when he can dodge them? Honestly, that's pretty standard.Yes,it's a bit cocky.But,he either backs that up or gets hurt.either way,the people he protects gets shielded.Superman doesn't work like a tactician.he works like a stoic or a tank if you will that smiles.it is that simple.

Actually, I like this argument. It could well be that he didn't know he could take that hit but he had to protect Cyborg.

[Lightning Rider]

says cool catch phrases like I believe in truth and I'm also a big fan of justice

I found that painful. Such a giant wink.

[manofsteel1979]

I found that painful. Such a giant wink.

At the time I didn't mind it as much,because I thought:

1)they were "course correcting" for future Superman installments for Cavill. (That,Shazam cameo with body double aside,turned out to be a steaming pile of lies thus far)

2) many of us here at the time were happy to see a more classic Superman,and after the several years of bitter non stop handwringing and moaning and fan wars over MOS and BvS,it was nice to see some positivity. So I sort of gritted my teeth and overlooked just how incongruous and ham fisted Superman's storyline was in theatrical JL and even tried to convince myself the CGI on Cavill's upper lip wasn't all that bad.

Delusion and nostalgia are powerful drugs.

Then with the Snyder cut...yeah he wasn't the second coming of the Chris Reeve version of Superman complete with dad jokes and the John Williams music cue showing up, but this was Zack Snyder's Superman in the third part of Zack Snyder's trilogy completing the arc began in MOS. Its narrative is much more satisfying, the aftermath of his death and his return all hold much more weight and consequence and his arrival and presence in the final battle against Steppenwolf is probably one of my favorite Superman moments in live action. I wouldn't have minded seeing Clark have more dialogue of course, but if I have to choose between ham fisted and corny quips incongruous with this version of the character and less dialogue but works better as a conclusion of sorts to this Superman incarnation, I overwhelmingly choose the later.


The ONLY two things from theatrical I'd keep if I ruled the world and universe would be,

1) Clark back in the red and blue for the final shot of him opening his shirt.

And

2) the Flash Superman race scene, with the cgi of Superman's face fixed and the reference to the Brunch gag removed. Yeah its fan service and veers a bit into the corny territory, but Henry's Supes in that scene seems close enough to how he was portrayed in MOS,and seeing how they made a point earlier in the Snyder cut that Barry idolized Superman ("He's my hero") ,I can buy Superman humoring this kid that looks up to him,and maybe set up a big brother/little brother dynamic for potential future stories since we don't have a traditional Jimmy Olsen in the Snyderverse.

Otherwise, the Theatrical Justice League hatchet job is dead to me. Even with the knowledge Snyder wanted to do a whole film more or less with the tired at this point cliched evil Superman and the possible crap with Lois getting pregnant by Batman being in play, judging from what has actually been filmed and put on the screen, i still think the Snyder version does more right by Superman than theatrical. Especially when we are talking about THIS Superman.

[CosmiComic]

The thing is, they didn't have to turn Clark into a parody of himself.

That said, he kinda felt like Clark, which I've never felt with Snyder-Man

[Powerboy]

At the time I didn't mind it as much,because I thought:

1)they were "course correcting" for future Superman installments for Cavill. (That,Shazam cameo with body double aside,turned out to be a steaming pile of lies thus far)

2) many of us here at the time were happy to see a more classic Superman,and after the several years of bitter non stop handwringing and moaning and fan wars over MOS and BvS,it was nice to see some positivity. So I sort of gritted my teeth and overlooked just how incongruous and ham fisted Superman's storyline was in theatrical JL and even tried to convince myself the CGI on Cavill's upper lip wasn't all that bad.

Delusion and nostalgia are powerful drugs.

Then with the Snyder cut...yeah he wasn't the second coming of the Chris Reeve version of Superman complete with dad jokes and the John Williams music cue showing up, but this was Zack Snyder's Superman in the third part of Zack Snyder's trilogy completing the arc began in MOS. Its narrative is much more satisfying, the aftermath of his death and his return all hold much more weight and consequence and his arrival and presence in the final battle against Steppenwolf is probably one of my favorite Superman moments in live action. I wouldn't have minded seeing Clark have more dialogue of course, but if I have to choose between ham fisted and corny quips incongruous with this version of the character and less dialogue but works better as a conclusion of sorts to this Superman incarnation, I overwhelmingly choose the later.


The ONLY two things from theatrical I'd keep if I ruled the world and universe would be,

1) Clark back in the red and blue for the final shot of him opening his shirt.

And

2) the Flash Superman race scene, with the cgi of Superman's face fixed and the reference to the Brunch gag removed. Yeah its fan service and veers a bit into the corny territory, but Henry's Supes in that scene seems close enough to how he was portrayed in MOS,and seeing how they made a point earlier in the Snyder cut that Barry idolized Superman ("He's my hero") ,I can buy Superman humoring this kid that looks up to him,and maybe set up a big brother/little brother dynamic for potential future stories since we don't have a traditional Jimmy Olsen in the Snyderverse.

Otherwise, the Theatrical Justice League hatchet job is dead to me. Even with the knowledge Snyder wanted to do a whole film more or less with the tired at this point cliched evil Superman and the possible crap with Lois getting pregnant by Batman being in play, judging from what has actually been filmed and put on the screen, i still think the Snyder version does more right by Superman than theatrical. Especially when we are talking about THIS Superman.

I think this sums it up for a lot of us. There was a desire to rationalize because JL theatrical gave us some of the Superman we grew up on and wanted. But, now that we have the Snyder cut and it's that same more hopeful Superman but in a believable way, we don't need the theatrical version anymore and can toss it in the garbage can it belongs in.

I would also keep the blue and red costume and the race AND rescuing civilians though it should be presented in a less ham-fisted way. Maybe he could veer off and do it before he ever reaches the the team.