Excalibur [20] : Review and Spoilers

[CGAR]

Seriously, what was the point of this? If they were going to do a Malice story, it should have been in X-Factor and it absolutely should have included Lorna.

Doing this kind of random, out-of-the-box storyline requires finesse and an accurately thorough knowledge of history and continuity. Howard has neither. Mike Carey was someone who did this well.

oh gahd. I would love Mike Carey on Excalibur. Just imagine what he did for Rogue and Xavier but doing it for Betsy. But le sigh. Tini already "did" it.

Sucks that they approached Mike Carey to come back but he was too busy.

I really think they wanted him for the Moira X book. Or Children of the Vault expansion.

[jwatson]

I also have to say it's driving me crazy not knowing if Rogue can still control her powers or not. Not so much the aura power but the touching. Like she had no gloves on in this issue and i kept staring at her hands to see if she touched anyone. She came pretty close to jubilee.

[Havok83]

I also have to say it's driving me crazy not knowing if Rogue can still control her powers or not. Not so much the aura power but the touching. Like she had no gloves on in this issue and i kept staring at her hands to see if she touched anyone. She came pretty close to jubilee.

She can control her powers. She touched Rachel last issue, took her powers and there no adverse reactions to either

[Rnap22]

They could use this version of MAlice to explain Lorna’s mental health. If they were bonded together MAlice’s own mental health could be the cause of it. That would be interesting to wonder has Lorna always had this or was it from being bonded to MAlice.

I’m referring to Tini’s “Malice” as MAlice from now on since this take doesn’t really jibe with all other appearances of Malice before.

[Havok83]

They could use this version of MAlice to explain Lorna’s mental health. If they were bonded together MAlice’s own mental health could be the cause of it. That would be interesting to wonder has Lorna always had this or was it from being bonded to MAlice.

I’m referring to Tini’s “Malice” as MAlice from now on since this take doesn’t really jibe with all other appearances of Malice before.

Completly unnecesary. Lorna has had enough problems that she really doenst need Malice tied to her own personal development. She has reasons that have already explained her mental health which have nothing to do with Malice so adding that accomplishes nothing for

[jmc247]

They could use this version of MAlice to explain Lorna’s mental health. If they were bonded together MAlice’s own mental health could be the cause of it. That would be interesting to wonder has Lorna always had this or was it from being bonded to MAlice.

There was more then enough storytelling and pathologizing those issues in the 80s for one lifetime.

[Celestialbodies]

This issue was more disappointing for me I thought Malice could have a MUCH better origin story than told here especially with such topics as identity and displacement or even self love. I also agree this could have been a wonderful opportunity for more diversity, but more importantly Malice could have been used much better in this story. Everything about Bets and Kwannon motivations for saving her were contrived and could have been expanded upon in the previous two issues thus giving this issue more payoff. Malice as a parallel to Bets and Kwannon is such a good idea but the execution was horrible, it did nothing for Malice and in some places Bets came off looking like a fool imo.

I genuinely get what Tini is trying to do and the last few issues have highlighted that but she has no grasp at all of pacing or how to elicit emotion from her audience. She had 20 issues to craft a really complex and emotionally resonating story between Bets and Kwannon and she continues to fail in that regard, nothing she's done with them has any meaning or long term ramifications things are simply happening. Which is unfortunate because no issue for me more than this demonstrates how much potential is there if she did a better job executing her ideas.


That said Kwannon has continued to be a standout under her pen, she understands the character in a way that she simply does not get anyone else in her cast, outside of when she wrote Apocalypse. I kept waiting on that moment where Bets shows her strength of self and identity and for me it never came her Bets continues to read bland and uninspired which is a stark contrast to how vibrant, in control her Kwannon continues to be.

She was just a "disembodied psyche" metaphor to bring Kwannon and Betsy together.

A bit clumsy, really.

The concept of this issue is nice.

The execution is not.

They never address why Alice is suicidal. They never even really hint at it.

And then they kill her and just resurrect her and go "Job well done." and it's like... what?! NO SERIOUSLY WHAT?!

Seriously, what was the point of this? If they were going to do a Malice story, it should have been in X-Factor and it absolutely should have included Lorna.

Doing this kind of random, out-of-the-box storyline requires finesse and an accurately thorough knowledge of history and continuity. Howard has neither. Mike Carey was someone who did this well.

All of this!!

[Wolverine12]

There's no law against that. If anything Malice just highlighted a flaw in their government and laws that were established which should spark some revision going forward. Malice committed no crime on Krakoa

Never said it was a crime but actions still have consequences on Krakoa.

[Havok83]

Anyone else found it odd that Betsy referred to Kwannon as Kwannon and she didnt correct her?

Never said it was a crime but actions still have consequences on Krakoa.

You didnt but the pit is the worst punishment a mutant can get on Krakoa and that happens when they've committed a crime as established by Krakoan law. The pit is too severe and a more fitting consequence would be to put her on the Hellions. The pit would have been unnecessarily cruel bc she died and was no longer a problem. Xavier resurrected her just to want to throw her in an eternal hell. Considering there is a long queue of innocent mutants waiting to be brought back, that makes his actions here that much worse

[Jwyatt]

I hate this ham-fisted depiction of suicidal thoughts. Malice is suicidal, so Captain Betsy and Psylocke KILL her and resurrect and she is just supposed to get over what made her suicidal in the first life?
Worst therapy ever.

[Wolverine12]

Anyone else found it odd that Betsy referred to Kwannon as Kwannon and she didnt correct her?



You didnt but the pit is the worst punishment a mutant can get on Krakoa and that happens when they've committed a crime as established by Krakoan law. The pit is too severe and a more fitting consequence would be to put her on the Hellions. The pit would have been unnecessarily cruel bc she died and was no longer a problem. Xavier resurrected her just to want to throw her in an eternal hell. Considering there is a long queue of innocent mutants waiting to be brought back, that makes his actions here that much worse

And we’re back to my original point “some posters think Xavier is being too harsh, I think the punishment would’ve been an appropriate consequence for trying to attack the QC.”

Either way the point is moot since he forgave her.

[Thundershot]

I was recently wondering if there might be mutants (especialy former villains), who might consider themself not worthy of being brought back from the dead, beacuse of their trauma or the sins they commited and instead would seek the compromise that if they die, Krakoa will bring back a younger (or even newborn) version of themself, who are free of these issues.
Basicly a second chance for a new version of themself.

Which narrative would also create a set of mutant characters who are actualy still in danger of dying (as the characters they are), adding tension to their involvements in stories.

But this also made me notice that there was always a fourth option they could have picked for Sabertooth.

If i recall right the reasoning for throwing him into the pit was that they can't let him run around the outside world, because he would just kill humans again, they can't kill him, because no mutant is allowed to stay dead and they can't put him in a prison because Krakoa is not supposed to have prisons.

So instead they threw him into a pit where he would remain in an eternal fully aware stasis.

But as mentioned. There was a fourth option. Execute him and bring an entirely fresh version of him back, who could grow up in a way that would prevent him from being the person the original Sabertooth was.

Now mind you that's still a pretty amoral idea, but given the extreme context it would be a form of redemption and second chance, while the alternative is eternal torture, which isn't particular moraly upright either.

So yeah. it feels like they are weirdly trigger happy at times with throwing mutants in the pit, when they still have alternatives at hand.

They should bring back the inverted Sabertooth. Surely they have a backup of him somewhere.

[ericng]

This issue is the best of all the Excalibur issues. I didn't expect the origin of Malice. Well done and it was a lovely story.

I am not sure why Malice hate her mum so much when all she did was to love her.

[Frobisher]

This issue is the best of all the Excalibur issues. I didn't expect the origin of Malice. Well done and it was a lovely story.

I am not sure why Malice hate her mum so much when all she did was to love her.

Haha, I don't feel like some of the people in this thread have met many teenagers, or remember being one.

[Uncanny X-Man]

I hate this ham-fisted depiction of suicidal thoughts. Malice is suicidal, so Captain Betsy and Psylocke KILL her and resurrect and she is just supposed to get over what made her suicidal in the first life?
Worst therapy ever.

I also found it funny that Charles' idea was so give her a body only to exile her to the pit.