Ed Brubabker Criticizes Disney/Marvel For Lack Of Winter Soldier Royalties

[inisideguy]

Oh, I totally get that it isn't a straight line. That's why we're talking about one of the few MCU movies where it really is a straight line -- I mean they called it The Winter Soldier and invited Brubaker to make a cameo, so they weren't pretending it wasn't an adaptation of his story. If they had adapted a novel and changed all the things they changed, they would still have had to pay the author.

Other times, obviously, the line isn't as clear. "WandaVision" was announced as being influenced by "House of M" and Tom King's "Vision" comic, but all it had in common with the former was "Wanda creates her own reality" and it didn't take anything from the latter except the name of the dog. Where would the line be drawn if they had a different policy, what could MCU take or not take from the comics... I have no idea. It's not my business anyway.

But it's definitely the case that if a movie company adapted one of Brubaker's creator-owned comics, and changed as much of it as the MCU changed of Winter Soldier, he'd be entitled to a big payday. He's not claiming that Marvel cheated him or that they have any legal requirement to pay him for adapting his story... but why shouldn't he feel bad about it?

Yea to me its pretty confusing. Your wandavison example is a good one. I mean the entire Infinity war Thanos story is another one right? Civil War?

[Brian B]

The thing is its not a straight line. And people on here keep acting like it is. I get some of the arguments but its not simple. And you are right thats what Lawyers are for. In all reality The winter soldier is Bucky. Yea he is changed. But so are a million other characters in comics over time. The MCU is adapting stories for sure. But good lord I am watching Agents of Shield. And in that show they are moving comic characters in and out all over the place. Ghost Rider just being one. Not the Johnny Blaze one. But hey Johnny Blaze was the original Ghost Rider. So the guy who created him deserves some money I would think. And then the guy who created the Robby Reyes Ghost rider probably deserves something. And well I couldn't tell you if they are adapting some of the stories that all of these Ghost Rider writers have done over time. Maybe they are I don't know every ghost rider story thats for sure. I mean we are not even getting into the cartoons, and various other merchandising issues. This is up to the writers and the company and the lawyers at the time when these things are being written. Brubaker isn't dumb. He knew what he was getting into when he sat down and wrote for marvel.

Yes, Ghost Rider is a great example of how royalties work in comics and their adaptations.

Read this sh!t and weep:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/gary-...sney_b_1282549

https://news.avclub.com/marvel-force...-gh-1798229802

But, lucky for Ghost Rider creator Gary Friedrich, he got a 2nd shot thanks to an appellate court decision and Marvel settled. Who knows what the amount was. Hopefully, they gave him something:
https://comicsalliance.com/marvel-se...ights-lawsuit/

Note also the mention at the bottom of the story from that last link about Kirby. It wasn’t until a Supreme Court case was put on the docket, which could have put significant portions of all of Disney’s IP at risk, that Marvel FINALLY settled with the Kirby estate. This is Kirby we’re talking about, creator or co-creator of most of the most recognizable stories and characters in the Marvel universe. Watching Marvel treat Kirby and his family so horribly, the guy who is as or more responsible than anyone else for that company even existing, is it really so much to ask for a slight improvement in how Marvel treats creators like Brubaker? No one is claiming he’s been so wronged by Marvel. We’re just saying, couldn’t Disney see fit to reward Brubaker a little more for his contribution to their billions and billions of dollars?

[Brian B]

Are you saying you know Brubakers annual salary? How do you know he isn't well compensated for what he does? I am not claiming I know. Heck he could have bought apple stock 10 years ago. He works a lot as far as I can see. But I don't know what he is paid, or what his financial situation is.

I don’t know Ed Brubaker’s financial situation except that he gets nothing for Winter Soldier being in movies and Disney+. How do we know? We know because Brubaker has told us he is paid NOTHING for the Winter Soldier as adapted for movie and TV screens. He was offered a little something for his brief cameo and an on-screen credit, but he wouldn’t cash it because it was so little. We know Brubaker is dissatisfied with his compensation from Marvel for Winter Soldier because he said so.

[inisideguy]

Yes, Ghost Rider is a great example of how royalties work in comics.

Read this sh!t and weep:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/gary-...sney_b_1282549

https://news.avclub.com/marvel-force...-gh-1798229802

But, lucky for Gary, he got a 2nd shot thanks to an appellate court decision and Marvel settled. Who knows what the amount was. Hopefully, they gave him something:
https://comicsalliance.com/marvel-se...ights-lawsuit/

Note also the mention at the bottom of that last link about Kirby. It wasn’t until a Supreme Court case which could have put significant portions of all of Disney’s IP at risk that Marvel FINALLY settled with the Kirby estate. This is Kirby we’re talking about, creator or co-creator of most of the most recognizable stories and characters in the Marvel universe. Watching a company treat Kirby and his family so horribly, is it really so much to ask for a slight improvement in how Marvel treats creators like Brubaker? No one is claiming he’s been so wronged by Marvel. We’re just saying, couldn’t Disney see fit to reward Brubaker a little more for his contribution to their billions and billions of dollars?

So you don't think Brubaker has benefitted financially in anyway since Marvel/ Disney has made the winter solider movie? This is where this goes in circles. Brubaker has become even more popular as a writer since that movie. When he goes to a convention when there were actually conventions you don't think he could up his price for giving a speech? Was that all because Brubaker wrote that comic story in the early 2000s or is it because Disney made a movie out of one of his stories? Everything he does is worth more now.

[numberthirty]

So you don't think Brubaker has benefitted financially in anyway since Marvel/ Disney has made the winter solider movie? This is where this goes in circles. Brubaker has become even more popular as a writer since that movie. When he goes to a convention when there were actually conventions you don't think he could up his price for giving a speech? Was that all because Brubaker wrote that comic story in the early 2000s or is it because Disney made a movie out of one of his stories? Everything he does is worth more now.

Which is a non-issue.

How much of his popularity is based on his work winding up on the screen(which is anything but a settled matter...) does not excuse Marvel/Disney using his work a second time without compensating him.

[inisideguy]

Which is a non-issue.

How much of his popularity is based on his work winding up on the screen(which is anything but a settled matter...) does not excuse Marvel/Disney using his work a second time without compensating him.

It's not a non issue. Brubaker has benifitted by Disney adapting one of his stories. Not as much as if they were directly compensating him. But if Disney had taken a different route and not ever made a winter soldier movie they would still be doing captain America movies. And Brubaker would be making less money than he is today. Brubakers stock went up when that story got adapted. Big time. And anyone who thinks it didn't is being naive.

[numberthirty]

It's not a non issue. Brubaker has benifitted by Disney adapting one of his stories. Not as much as if they were directly compensating him. But if Disney had taken a different route and not ever made a winter soldier movie they would still be doing captain America movies. And Brubaker would be making less money than he is today. Brubakers stock went up when that story got adapted. Big time. And anyone who thinks it didn't is being naive.

Which is really the only issue here.

Everything else?

It's amounts to an excuse for Marvel/Disney not doing what they should have done.

[inisideguy]

Which is really the only issue here.

Everything else?

It's amounts to an excuse for Marvel/Disney not doing what they should have done.

I will ask you again. Does Brubaker owe Disney any money because they adapted one of his stories and made him more famous and able to command more money for writing? And if not why not? If Brubaker walked into the Marvel office today and said hey I want to write a new winter soldier story you think they would pay him a lot more? I will bet ya they would. And the reason he could command a lot more money than he got for the first winter soldier story is because of the movie. Marvel would promote the crap out of it and print a zillion copies. Brubaker, could ask 6 figures. And Marvel/Disney would write the check.

[Jabare]

Welcome to the biz. He joins a large company of producers and writers in tv and film, who feel the same way. Wish him the best.

[numberthirty]

I will ask you again. Does Brubaker owe Disney any money because they adapted one of his stories and made him more famous and able to command more money for writing? And if not why not? If Brubaker walked into the Marvel office today and said hey I want to write a new winter soldier story you think they would pay him a lot more? I will bet ya they would. And the reason he could command a lot more money than he got for the first winter soldier story is because of the movie. Marvel would promote the crap out of it and print a zillion copies. Brubaker, could ask 6 figures. And Marvel/Disney would write the check.

Politely...

I'm not going to bother with answering a question that is a non-issue.

The only reason to do so would be to cover Marvel/Disney's butt, and I have right around "Zero..." interesting in doing so.


As for what is in green?

Personally, I think one would have to ignore quite a bit in order to even attempt to assert that.

Agree to disagree?

[numberthirty]

Past that...

It seems like it is probably time to point out the really obvious issue with the entire "Well... He Can Charge More For His Writing Now!..." angle.

He and Sean work for themselves through a deal with Image Comics.

Who is this "They..." he will be charging more for his writing?

Making "Well... He Can Charge More For His Writing Now!..." angle one more non-issue that is only really worth throwing out if one is trying to cover Marvel/Disney's butt.

Even then, it's not worth much.

[inisideguy]

Politely...

I'm not going to bother with answering a question that is a non-issue.

The only reason to do so would be to cover Marvel/Disney's butt, and I have right around "Zero..." interesting in doing so.


As for what is in green?

Personally, I think one would have to ignore quite a bit in order to even attempt to assert that.

Agree to disagree?

What is being asserted here is Brubaker didn't benefit from Marvel adapting one of his stories. He did. Not as much as many of you want. Thats it. Disney/Marvel has benefitted more. But this is the way things work. And people also keep acting like Brubaker is some dope that got ripped off. No one even knows the check they wrote or the royalties he gets from the original winter solider story. Nor do we know what he got for the 2nd one which was very popular. We don't know what he gets when people buy those graphic novels. I do know those sales exploded when that movie came out. And he got some of that. And those graphic novels still sell well today. And I would bet they sell more because of the movie and the character on tv. I am not claiming Disney is doing him right. However Brubaker has made a lot of money because of his story being adapted not in spite of it. And to not see that is silly. Brubaker was able to use the marvel brand and its characters to make himself some pretty good money. The winter solider doesnt exist if marvel doesnt give him the chance to write him in that original captain America story.

[numberthirty]

What is being asserted here is Brubaker didn't benefit from Marvel adapting one of his stories.

...

Politely...

No one is really asserting that.

Folks are outright saying that the guy should have been compensated a second time when his work was used for a second time.

About as simple as that.

[inisideguy]

Politely...

No one is really asserting that.

Folks are outright saying that the guy should have been compensated a second time when his work was used for a second time.

About as simple as that.

Politely I am arguing that because of the movie and tv show success he is being compensated for his work a second time. You just want him to be compensated directly by Disney.

[numberthirty]

Politely I am arguing that because of the movie and tv show success he is being compensated for his work a second time. You just want him to be compensated directly by Disney.

For anyone to seriously entertain such an idea?

They would have to ignore a whole lot of what they know about how the man's career has actually unfolded.