Marvel chars vs LOTR chars

[Postmania]

1) Aragorn vs Daredevil (S1 black costume and batons)
2) Legolas vs Hawkeye (MCU)
3) Tauriel vs Elektra (Netflix)
4) Boromir, Legolas, Gimli, Aragorn vs Winter Soldier
5) Cave Troll vs Loki
6) Balrog vs a a Space Whale

Who takes these?

[Dark Soul # 7]

Book or movie versions of the LOTR characters?

[Beadle]

Book or movie versions of the LOTR characters?

Valid question, but default is usually book.

1) Aragorn vs Daredevil (S1 black costume and batons)

I feel like I’m leaning towards Aragorn.

2) Legolas vs Hawkeye (MCU)

Assuming this isn’t Movie Captain Magicpants Legolas, I feel like Hawkeye’s only got to get close with an exploding arrow and it all falls apart for Legolas. Close is only good in horseshoes and hand-grenades... and explosive arrows.

3) Tauriel vs Elektra (Netflix)

Assuming Black Sky Elektra (the last version we saw), she tears through Tauriel.

4) Boromir, Legolas, Gimli, Aragorn vs Winter Soldier

If he shoots Legolas first, he might be OK, but I suspect numbers will win out.

5) Cave Troll vs Loki

Mind control for the win.

6) Balrog vs a a Space Whale

Balrog has way more damage output options. And Space Whales are so slow moving that I don’t think it would hit the Balrog.

[big_adventure]

Primary source is books, but it only takes 30 seconds

1) Aragorn vs Daredevil (S1 black costume and batons)

I'd give the win to DD against book OR movie Aragorn. Aragorn's a good fighter... against normies. DD has a range game Aragorn can't do a damn thing about, and significantly better reaction speed. DD in S1 casually catches an arrow fired from close outside while in a taxi swerving and bouncing about, with his dying girlfriend in his lap, having a heated argument with his old sensei. That's way beyond any non-Hobbit-Legolas nonsense in the films or the books.

2) Legolas vs Hawkeye (MCU)

Hawkeye beats book Legolas or LOTR movie Legolas thanks to better toys; Hawkeye loses badly to Hobbit trilogy Legolas.

3) Tauriel vs Elektra (Netflix)

Elektra slaughters Tauriel. Period.

4) Boromir, Legolas, Gimli, Aragorn vs Winter Soldier

Given that it's now explicit (Falcon & WS series makes it completely clear, if Civil War wasn't enough) that Bucky is a full-on Cap-level Super Soldier, even before counting the Vibranium arm: he mows down the book versions. He'll gun them before most can react, and he's easily quick enough with the arm to block an arrow or two, given how frequently he blocks bullets with it (aim-blocking not bullet timing, but more than good enough for Legolas). The movie versions, though, have magic flying elf guy and he's probably going to magically stick two teleporting arrows into Bucky's eyes or something.

5) Cave Troll vs Loki

Loki wins by many methods, not the least of which is that the cave troll probably can't hurt him if Loki let it hit him - which he will not.

6) Balrog vs a a Space Whale

Hmmmmmmm. Movie Balrog isn't fast and isn't particularly impressive on the scale of a thing that glides through skyscrapers without noticing or slowing down. Iron Man's super cutty laser thingies can't scratch the paint. The Gandalf fight was less impressive in the movie than the description Gandalf gives in the book as well. Movie Balrog can't hurt the whale, but I don't know that the whale can hit the Balrog unless the Balrog gets stupid. Book Balrog... might be strong or damaging enough to hurt the whale. Really not sure on that.

[Sharpandpointies]

I'll stick with primary canon where at all possible (huge surprise, I know).

1) Aragorn vs Daredevil (S1 black costume and batons)

Got a fight on our hands, here, but I'm giving this to book Aragorn. Matt isn't fast enough to blitz, though he enjoys a speed advantage. This is offset by Aragorn's clear strength advantage, armour (yep, by the end of the book he's running around in armour...Matt isn't, here), big reach advantage (sword), and tremendous skill. It's easy to forget that Aragorn has been fighting a fair chunk longer than Matt has been alive by this point, and has feats to prove it - he does stuff like 'fight his way across a battlefield at the head of an army (yes, leading from the front and killing everything in his way) then fight his way back across said battlefield, said battle lasting for hours.' Does he take a single injury? Nope. He's also fresh enough that long into the night he runs around doing stuff, like travel back and forth to different places in a city and outside of it to help heal people.

Worse, this is the arena - it's a straight-up fight, so Matt can't use stealth, the environment, or bounce his clubs off anything.

Going to give this to the scion of Númenor.

2) Legolas vs Hawkeye (MCU)

Interesting fight, but Book Legolas can remove arrows from his quiver, nock them, and draw faster than eyes can track (yet another feat straight from the book) and kill large, flying beasties by loosing a single arrow nearly straight-up into the air. The accuracy is easily enough to pin Clint at 100' range. Clint has explosive arrows and such, but he needs to take a moment to prep them (as shown in the movies), which...will get him killed, here (given Legolas's speed, taking a second to get the arrowhead on means Clint likely now has TWO arrows sticking out of him, with a third already on the way). His own accuracy isn't any worse than Legolas's - in fact, it's better - but since it's arrow against arrow at a range where neither has any difficulty hitting a man-sized thing somewhere mortal, I'm edging toward the guy who will 100% get his arrow in the air first: Legolas.

3) Tauriel vs Elektra (Netflix)

Having never seen Tauriel in action, and her not having any existence in the books, I cannot comment.

4) Boromir, Legolas, Gimli, Aragorn vs Winter Soldier

Winter Soldier is plenty fast, very tough, and has firearms. I'm not seeing him having a problem surviving an arrow if Legolas manages to hit him while he's shooting the crap out of everyone here. And, not being a dope, he's going to shoot the dude with the bow first.

5) Cave Troll vs Loki

Loki, given the kind of damage his knives do in the movies and the fact that he can simply render himself unseen or whatever else with illusions. I suspect this fight will get even worse when the series comes out, as Loki seems to get some better magic feats.

6) Balrog vs a a Space Whale

Book Balrog's fight with Gandalf wreaths an entire mountain-top with flames. And honestly, I'm having serious problems seeing the space-whale every actually getting it's teeth in the Balrog, given the speed with which Balrogs can fly/travel. The Demon of Might shouldn't have any problems playing keep-away, even by getting on the whale's back and hammering away with a big-ass sword. Might take a while, but I can't see the Balrog losing this.

Mileage may vary.

[Hrvojeos]

Here is my take.

1) I believe Daredevil. He has some supernatural abilities, and that would probably give him the edge. Still, Aragorn has a big motivation, born leader, unafraid of anything, led by love..., all those less touchable things are on his side. It would be a very interesting fight.

2) Oh, Legolas. They are not even close. For one, Legolas can just go away and live a thousand years Every capability is by far on Legolas's side, and if we are led with the Hobbit, it really is not even close. Tech that Hawkeye has is nothing, he wouldn't have any chance to do anything with it.

Here are a few of Legolas powers:

"He can hear what the stones are thinking. He can also sense the feelings of trees. Legolas does not need sleeping. He dreams while walking. When the rest are asleep, he stands by to watch. Later on, Legolas takes a nap with his eyes open. He is also very light, he does not sink into the snow, though he has the weight of a normal man. so this makes it difficult to track him. Elves have ties to a physical world, and they love it dearly. So they never die until the physical world dies. Elves do not get sick they don’t age, and they are difficult to kill." - credit Fiction Horizon

3) Even though I would say Electra, Tauriel is an Elf, so as the answer above, and it could be explained from the same info, I would give this one to Tauriel.

4) Really? All of them against Winter Soldier? I would separately probably put on all of them. But to be certain, Legolas and Aragorn. WS has super serum and a vibrarium arm, but really nothing more, and certainly isn't really too smart.

5) Loki, by far.

6) I would say Balrog. They were spirits, actually spirits that came to Middle-earth to help 'gods'. And even though the fight between Balrog and Gandalf seemed short and simple in the movie, we can't forget that Gandalf was actually considered as a kind of god - as per Tolkien; Source Wiki

[Postmania]

For the record, I actually was thinking movie when I made this, but if asked I would have done the "have two versions where one is book and one is movie" any way

Also forgot Legolas actually got better feats in the Hobbit trilogy apparently, those prequel upgrades

Since apparently Elektra smacks Tauriel, how would Black Widow do against her?

[Jackalope89]

Book-
1. Aragorn. Numenorians (Aragorn being a direct descendant) were superhuman by about every meaning of the word. And Aragorn, being in his 80s by the time LOTR rolls around, also gives him a huge experience advantage over the blind hero.
2. Legolas. While not medieval ninja of the movies, his archery puts Hawkeye to shame.
3. Tauriel does not exist so, Elektra wins by default.
4. Oof. Poor Bucky. Going against just one of these heroes would be a nightmare. But all of them? LOTR boys take it.
5. Cave trolls, while big and strong as hell, are also pretty stupid. Loki, should he not be stupid about things, should take it.
6. Er, I'm sadly unfamiliar with space whale. But Balrogs can basically be viewed as fallen/twisted angels. Hence why Gandalf (himself of that level) was the one to fight the Balrog.

Movies-
1. Closer, but I still give the advantage to Aragorn here.
2. Legolas. Elf ninja takes it. Too OP.
3. Tauriel takes it. Elves are not to overlooked. Even OC inserts like Tauriel.
4. Much closer, but with Elf-ninja, angry little man, and Super King, the trio takes it.
5. Loki.
6. I still lean towards Balrog.

[Sharpandpointies]

4. Oof. Poor Bucky. Going against just one of these heroes would be a nightmare. But all of them? LOTR boys take it.

I really need to ask - how is the group taking this, given Bucky's ridiculous feats and the fact that the Winter Soldier comes with firearms (pistols, minimum, and usually some kind of assault rifle) as standard equipment? Starting distance is 100', recall. Legolas is the only one with a chance, here, and Bucky stands at least an equal-to-better chance of simply shooting him dead (possibly while collecting an arrow somewhere painful).

The other guys need to cross 100' with him pumping them full of military-issue bullets.

[Sharpandpointies]

I'm seeing some stuff here in the thread that I'd like to address.

While the Balrog is a fallen Maia trapped in a physical Fana, on Rumbles we don't consider such things to be important. What we consider are FEATS. Now, the Balrog has some pretty darned good feats, so I'm not going to complain about the way people are voting. However, 'because he is a fallen angel' or 'because he was a Maia' or whathaveyou isn't a good reason to put the Balrog up as the victor.

He wreathes the tops of mountains with fire, he survives week-long battles against Gandalf, his death tears down part of a mountainside, he travels a ridiculous distance in a really short period of time when Morgoth is whining for his assistance, he has tons of stone fall on him and it does...meh, he's quite large with a honking big flaming sword...all of these are things we might use as reasons.

Secondly, Gandalf - I'm going here because it seems to come up a lot, and I feel it needs clarification.

Gandalf is not a Maia.

Olórin is a Maia. GANDALF is one of the Istari, Olórin stuffed into a mortal (if long-lived and inhumanly tough) body by his boss, and limited by such. He's subject to the frailties of mortality, he can die, and his powers are limited. Tolkien is pretty explicit about this, and goes into great detail in his essay on the subject, The Istari (a fun read if you find it - it's in Unfinished Tales, among other places).

'For with the consent of Eru [the Valar] sent members of their own high order, but clad in bodies as of Men, real and not feigned, but subject to the fears and pains and weariness of earth, able to hunger and thirst and be slain...whereas now [the Valar's] emissaries were forbidden to reveal themselves in forms of majesty, or to seek to rule the wills of Men or Elves by open display of power, but coming in shapes weak and humble were bidden to advise and persuade Men and Elves to good...'

'Who would go? For they must be mighty, peers of Sauron, but must forgo might, and clothe themselves in flesh so as to treat on equality and win the trust of Elves and Men. But this would imperil them, dimming their wisdom and knowledge, and confusing them with fears, cares, and weariness coming from the flesh.'

All quotes from 'The Istari', Unfinished Tales.

Their bodies are not Fana taken on by Maiar; they are 'real', not 'feigned', and subject to the 'fears and pains and weariness of earth'.

For all of that, they were powerful, and Gandalf - pushed to his limit - could defeat another similarly 'mortal' spirit: a Balrog, a spirit of fire and darkness that had cut itself off from Ilúvatar and taken on a body...much like one of the Istari, but without a whole lot of choice in the matter.

But he's not a Maia/an 'angel' of Tolkien's works. He's a Maia that has been explicitly limited and made mortal. Even Gandalf the White is still limited, though less-so than before he was brought back to life.