Abraham Riesman's Biography of Stan Lee - True Believer

[Kaitou D. Kid]

About which of the two authors was more like Peter Parker, so far I'm two chapters into Riesman's book and I'm surprised by how similar Stan was to Peter Parker growing up. I used to think Peter was more similar to Ditko in personality (at least in the Lee/Ditko comics), but I see just as many similarities with Stan, if not more. This isn't to say this proves that they were equal co-creators - it could be a total coincidence and it's still possible that Stan was more of an editor - but I do disagree with the idea of Harry or Gwen having more in common with him than Peter.

Some similarities off the top of my head that I noticed in the book:

-Growing up in a working-class family where the dad's income went out of commission (due to unemployment rather than death like Uncle Ben), where Stan had to get a job while still in school to help out his mom.

-Being a total nerd/bookworm and loving to read literally everything and as much as possible. Stan for all his faults always struck me as a free thinker and well-read person (Ditko too for that matter), and it looks like I was right.

-Being bullied while in school and being smaller/scrawnier than his peers.

-Being an overachiever and feeling like he is never accomplishing enough - Spider-Man in his teen depictions usually has this in common with him.

-Having had a sense of responsibility to at least his immediate family (wife and daughter). I can't comment on the Larry Lieber stuff yet.

-Having a mischievous side to him while in his late teens according to Joe Simon and Jack Kirby. He apparently liked bugging them during work hours. There is also a back-and-forth banter between Simon and Stan that Riesman wrote down. I don't want to give it away but Stan's snarky comeback response to something Simon said to him sounds very Peter Parker-esque.

-There is a quote where Stan describes what it was like to ride a bike as a kid all over the city, and how it gave him a sense of freedom from everything in his life. The way he described him sounds close to how Peter swinging through the city as Spider-Man is often described.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

About which of the two authors was more like Peter Parker, so far I'm two chapters into Riesman's book and I'm surprised by how similar Stan was to Peter Parker growing up. I used to think Peter was more similar to Ditko in personality (at least in the Lee/Ditko comics), but I see just as many similarities with Stan, if not more. This isn't to say this proves that they were equal co-creators - it could be a total coincidence and it's still possible that Stan was more of an editor - but I do disagree with the idea of Harry or Gwen having more in common with him than Peter.

Some similarities off the top of my head that I noticed in the book:

-Growing up in a working-class family where the dad's income went out of commission (due to unemployment rather than death like Uncle Ben), where Stan had to get a job while still in school to help out his mom.

-Being a total nerd/bookworm and loving to read literally everything and as much as possible. Stan for all his faults always struck me as a free thinker and well-read person (Ditko too for that matter), and it looks like I was right.

-Being bullied while in school and being smaller/scrawnier than his peers.

-Being an overachiever and feeling like he is never accomplishing enough - Spider-Man in his teen depictions usually has this in common with him.

-Having had a sense of responsibility to at least his immediate family (wife and daughter). I can't comment on the Larry Lieber stuff yet.

-Having a mischievous side to him while in his late teens according to Joe Simon and Jack Kirby. He apparently liked bugging them during work hours. There is also a back-and-forth banter between Simon and Stan that Riesman wrote down. I don't want to give it away but Stan's snarky comeback response to something Simon said to him sounds very Peter Parker-esque.

-There is a quote where Stan describes what it was like to ride a bike as a kid all over the city, and how it gave him a sense of freedom from everything in his life. The way he described him sounds close to how Peter swinging through the city as Spider-Man is often described.

Interesting. Glad you started reading the book and look forward to hearing more from you. I don't remember any passages about Stan being bullied at school though?

My OP did suggest some correspondences between Stan and Peter, while noting that Stan, maybe found a bit of himself to put in other characters.

[Kaitou D. Kid]

I don't remember any passages about Stan being bullied at school though?

It was at the part about how Stan had to fast track through school. There is a quote from him on how he was picked on for being the smallest and scrawniest kid in class, and how it made his early life hell.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

It was at the part about how Stan had to fast track through school. There is a quote from him on how he was picked on for being the smallest and scrawniest kid in class, and how it made his early life hell.

Okay I found it. Yeah, can't believe I missed it. This was elementary school, and Stan Lee's high school at DeWitt Clinton High School was happier than Peter's, so I guess that's why I didn't pick it up.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

By the way I came across this cool YouTube video on Twitter.

This is Stan Lee as people knew him in the 1960s at Marvel. The famous Stan Lee look (wig, glasses, mustache, permanent cheshire cat grin) came about 1970.

It's kind of uncanny, but this is the Stan Lee who collaborated with Kirby and Ditko, and how they largely remembered him:



It's a look at the "man behind the curtain" none of that slick, slangy presentation that came later.

[Alan2099]

By the way I came across this cool YouTube video on Twitter.

This is Stan Lee as people knew him in the 1960s at Marvel. The famous Stan Lee look (wig, glasses, mustache, permanent cheshire cat grin) came about 1970.

It's kind of uncanny, but this is the Stan Lee who collaborated with Kirby and Ditko, and how they largely remembered him:



It's a look at the "man behind the curtain" none of that slick, slangy presentation that came later.

Great find, Jack!

It's weird seeing Stan Lee holding back so much.

On that note, here's something I found.


The two figures on the left are Stan and Jack and that isn't how people picture either of them looking.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

The two figures on the left are Stan and Jack and that isn't how people picture either of them looking.

Kirby in public could be quite cordial and glad-handling and be very polite. But as he explained to people about Stan Lee in his final years:

"If Stan would only come out of his hiding place and tell the world everything would go great. It isn’t obscure. He knows it, and I know it. There won’t be a resolution. People don’t change. They can’t change. Sometimes it’s too late. You just go on being what you are. Human beings go on being human beings. I can predict everything that Stan will do. I know I can’t change Stan. He says his piece, and I say mine. I could shake hands with Stan till doomsday and it would resolve nothing, the dance goes on."
— Jack Kirby

Marvel in the 1960s was a big corporate office and it was filled by grown middle-aged men so people wore a suit to work. So it looked fairly Mad Men-esque although not as plush and fully staffed. It wasn't until younger talent came in, especially Roy Thomas, that the office culture shifted to something more casual. Kirby himself took to wearing suits in that time but then around 1970 he moved to LA he shifted to wearing T-Shirts and something closer to the rough and tumble Kirby we imagine him.

[FFJamie94]

I've seen B&W pictures of Bald Man Stan, but never in colour. It's kind of weird to see him like that but hey, life moves on.
I do wonder how much star power he would have had if he didn't go with his iconic look.
Regardless, it's still Stan.

[Mister Mets]

By the way I came across this cool YouTube video on Twitter.

This is Stan Lee as people knew him in the 1960s at Marvel. The famous Stan Lee look (wig, glasses, mustache, permanent cheshire cat grin) came about 1970.

It's kind of uncanny, but this is the Stan Lee who collaborated with Kirby and Ditko, and how they largely remembered him:



It's a look at the "man behind the curtain" none of that slick, slangy presentation that came later.

On the other hand, he was prescient about the potential of superheroes.