Ed Brubabker Criticizes Disney/Marvel For Lack Of Winter Soldier Royalties

[inisideguy]

They did not.



He wrote the story on a character who was widely seen as disposable and never all that interesting to start with. Bucky was a Robin-copy character after all, at the outset.



Wow wish-fulfillment on full display here:
-- First of all, Winter Soldier was a successful story in comics years before the movie came out.
-- Only a sliver of the percentage who saw the Winter Soldier movie actually went out to read the comics.



A sliver of a sliver of a sliver. Not significant or relevant enough to form a sample.



If Disney were so above and so much more capable, then they could have created their own IP and stories and so on instead of just buying stuff outright.

So no, I'd say Disney doesn't deserve a single damn thing. Especially since the first Captain America which already featured a Brubaker-inspired Bucky set up to become WS, pre-existed their purchase of Marvel.



It's not promotion. And if it's free for anyone, it's for Disney.

Sorry I can't take your little one word smart ass answers as serious. They are just emotion at best. You guys keep writing like this is a one way street. Brubaker never get as famous and rich as he is without Marvel and DC in the first place. They gave him the platform and the character of Captain America to write about which he used.

[Brian B]

Not to be flippant, well, I mean, it’s me. But are they well known? Us folk know who they are. Does the general public? Do they care?

If you know them, that’s well known enough for me.

I really just assume everyone here on this board knows them.

When someone in this thread says, “Thor’s creator” or “Star Lord’s creator,” I just think, c’mon folks! We’re fans! We KNOW these creators. These our are guys and gals, our creators, our fandom — Jack Kirby, Joe Simon, Steve Englehart, Keith Giffen, Ed Brubaker, Abnett and Lanning!

Some of these folks barely scraped by on their comics work, and this is work we love. Don’t we want to see them rewarded and awarded for their labors? Why shouldn’t Keith Giffen get as much financial reward for Star-Lord as Chris Pratt? All of our creators deserve more! We’re fans! We want great things for the joy they’ve brought us, don’t we?

[dreamglide]

The Marvel comics-to-movies/TV/etc pipeline has never been more efficient. We're now routinely seeing characters/concepts/stories make it to the screen less than a decade after publication, which, combined with the frustration of individuals like Brubaker makes me wonder what kind of comics the big two will be publishing in the near future. At this point, unless you get a rock-solid contract, it clearly isn't worth it to come up with new and exciting ideas at the big two.

[CosmiComic]

The Marvel comics-to-movies/TV/etc pipeline has never been more efficient. We're now routinely seeing characters/concepts/stories make it to the screen less than a decade after publication, which, combined with the frustration of individuals like Brubaker makes me wonder what kind of comics the big two will be publishing in the near future. At this point, unless you get a rock-solid contract, it clearly isn't worth it to come up with new and exciting ideas at the big two.

So you think maybe indie comics will take most of the talent?

[dreamglide]

So you think maybe indie comics will take most of the talent?

I think creators will look at the big two as a place to simply make their name while focusing on indie work, which, if successful, will lead to more monetary gain and presumably creative fulfillment. Maybe they stay at DC or Marvel while doing it, maybe not.

[CosmiComic]

I think creators will look at the big two as a place to simply make their name while focusing on indie work, which, if successful, will lead to more monetary gain and presumably creative fulfillment. Maybe they stay at DC or Marvel while doing it, maybe not.

But could these developments lead to worse storylines and characterizations at the big 2?

[inisideguy]

But could these developments lead to worse storylines and characterizations at the big 2?

Why would they? The creators and the publisher use each other. Writers are not going to write crap stories on purpose for big publishers. This whole idea doesnt make any sense.

[numberthirty]

No one is denying that Brubaker was doing work for hire when he was on Cap.

We’re just saying he deserves a little cut of the action is all, for coming up with Winter Soldier.

No one is claiming this is a situation like Kirby faced, or Siegel and Shuster, or even Jim Starlin. I’m not saying Brubaker has any kind of legal claim at all.

No, all I and we are saying is given the hundreds of millions if not billions Disney has earned off the Winter Soldier, isn’t the ethical thing to cut Brubaker in on a bit more of that action?

Why? Why does he deserve a cut of the action?

Put simply...

Marvel/Disney changed right around "Nothing...", and made a second round of profits off of work that was practically "110% Ed Brubaker..."

While he should just take the hit on the "Comics..." end of that it was work for hire?

He should absolutely be compensated a second time for that what was on the screen was almost completely his work.

[numberthirty]

I’m not going to double quote. But to your response above, he was ‘rewarded’ for his work, as capitalism assigns. He received his page rate. What you want is not capitalism. Capitalism has been accomplished. You want redistribution of wealth.

To this portion, when you say ‘should’, that’s not capitalism or a moral or ethical concern. ‘Disney should share…’ Why should they? He wasn’t screwed and did not receive less than agreed to. He assumed no risk in the situation. As per your capitalism, he would need to assume some of the risk in order to get a bigger portion of the reward.

Simply wrong...

What folks are calling for is a second round of compensation for the second round of Marvel/Disney using this creator's work.

[CosmiComic]

Why would they? The creators and the publisher use each other. Writers are not going to write crap stories on purpose for big publishers. This whole idea doesnt make any sense.

Yeah, I can see that

[numberthirty]

To me this is all nuts. Thor has made marvel/disney Billions. Thor is a public domain character. Now are people arguing well what about the people who have wrote Thor comics over the years don't they deserve part of the royalties from these Thor and Avengers movies? The Thor character isn't anything like the guy the Norse people invented 2000 years ago. So these comic writers and just pick one have done their own various versions of Thor. Do these guys get royalties? What if Jane Foster becomes Thor in the next movie? Does that guy who made Jane Foster deserve royalties? And say you say well yes the guy who wrote Jane Foster Thor deserves royalties. Wait he wasn't the first to do Jane Foster Thor. It was actually done in a what if comic back in the 70s. So this gets crazy convoluted.

If it looks a lot like Aaron's run where Jane was Thor(never mind that Gorr seems to be in the film...)?

Aaron should get a second found of compensation for Marvel/Disney using his work for a second time.

[numberthirty]

I think Marvel does have a similar program, but I think it depends on when the character was created. I believe the problem here ( hence why Ed is kicking himself) is that Winter Soldier is Bucky who was created by Simon/Kirby. Had WS been a completely new character "Chucky Carlson" or something...Brubaker would probably gotten a check or two from his appearances in the movies. As it is, Disney is making money from his story ideas and he's getting nothing aside from a credit.

Steve Englehart was upset for similar reasons when Nolan's Dark Knight came out. He felt the plot was based on a couple of Batman stories he did, but he wasn't getting paid for his ideas.

"Based On..." is one thing.

The instance we are discussing?

It is Brubaker's story lock/stock/barrel.

Marvel/Disney didn't "Base..." it on anything. They just put it onto the screen, and cashed in.

[numberthirty]

None of this is foreign or alien to me and I find it odd you’d prescribe thoughts to a stranger asking you questions.

I do not think you have answered the question other than screaming the word bonuses and calling me names. I’ve worked for years in supervisory capacities, making sure every month and quarter that proper bonuses and rewards and awards are given out. I get bonuses but what you’re saying isn’t a bonus or stock option scenario. Not even akin to a 401k.

You say that Disney should give a sum of money to a former contractor years later just because they can afford it.

Why should they? You and Jack continue to deflect away from this basic question. Why do I give bonuses to my team? They earned them. I’m more than happy to do it. They deserve more. What does Brubaker deserve and why does he deserve it?

What?

An amount he is comfortable with.

Why?

Because the guy earned the bonus the split second that Marvel/DC did almost nothing to rework Brubaker's story and made a bunch of money off of it.

[Mike_Murdock]

"they don't have to" is a dangerous mindset and a dangerous assumption. The only reason for that is that the comics business is a non-unionized business allowing companies to abuse and exploit and mistreat laborers in a way that no other media industry would get away with it (save video games I think).

Brubaker has the ability to write his own comics that he owns and can market for any kind of multimedia deal with its own arrangement. In fact, he's one of the best comic writers in the business. But the character doesn't have the success of Bucky Barnes. As great as his contribution was to the mythos, it was just that - a contribution - and one Brubaker benefitted from as much as Marvel did proportionally speaking.

[inisideguy]

I think many of you guys are trying to simplify this in a case like Brubaker. But take the guardians of the Galaxy and think how crazy complex this can get. The original creator of Guardians of the Galaxy. Then the all the individual characters within that movie hero and villans and everything else someone created Nova corp etc etc etc. The Guardians themselves and then the reinvention of those characters via different creators. Its impossible for Disney/ marvel to give some sort of fair deal of royalties to everyone who was involved at some point with the characters and other things within that movie. Many of you are not thinking this through at all.