Batbooks lineup

[Vakanai]

BATMAN: THE DETECTIVE #1

written by TOM TAYLOR
art and cover by ANDY KUBERT
ON SALE 4/13/21

THE BATMAN & SCOOBY-DOO MYSTERIES #1

written by IVAN COHEN
art and cover by DARIO BRIZUELA
ON SALE 4/13/21

I forget, what's the creative direction/synopsis for The Detective again?

And yay Scooby Doo Batman team up!

[Frontier]

that's pretty much what I'm getting at. I've hit on this multiple times regarding Duke's development, I don't think the Gotham heroes need to be divorced from Batman entirely (there is a clear benefit from that association) but the reason these characters are who they are in their current form is to be able to springboard into the DC universe as their own thing. although I didn't hate the Ric saga like most people on here, it's crazy that a Batman book would upend and drastically shift the direction of Nightwing's. or we have situations like Red Hood where (despite the guy being a weirdo) Lobdell did a great job building Jason's mythology, expanding his cast, and forging a complex and nuanced identity for him beyond "the villain Bat who kills"; but at the end all his toys get put away and he's back in Gotham. the fact that every other storyline every single bat protege has to descend onto Gotham as Batman's army also doesn't help.

I love the idea of the Batfamily, but the card is being overplayed. if there needs to be a Bat Clan team up then when it happens it:
a.) needs to be specific members for specific missions/task (no more than 2-3 man team ups, all hands on deck needs to be few and far between)
b.) there needs to be some measure of them working as equals as opposed to being his subordinates
and
c.) most importantly there needs to be more stories when the proteges are off Batman's turf, in their own corner of the DC universe, proving why Batman trust these people as his partners.

it's like with Green Lanterns. their mythos is vast, the best way to mitigate their characters is to start divvying them up into other Corps or other cosmic concepts or whatever, and build on what makes them special. the Bat office needs to do the same, divvy them up and build each from there.

Well, I think part of what forms these characters as who they are is their relationship with Batman and each other, and how they find their own niche and adventures within that family circle. I don't think there's a pressing need for them to branch out but I'm also a fan of the Post-Crisis, 90's, Batfamily that was very centered and connected with each other.

If anything the Batfamily concept has been underutilized and underplayed, at least in an organic way whereas otherwise it just gets shoved in forcefully during big storylines without feeling as earned as it should be.

because, realistically, the only thing keeping Joker breathing is Batman's mentality. barring jobbing to make him more ominous in Batman's story, if he pulls up on someone like Jason or Huntress or Damian or Batwoman (maybe even Cass if pushed far enough) he's being put on a shirt the minute he starts getting too twisted and tries to test their gangsta. when written correctly most of Batfamily should be breaking all sorts of feet in Joker's ass.

Well, in-universe the only think keeping Joker breathing is their no-kill rule and the fact that he seemingly cannot die.

[Vakanai]

And fighting against the police as well?

...have you not read Year One?

[Kurisu]

I'm glad you are finding something in it. I just read Matt wagners run from 2006 and the man who laughs and was reminded of how much better it can be. Oh well.

Living in the past is unhealthy.

[Bad Witch]

Living in the past is unhealthy.

So is worrying about what others are doing.

[TheKryptonMan]

I really wish that the concept of the batfamily would end. Let the bat books be Batman only/centric books and let everybody else be it's own thing. I forever keep saying there should be a wall of separation between Batman and the "family" let him do his own thing and let the family do theirs. Tynion is really starting to annoy with how his run seems to be about everybody but Batman, and as a poster said in another thread; don't slap Batman's name on a book just to push other characters who can't maintain their own books. Bat books should be strictly Batman, others (aside from maybe Dick) should not benefit from the mythos he built when they contributed nothing to it. But I figure that DC doesn't believe that the family can stand on their own so that keep tying them to Bruce when in actually they are like an anchor weighing him down.

Hi , actually I agree with you. Many in the " Batfamily " can not stand on their own. Pretty much only Grayson when written properly and Babs/Oracle. I do like Babs having the option to be Batgirl and or Oracle. I have always liked the Oracle character and Nightwing.

[Batman Begins 2005]

BATMAN: THE DETECTIVE #1, NIGHTWING #79 and CHALLENGE OF THE SUPER SONS #1 only for me. Not liking the flagship books, Batman and Detective Comics.

[prepmaster]

...have you not read Year One?

Batman avoided getting caught by the police in his early years. The police were never the main antagonists in the same vein that the Magistrate is gonna be. Batman's villains are colorful gimmicky villains with their own personalities and have their own goons already, not this mayor with the police force.

[Vakanai]

Batman avoided getting caught by the police in his early years. The police were never the main antagonists in the same vein that the Magistrate is gonna be. Batman's villains are colorful gimmicky villains with their own personalities and have their own goons already, not this mayor with the police force.

Batman beat the hell out of that SWAT team. And the Magistrate seems (from someone not reading the Future State books, just keeping up sort of through articles, so could be wrong) seems more like some kind of quasi-fascist sci-fi police force than real world type cops. But if it is a more Batman vs cops thing, seems pretty relevant.

[Pohzee]

I'm glad you are finding something in it. I just read Matt wagners run from 2006 and the man who laughs and was reminded of how much better it can be. Oh well.

Oh don't get me wrong, I love those stories you listed. They're some of my favorites and I wish we still had ongoings of the Year One era as I much prefer it to current Batman.

But as a franchise, I think that the line as a whole looks pretty good right now. The titles for the other Batman characters haven't had this level of creators or ideas since the DCYou's Grayson, R:SoB, and Batgirl of Burnside. Before that, that last real period of exciting ideas for the whole line was nearly a decade ago. So I'm looking forward to whats in the works.

[Vakanai]

Oh don't get me wrong, I love those stories you listed. They're some of my favorites and I wish we still had ongoings of the Year One era as I much prefer it to current Batman.

But as a franchise, I think that the line as a whole looks pretty good right now. The titles for the other Batman characters haven't had this level of creators or ideas since the DCYou's Grayson, R:SoB, and Batgirl of Burnside. Before that, that last real period of exciting ideas for the whole line was nearly a decade ago. So I'm looking forward to whats in the works.

That's great if you care about the Batfamily. If you are interested mainly in just Batman however...

[Robanker]

because, realistically, the only thing keeping Joker breathing is Batman's mentality. barring jobbing to make him more ominous in Batman's story, if he pulls up on someone like Jason or Huntress or Damian or Batwoman (maybe even Cass if pushed far enough) he's being put on a shirt the minute he starts getting too twisted and tries to test their gangsta. when written correctly most of Batfamily should be breaking all sorts of feet in Joker's ass.

He's right you know. Most villains are their most effective only when against their hero.

Joker shouldn't give people like Diana and Clark as much trouble as Bruce and likewise I think Bruce would have an easier time with Lex because of his corporate backing and financial reserves offering him a way to challenge Luthor's entrenched power in ways a poor reporter or strongman scientist cannot.

Joker is so effective because he's tailored to work around Bruce. I'm pretty sure if Black Adam got involved it would be the Joker's last punchline.

This of course is assuming heroes don't job to up the villain's cred, which of course will happen to sell more books, but if the heroes are allowed to be as competent as the villains, yeah, they will not hold against other heroes.

[Frontier]

He's right you know. Most villains are their most effective only when against their hero.

Joker shouldn't give people like Diana and Clark as much trouble as Bruce and likewise I think Bruce would have an easier time with Lex because of his corporate backing and financial reserves offering him a way to challenge Luthor's entrenched power in ways a poor reporter or strongman scientist cannot.

Joker is so effective because he's tailored to work around Bruce. I'm pretty sure if Black Adam got involved it would be the Joker's last punchline.

This of course is assuming heroes don't job to up the villain's cred, which of course will happen to sell more books, but if the heroes are allowed to be as competent as the villains, yeah, they will not hold against other heroes.

[prepmaster]

Joker is so effective because he's tailored to work around Bruce. I'm pretty sure if Black Adam got involved it would be the Joker's last punchline.

Joker would make Clark become a dictator due to one bad day.

[Gaius]

Far be it from me to defend the Joker but this is also in context of Cheetah and Luthor breaking into the Fortress and Bat-Cave, so unlike most instances involving Batman writers jobbing out other DC characters because of their insecurities like Injustice there's actually a fair trade off here.