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  1. #31
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Mittens View Post
    Believe in the Wonder Woman who believes in you!

    A bit of a tangent, but gosh id love a Studio Trigger produced Wonder Woman anime
    Either Wonder Woman or Superman. Or both.

    Let's put any attempts at grounded realism on the shelf, at least for a little while. We need to Gurren Lagann the crap out of the DC universe.

  2. #32
    Extraordinary Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    I actually really like the music, but it perhaps would have been better if it was limited to that scene and the Amazons scene. Having Enya start up whenever the wind blows her hair slightly made it seem like a parody.



    Yes, her talking to the girl would be sweet and isn't a problem. It's just that a dude was bleeding from the skull a few feet away and the big gaping holes in the wall are visible behind her lol.
    No, I agree if the song were used way less than it did it'd be fine. I wasn't the biggest fan of the original Zimmer theme but I grew to like it eventually. It's like how much she just ended up spamming the "bracelets slam".

    Though "way less and it'd be fine" would probably be my review of the whole movie.

  3. #33
    Mighty Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyusmax View Post
    Eh, as they had Spider-man murdering people in IW/Endgame, and nobody's really said anything about it. I'm not so sure how much outrage there would be.



    Eh, Spider-Man wasn't killing humans though, he was killing 6 limbed CGI monsters who were no more than mindless drones in Thanos army. People don't care when Batman kills Parademons (neither do I tbh). They reduced the Black Order to goons who brag about how many world they have conquer and how loyal they are to Thanos (Steppenwolf had more characterization than any of them), and the one Spider-Man helped kill doesn't even talk (he does in the comics, but not in the movie).

    The Black Order was also 100% CGI and that matters, they put them in the uncanny valley and gave them basic personalities to dehumanize them as much a possible, which is what Snyder tried to do with the terrorist but it doesn't work as well because they are ordinary, non-CGI humans. For the Black Order, they took the most human looking in the comics(Proxima Midnight, a character who could have been done 100% practically), and made her CGI to dehumanized her as much as possible (without breaking to much from her silhouette in the comics) so people wouldn't care when Wanda sticks her in a giant buzz-saw. (And it works, people don't care that she dies or in such a horrific manner when you think about it.)

    So yes, if your friendly neighborhood Spider-Man hit a human so hard that his head blood was smeared against the wall, people would care.

    Edit: Actually, Snyder puts more effort into creating sympathetic elements in Steppenwolf's design than Marvel does for any of the Black Order. Steppenwolf's eyes for example, are incredibly large and expressive, eyes are very important in character design for expressing emotion and the Black Order's eyes by comparison are small and far apart.

    Quote Originally Posted by tyusmax View Post
    Also, I just want to say I understand that a lot of people had problems with WW killing the terrorists in that scene.
    But I do think the movie did showcase WW's caring/inspiring part of her character a lot.
    From her talking to the little girl after the terrorists to reaching out to Cyborg and trying to help him accept himself, I think these were really good WW moments.

    I like Wonder Woman reaching out to Cyborg, I don't have any complaints for that or anything else Wonder Woman does apart from most of the fight scenes.

    And I appreciate the movie trying to have Wonder Woman inspire people like she did with that little girl, but the background of that scene was riddled with the unnecessary damage she had caused and that was very distracting for me.
    Last edited by I'm a Fish; 04-17-2021 at 05:31 PM.

  4. #34
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I doubt it. Goku cares way too much about fighting to a dangerous and unhealthy degree. She might be okay with guys like Ichigo, Izuku or maybe Naruto (his tendency to forgive terrorists and war criminals notwithstanding).

    The only version of Diana I could see getting along with Goku is the one written by Johns in the initial New 52 Justice League.
    Hmmmmm ... Sure, he's a brain-damaged idiot, but Goku has a lot of traits I think Diana would admire. His main motive for studying martial arts is this idea that there are always threats out there, and that he has no other resource to use to deal with them. Diana has spent quite a lot of time studying combat to be better than most people at it. So while she might think he likes fighting too much, she'd not fault him for wanting to be capable of defeating those who threaten his family.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by marhawkman View Post
    Hmmmmm ... Sure, he's a brain-damaged idiot, but Goku has a lot of traits I think Diana would admire. His main motive for studying martial arts is this idea that there are always threats out there, and that he has no other resource to use to deal with them. Diana has spent quite a lot of time studying combat to be better than most people at it. So while she might think he likes fighting too much, she'd not fault him for wanting to be capable of defeating those who threaten his family.
    I guess. Goku's a bit inconsistent in that regard.
    Last edited by Agent Z; 04-18-2021 at 01:51 AM.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Sad lamentation music plays as we read Year One, and have to deal with the fact that Diana not killing the villains means we sympathize with the terrorists
    Why? Even if you don't like her killing them, what makes the terrorists sympathetic?

  7. #37
    Extraordinary Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Why? Even if you don't like her killing them, what makes the terrorists sympathetic?
    They're not but I've seen some conflating thinking WW killing them was overkill with saying that means they also think the terrorists were sympathetic.

  8. #38
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Why? Even if you don't like her killing them, what makes the terrorists sympathetic?
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    They're not but I've seen some conflating thinking WW killing them was overkill with saying that means they also think the terrorists were sympathetic.
    Yes, Gaius is correct in that is what I was getting at. Saying we don't want to see Wonder Woman kill human villains means we sympathize with terrorists and don't care about their victims or something.

    I don't care about the terrorists themselves at all. If Wolverine was chopping them up I'd cheer.

  9. #39
    Incredible Member Psy-lock's Avatar
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    Perez's run is my favorite overall but his Diana is a tad too serious and refined for my tastes. Ditto for Rucka. I love the sass and humor she had in Marston's run and wish the subsequent writers kept that. Messner-Loebs probably came closest to my preferred take on Diana and the current writer is also doing a great job.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psy-lock View Post
    Perez's run is my favorite overall but his Diana is a tad too serious and refined for my tastes. Ditto for Rucka. I love the sass and humor she had in Marston's run and wish the subsequent writers kept that. Messner-Loebs probably came closest to my preferred take on Diana and the current writer is also doing a great job.
    Do you think George Perez making Wonder Woman as a ambassador was a good or bad idea?

  11. #41
    Mighty Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahina View Post
    Do you think George Perez making Wonder Woman as a ambassador was a good or bad idea?
    It should have been a good idea under Rucka's run because she has diplomatic immunity and then the U.S. government couldn't have prosecuted her for snappy-snapping Lord's neck.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    William Messner-Loeb is my favourite Wonder Woman writer when it comes to her voice. He really nailed the fun loving side along with the sass and the talent for reassuring others, and he did it all in a very natural way to me, with the right words and actions. When she cared about someone it wasn't because they were nice or simple, it was because they had something interesting in them that she liked. I'd say he just lacked the poetic voice. Diana should have something of an artist in how she interacts with the world. Playing with things and finding the uniqueness in them.
    This! Messner-Loebs is my favorite WW writer. She knew how powerful she was, but didn't feel the need to flaunt. She cares about people, and even with villains, she tried to de-escalate without violence. And he wrote a Diana who turned enemies into friends more than any other writer since Marston. I just wish he'd been paired with an artist was better at drawing the more human stories Loebs was trying to tell. I understand that Deodato was new, that his layouts were exciting, and that sales went up. But the kind of art he was producing for the title didn't match the kinds of stories Loebs was telling. I also think, in the later part of his run, Loebs was trying to adapt his storytelling to Deodato's strengths somewhat, but that still didn't make them a great match. On the other hand, I'm glad we got Artemis and her insanely long ponytail out of it!

  13. #43
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    I really do feel like the Messner-Loebs' run is highly underestimated, specially in Diana's characterization.

  14. #44
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    I liked Greg Rucka's interpretation, there's something fascinating about that,
    I don't mind the current interpretation by DCEU (which is sort of inspired by N52 JL version) that Diana is a warrior princess who likes fighting,
    but I would prefer a more pacifist take.

  15. #45
    Extraordinary Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalai View Post
    I liked Greg Rucka's interpretation, there's something fascinating about that,
    I don't mind the current interpretation by DCEU (which is sort of inspired by N52 JL version) that Diana is a warrior princess who likes fighting,
    but I would prefer a more pacifist take.
    I can see New 52 JL Wonder Woman in BvS/Snyder Cut, but I can't really say it's present in her own solo films. At least imo.

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