Which do you prefer Zack Snyder’s Justice League or Infinity War-Endgame?

[Jack The Tripper]

Chitauri.

In an MCU film.

Absolutely! Even all the Ultrons in AoU! Generic Grey skinned monsters are just as bad and overused as big lasers shooting down from/up to the sky for a final set piece.

[CosmiComic]

But that's the thing they won't admit it's a lack of evolution or bad writing. They really think that represents some type of moral superiority. I don't think it's an odd complaint when there are no consequences for villains mass murdering. I would disagree killing is less necessary on a street level especially for a char with no super powers. In rl it would come down to kill or be killed for a masked vigilante.

But what are the heroes supposed to become? Executioners? Does due process not matter?

[CosmiComic]

Absolutely! Even all the Ultrons in AoU! Generic Grey skinned monsters are just as bad and overused as big lasers shooting down from/up to the sky for a final set piece.

That's kinda why AoU was underwhelming

[tyusmax]

Absolutely! Even all the Ultrons in AoU! Generic Grey skinned monsters are just as bad and overused as big lasers shooting down from/up to the sky for a final set piece.

I think Generic Grey-skinned monsters are great!
But I am a fan of epic fantasy stories, and there's a lot of that in those books.

I am not sure Generic Purple-skinned Monster is such a big improvement as you seem to be making it though.
Thanos's characterization came in IW, 21 movies in.
In Avengers 1, the most comparable to ZSJL, Thanos was just as generic, if not more so.

[CliffHanger2]

But what are the heroes supposed to become? Executioners? Does due process not matter?

Well the whole reasoning for masked vigilantes is that the court system has failed and due process sides with criminals. Or the threats are too big for conventional tactics. I think Black Widow said it best in IW-"We don't want to kill you but we will if we have to." Yeah everyone shouldn't be the Punisher but a so-called hero who puts a no-kill rule above saving innocent lives is no hero at all.

[tyusmax]

That's because comics refuse to evolve and actually keep them in prison and develop new villains. It's odd to complain about heroes not killing off their villains then.

Most of the time, the MCU heroes are fighting in some kind of bigger combat situation. Whereas Batman in BvS was fighting at street level, where killing is usally less necessary. But I agree on Hawkeye. I hated that nonsense

I am not sure it qualifies as street level when you're fighting people armed with flamethrowers and grenades, and about 10 assault rifles.

[green_garnish]

Yeah everyone shouldn't be the Punisher but a so-called hero who puts a no-kill rule above saving innocent lives is no hero at all.

The reason superheroes are "super" is because they always - always - find a way to do both. If you can't do both, you are by definition a villain.

[CliffHanger2]

The reason superheroes are "super" is because they always - always - find a way to do both. If you can't do both, you are by definition a villain.

That's crazy man and totally twisted.

[green_garnish]

That's crazy man and totally twisted.

Wow. Just wow.

[The Cool Thatguy]

In the Avengers films, I am pretty sure hulk did more damage and killed people in the name of stopping Loki.

And the word is where it ends. she killed terrorists. Maybe we should let WW elevate from Avengers to more like Jack Buaer from 24. This just confirms when Snyder said he was telling a more mature comic book story. in that content, it is perfectly okay to kill terrorists.

I think you missed the part "Killing human terrorists when she has the power to not do it is beneath her. Like if the Punisher just blew all their brains out or the Hulk smashed them to bits, I'd cheer and laugh. But this is Wonder Woman, not them."

As disgusting as terrorists are, they're still human beings entitled to due process when possible. And when they're killed by God like beings who could easily disable them, it stops being killed in the heat of battle, and is just brutality.

Hulk may have killed some people when he fought the invasion, but he was fighting an invasion, not one person. And he's the Hulk, reckless rage is his thing. Empathy and diplomacy is Diana's. And nuking a terrorist isn't that.

[Jack The Tripper]

I think Generic Grey-skinned monsters are great!
But I am a fan of epic fantasy stories, and there's a lot of that in those books.

I am not sure Generic Purple-skinned Monster is such a big improvement as you seem to be making it though.
Thanos's characterization came in IW, 21 movies in.
In Avengers 1, the most comparable to ZSJL, Thanos was just as generic, if not more so.

And that's cool man! I'm just not a massive fan myself

Well, what I was trying to get across is that Thanos isn't all that generic - he's the first one of these brutes to really have character motivations aside from general villainous tendencies and then on top of that is the fact that the performance is actually very good in helping people relate. The fact that you can see Josh Brolin in Thanos really does a lot to lift what could be a let-down of a CGI villain into a great, well rounded character. As I previously stated, with as much time and story Darkseid would have the potential to be done just as well or better.

I absolutely agree re: Avengers 1 - however, Thanos was literally just a tease with one shot of him post credits, whereas Darkseid did get considerably more backstory and screen time. But I do agree that Snyder Cut is better suited to being compared with the first Avengers movie. The only reason I was going in depth on this subject was to show that the other poster was not being objective in their critique of Thanos' VFX in IW/Endgame.

[The Cool Thatguy]

And that's cool!

Well, what I was trying to get across is that Thanos isn't all that generic - he's the first one of these brutes to really have character motivations aside from general villainous tendencies and then on top of that is the fact that the performance is actually very good in helping people relate. The fact that you can see Josh Brolin in Thanos really does a lot to lift what could be a let-down of a CGI villain into a great, well rounded character. As I previously stated, with as much time and story Darkseid would have the potential to be done just as well or better.

I absolutely agree re: Avengers 1 - however, Thanos was literally just a tease with one shot of him post credits, whereas Darkseid did get considerably more backstory and screen time. But I do agree that Snyder Cut is better suited to being compared with the first Avengers movie. The only reason I was going in depth on this subject was to show that the other poster was not being objective in their critique of Thanos' VFX in IW/Endgame.

I think a tease works better than what we have in Justice League, though.

Comic fans know who Thanos is, and word of mouth spreads.

In Justice League, we see what's supposed to be this big, foreboding threat...nearly killed and his forces forced to retreat before humanity discovered gun powder. I know the defense is 'But Ares and Zeus' but neither gods are really characters in the DCU. They're just 300 extras, all things considered.

Less is more

[CosmiComic]

Well the whole reasoning for masked vigilantes is that the court system has failed and due process sides with criminals. Or the threats are too big for conventional tactics. I think Black Widow said it best in IW-"We don't want to kill you but we will if we have to." Yeah everyone shouldn't be the Punisher but a so-called hero who puts a no-kill rule above saving innocent lives is no hero at all.

Yeah, but did due process fail, or did the vigilantes just not care?

[CliffHanger2]

Wow. Just wow.

So a superhero who can't save innocent ppl and at the same time save the villain trying to kill those innocents is a villain?

[CosmiComic]

I am not sure it qualifies as street level when you're fighting people armed with flamethrowers and grenades, and about 10 assault rifles.

Not sure what you're referring to.