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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalai View Post
    I liked Greg Rucka's interpretation, there's something fascinating about that,
    I don't mind the current interpretation by DCEU (which is sort of inspired by N52 JL version) that Diana is a warrior princess who likes fighting,
    but I would prefer a more pacifist take.
    Is it a contradiction for Wonder Woman to be a warrior and pacifist?

  2. #47
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    We've had this discussion in the controversial opinions thread, but the Warrior / Pacifist duality isn't contradictory, it's just a weakness.

    Diana is supposed to be a wish fulfillment character, more even than Black Panther and Black Lightning. When you decide she should be a pacifist and that is also a warrior you end up making her into a character whose main job is everything she hates.

    It's like an enviromentalist working as a lawyer for an oil company. Sure, he could further his cause from the inside, but is it really wish fulfillment? Doesn't she lose that symbolism of something to radically excite and inspire? It's such a subdued expression.

    My personal take is that she should be a wrestler instead of a warrior, and instead of an ambassador she should be an organizer.

  3. #48
    The Last Dragon masterwitcher88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahina View Post
    Is it a contradiction for Wonder Woman to be a warrior and pacifist?
    No its not, her liking to fight does change the fact that she fights for peace. Also Diana has NEVER been a pacifist. I've never liked Nu52 Diana because everywhere she goes she has to say something about fighting or battles or war and suddenly its her most annoy character trait. We get it Geoff Johns, she likes fighting you don't need to tell us this every time she's on page like her theme in Zack's JL.

    let me give you a scenario... Lets say you run a hotel and this hotel has one rule, no violence. Some time passes and one tenet gets into a fist fight with another one threating to kill him, Do you 1) use violence to stop the attack or 2) say "oh well, the rule says no violence so my hands are tied" . The correct answer, and there is a correct one, is 1. And THIS is what superheroes do. Wonder Woman, Superman, Green Lantern, Batman, all of them do this as part of their day to day lives. Call it wrestling, call it whatever you want its not going to change that take.
    Zaldrīzes Buzdari Iksos Daor

  4. #49
    Incredible Member Amazon Swordsman's Avatar
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    A simple way to put it for me, is that Diana is warrior in the garden, rather than a gardener in war, or a gardener who nurtures war. Gail Simone said it best imo, if you want to stop a war, call Wonder Woman. She should be a war ender/stopper. She can do that, and still advocate for peace and it not be a contradiction. War is sometimes necessary to maintain peace, because the world is not committed to peace. A gardener is easy pickings in a war, so itís beneficial to know the ways of the warrior to fight for and secure the peace.

  5. #50
    The Last Dragon masterwitcher88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amazon Swordsman View Post
    A simple way to put it for me, is that Diana is warrior in the garden, rather than a gardener in war, or a gardener who nurtures war. Gail Simone said it best imo, if you want to stop a war, call Wonder Woman. She should be a war ender/stopper. She can do that, and still advocate for peace and it not be a contradiction. War is sometimes necessary to maintain peace, because the world is not committed to peace. A gardener is easy pickings in a war, so it’s beneficial to know the ways of the warrior to fight for and secure the peace.
    Famous Bruce Lee quote, I like it and yes to this exactly.
    Zaldrīzes Buzdari Iksos Daor

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterwitcher88 View Post
    No its not, her liking to fight does change the fact that she fights for peace. Also Diana has NEVER been a pacifist. I've never liked Nu52 Diana because everywhere she goes she has to say something about fighting or battles or war and suddenly its her most annoy character trait. We get it Geoff Johns, she likes fighting you don't need to tell us this every time she's on page like her theme in Zack's JL.

    let me give you a scenario... Lets say you run a hotel and this hotel has one rule, no violence. Some time passes and one tenet gets into a fist fight with another one threating to kill him, Do you 1) use violence to stop the attack or 2) say "oh well, the rule says no violence so my hands are tied" . The correct answer, and there is a correct one, is 1. And THIS is what superheroes do. Wonder Woman, Superman, Green Lantern, Batman, all of them do this as part of their day to day lives. Call it wrestling, call it whatever you want its not going to change that take.
    I always saw Wonder Woman as a adventurer more than a warrior.

    I think Wonder Woman should be written as a anti-war activist instead.

  7. #52
    The Last Dragon masterwitcher88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahina View Post
    I always saw Wonder Woman as a adventurer more than a warrior.

    I think Wonder Woman should be written as a anti-war activist instead.
    Its weird that people think you can't have her be both an adventurer and wrestler and whatever else and still be considered a warrior. She is all these things, none are mutually exclusive to one another. Its almost like she's a multidimensional character with different traits that describe who she is and not a one note character with only one characterization.

    Diana has always been anti-war...
    Zaldrīzes Buzdari Iksos Daor

  8. #53
    Extraordinary Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterwitcher88 View Post
    No its not, her liking to fight does change the fact that she fights for peace. Also Diana has NEVER been a pacifist. I've never liked Nu52 Diana because everywhere she goes she has to say something about fighting or battles or war and suddenly its her most annoy character trait. We get it Geoff Johns, she likes fighting you don't need to tell us this every time she's on page like her theme in Zack's JL.
    .
    Gods, yes. If I never hear Diana described with some variation of "a warrior born/warrior goddess" again it'll still be too soon.

  9. #54
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    I liked Gail Simone's portrayal of Wonder Woman's character.

    ĒDonít kill if you can wound, donít wound if you can subdue, donít subdue if you can pacify, and donít raise your hand at all until youíve first extended it.Ē

  10. #55
    Incredible Member Amazon Swordsman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahina View Post
    I liked Gail Simone's portrayal of Wonder Woman's character.

    ”Don’t kill if you can wound, don’t wound if you can subdue, don’t subdue if you can pacify, and don’t raise your hand at all until you’ve first extended it.”
    Love this too. Very few people “get” her voice right, much less her philosophy.

  11. #56
    Incredible Member Fuzzy Mittens's Avatar
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    Ah, I can see why people have objections to the warrior/peacemaker combination. I recall numerous scenes in recent years where they put a huge emphasis on combat and bloodshed as things which Diana aspires to. A random example that pops into my head is the Black Hammer/Justice League crossover wherin the league is trapped in a sleepy farm town and cannot leave. With us being treated to a scene where Diana describes herself as a warrior who cannot stand being in such a peaceful and serene locale, declaring that her life was naught but constant combat.

    The issue this creates is that often times a writer will pick up Wonder Woman as part of a team sort of thing and just see 'warrior for peace' and wont necessarily try to understand what this means and just default to 'warrior'

  12. #57
    Mighty Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Mittens View Post
    Ah, I can see why people have objections to the warrior/peacemaker combination. I recall numerous scenes in recent years where they put a huge emphasis on combat and bloodshed as things which Diana aspires to. A random example that pops into my head is the Black Hammer/Justice League crossover wherin the league is trapped in a sleepy farm town and cannot leave. With us being treated to a scene where Diana describes herself as a warrior who cannot stand being in such a peaceful and serene locale, declaring that her life was naught but constant combat.

    The issue this creates is that often times a writer will pick up Wonder Woman as part of a team sort of thing and just see 'warrior for peace' and wont necessarily try to understand what this means and just default to 'warrior'


    Is it really that hard to imagine Diana in times of peace? There's this activity called "sports" that I am sure Diana would love to pursue.

  13. #58
    Astonishing Member marhawkman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Gods, yes. If I never hear Diana described with some variation of "a warrior born/warrior goddess" again it'll still be too soon.
    Well, the problem isn't if she's a warrior but whether she's aggressive. Fighting to protect others is very much a "warrior" thing to do.

  14. #59
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    My preferred characterization for Diana exists in the hypothetical sphere. It's a modernized version of the Golden Age take.

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