Batman v Superman without Doomsday.

[CosmiComic]

I get Snyder had a whole Darkseid story planned and that is fine. However, wouldn't it make more sense for Supes to bite it in JL? Steppenwolf is taken down and Darseid releases Doomsday out the closing portal? Seemed more fitting given the themes Snyder was going for.


Exactly! I would think a different threat like a suited up Lex, a Lex backed Metallo, mutated Zod into anti-Superman Bizzaro, a Zodd mutated Parasite, or a true Bizarro or Paparsite but Lex brings them in ... Forcing Bruce to forgive Clark and Diana having to come to assist because Bats weakened Superman and the threat weakens him more ... Would've made more sense.

And DKSR / DKSA just seems like story beats you do AFTER Clark and Bruce are great friends.

It just felt like we were missing a TON of backstory to get to this point.

Even with his 4 hours of JL, BvS's still feels odd.

Clark and Bruce as friends? That's never happened in the history of the JL

[CliffHanger2]

Clark and Bruce as friends? That's never happened in the history of the JL

You sure about that?

[CosmiComic]

You sure about that?

I'm being sarcastic, sorry about that. I've been waiting for them to interact as friends in live action for years, but we never really got it

[WebLurker]

It seems like one of the key downfalls of BvS was that huge chunks of it were there only to set up upcoming movies (some of which won't get made now) then trying to make a cohesive story in this film. As far as Doomsday goes, it was crude plot device welded onto the end to kill Superman, since the objective was to have Superman dead at the end. IMHO, I think cutting Doomsday and just keeping everything with Lex Luthor might've been cleaner (e.g. have Batman save Martha while Superman goes to stop Lex, and maybe have Lex use power armor and steal Batman's spear and kill Superman with it?).

[SiegePerilous02]

Doomsday was necessary because they wanted to check off the "death of Superman" box along with the "Batman meeting Superman on screen for the first time" and the "**** it, throw Wonder Woman in as well to set up JL" boxes. Whether it was a good idea to cram all of this into one film and if it would be possible to make a good film with that requirement are different dicussions.

Personally, DoS is one of the most overrated stories in comics and coasts along on the fact that it killed Superman and made newspaper headlines, but not even permanently. Doomsday is a bland plot device and nothing else. I don't think they should have even entertained adapting it this early into their film series, or even touched it at all. If we're going to kill Superman on the big screen, the nerds would clamor for Doomsday but surely there are much better ways to do it?

[Alan2099]

Making Batman vs Superman and the Death of Superman into one movie was far too much, especially since this was the first time we even got to see this Batman.
Frankly though Man of Steel forced two conflicting elements together as well, so it's not like they were off to a good start. Having the origin of Superman and Clark struggling to establish himself as a hero and then bringing in evil Kryptonias that he has to kill is some pretty horribly paced storytelling.

Ideally, it should have went more like this...

First movie you establish Superman. Probably be a good idea to establish Lex Luthor too. It doesn't matter who they fight. This is just the set up that makes everyone view Superman as a hero.

Then you do a Batman movie.

Second Superman movie you can bring in Zod.

Third movie, after some major destruction in Superman vs Zod II: Electric Boogalloo, then we have Batman vs Superman. You can even bring in Wonder Woman here. I even like the idea that Batman's anti-Superman gear is actually what's used to save Superman from the real villain (Zod's corpse turned into Bizarro or something).

Now you have a universe. Do your Aquaman movie, your Wonder Woman movie, your Flash movie, Cyborg, whatever.

Now you can do the Death of Superman. You can even make the Death of Superman and JLA into the same movie if you like. Have Darkseid unleash Doomsday.

[CosmiComic]

Honestly if they were doing an older Batman, they should've also done an older Superman IMHO. I didn't think seeing Superman's origin again was necessary

But I agree they tried to squeeze too much into too few movies

[batnbreakfast]

B v S was the last movie that tricked me. Alien vs predator... I was a whelp. Now after B v S I have evolved and became smarter. They won't trick me with Kong vs Godzilla Dawn of the first directors cut.

If a movie has VS in the frigging title its crap as Hellboy would say. The writers didn't even care to name the baby properly because they knew it should have died in the womb. I did not care for B v S under Wolfgang Petersen while it was advertised in I Am Legend and will never again watch something by Terio or Snyder. No, I'm not a Marvel Zombie because I love characters from both companies and want great movies from DC and Marvel as well and keep them coming till I'm done with enjoying motion pictures

[CosmiComic]

B v S was the last movie that tricked me. Alien vs predator... I was a whelp. Now after B v S I have evolved and became smarter. They won't trick me with Kong vs Godzilla Dawn of the first directors cut.

If a movie has VS in the frigging title its crap as Hellboy would say. The writers didn't even care to name the baby properly because they knew it should have died in the womb. I did not care for B v S under Wolfgang Petersen while it was advertised in I Am Legend and will never again watch something by Terio or Snyder. No, I'm not a Marvel Zombie because I love characters from both companies and want great movies from DC and Marvel as well and keep them coming till I'm done with enjoying motion pictures

Terrio also did Rise of Skywalker, I think, so he really shouldn't be allowed to write more of these beloved characters. I fear it'll be a while before we get another JL movie

[Jim Kelly]

Even though v. and vs. are abbreviations for the same thing, which is "versus," I feel like the use of "v" in BATMAN V SUPERMAN was meant to sound more distinguished--and how v. is used in legal matters--with lawyers just pronouncing it as "vee," such as "the People vee Ruggles."

Although for me, in that sense, BATMAN V SUPERMAN sounds like it was meant to be a joke. Something you might have read in an old MAD magazine. Not a physical fight, but a legal fight between these two iconic super-heroes.

Maybe by intoning V. rather than Vs., they were trying to get away from the mundane sound of versus, so it would have a different ring--to suggest this is no mere cage fight, it's something more important--so important we could only use a V.

What makes it even more ridiculous is the : DAWN OF JUSTICE. Ah, so you had a character limit on the versus, but you could afford a colon and three extra words.

[MarshallBravestarr]

Yes, I thought bringing in Doomsday ruined the movie. I found the conflict between Superman and Batman the most interesting part of the movie. Get rid of Lex, WW, Doomsday, the nightmare fired scene, and find a better resolution than the cosmically stupid “Martha”.

I think the movie would’ve been much better by being trimmed down like that.

[CosmiComic]

Yes, I thought bringing in Doomsday ruined the movie. I found the conflict between Superman and Batman the most interesting part of the movie. Get rid of Lex, WW, Doomsday, the nightmare fired scene, and find a better resolution than the cosmically stupid “Martha”.

I think the movie would’ve been much better by being trimmed down like that.

Maybe having them fight against each other never made sense in the first place

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

Maybe having them fight against each other never made sense in the first place

I could buy them fighting. I never got the sense they would be friends right away. Superman and Batman are perfect for a Buddy movie. Those rely on partners at odds with each other which is what they should start out as.

But a teamup movie between Superman/Batman/ Wonder Woman would've been cool.

They are DC's trinity so putting that as a focus might've been interesting.

[CosmiComic]

I could buy them fighting. I never got the sense they would be friends right away. Superman and Batman are perfect for a Buddy movie. Those rely on partners at odds with each other which is what they should start out as.

But a teamup movie between Superman/Batman/ Wonder Woman would've been cool.

They are DC's trinity so putting that as a focus might've been interesting.

They could've had more of a superhero rivalry and then settled their differences like reasonable heroes they usually are

[batnbreakfast]

Even though v. and vs. are abbreviations for the same thing, which is "versus," I feel like the use of "v" in BATMAN V SUPERMAN was meant to sound more distinguished--and how v. is used in legal matters--with lawyers just pronouncing it as "vee," such as "the People vee Ruggles."

Although for me, in that sense, BATMAN V SUPERMAN sounds like it was meant to be a joke. Something you might have read in an old MAD magazine. Not a physical fight, but a legal fight between these two iconic super-heroes.

Maybe by intoning V. rather than Vs., they were trying to get away from the mundane sound of versus, so it would have a different ring--to suggest this is no mere cage fight, it's something more important--so important we could only use a V.

What makes it even more ridiculous is the : DAWN OF JUSTICE. Ah, so you had a character limit on the versus, but you could afford a colon and three extra words.

Dawn of Justice sounds like a flick involving a young Chuck Norris, not something you spend money on.
When it comes to Batman fighting Superman... After Frank Miller did it the brawl between them unfortunately looked like a good idea to some