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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member mathew101281's Avatar
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    Default The difference between the dc trinity and the Flash and Green Lantern.

    Flash and Green Lantern is more of a title while Superman, Batman and Wonderwoman are characters. Green Lantern and Flash both had lengthy periods of time where other characters were wearing the costume other then the “main” character. But if you do the same thing with a member of the trinity people would freak out. I think it stems from the fact that Hal Jordan and Barry Allen themselves are reboots in a way.

  2. #2
    Incredible Member prepmaster's Avatar
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    Batman is a symbol that is larger than Bruce Wayne himself. Its not the man under the cowl, its what Batman does that defines him. Batman is a figure that strikes from the shadow and instills fear onto criminals.
    Last edited by prepmaster; 04-19-2021 at 05:57 AM.

  3. #3
    Astonishing Member Tzigone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prepmaster View Post
    Batman is a symbol that is larger than Bruce Wayne himself. Its not the man under the cowl, its what Batman does that defines him. Batman is a figure that strikes from the shadow and instills fear onto criminals.
    I do not agree with this assessment. To me, Batman is Bruce Wayne. It is definitely the man under the cowl that defines him to me. Then again, I'm on record as not liking legacies, as a general rule. I'd much rather new heroes make their own names great (and not remove or diminish the existing characters from the field, either). Both as a reader and from an in-universe perspective, this is my preference, though I understand the business reasons for doing otherwise.

  4. #4
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Any type of "battle for the cowl" for characters who've been ingrained in popular culture will always end up the same way. You may see Diana replaced by a Wonder Girl for a while, you may see Clark's son get some spotlight or we could have the occasional non-Bruce Batman run, but in the grand scheme of things that won't really amount to anything. Replacing Bruce with Dick or Jace would be like when Steve was replaced by Bucky and Sam. The new characters would get a chance to shine for a while, may even get a TV show if they're lucky, but in the end everyone expects "the one true" Cap would remain in his position and that's how it always would be whether the MCU existed or not.

    People don't see characters like Barry and Hal like that because DC never treated them like that. They were neither above replacing them, killing them off or character assassinating them. Even if they've done questionable things with the Trinity over the years, when all is said and done they will never damage them beyond repair because they simply need those characters for decades to come. They never needed Barry or Hal like that, especially the latter who depending on the management, has been treated as little more than irrelevant, always-replaceable, stone-stepping entity who apparently not only should be treated as if he has no place in a modern superhero universe but even presents an issue towards progress. When there's not only lack of consistency with some of those characters, but they've also been deliberately treated as a problem that had to be dealt with, you create certain perceptions about them that make them feel infinitely more insignificant than those you've treated better over the decades.
    Last edited by Johnny; 04-19-2021 at 07:56 AM.

  5. #5
    Extraordinary Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    I would think it's a bunch of factors, including that yes, Barry and Hal weren't the Golden Age originals like Bruce and Clark. I think part of it is also the strength of their origins and how the characters' origins define their respective superhero identities and mythos. Clark sent from Krypton, raised in Smallville etc is a huge part of what defines Superman. Bruce in the alley next to his dead parents is a huge part of what defines Batman. Test pilot Hal selected to be a Green Lantern is not what the Green Lantern concept is about. Hal fits into what the GLC represents, but not the other way around. Barry being doused in chemicals is not the point of being the Flash. Johns tried really hard to make both their origins as meaningful to the costumed identity as Bruce and Clark, and ymmv in terms of how it helped Hal and Barry, but it didn't really help define the Green Lantern of Flash concepts. Cooke did a pretty good job for Hal with "New Frontier" to show how the character and the mythos are tied together, but the very idea that Hal is just one of a corps immediately invites multiple characters.

  6. #6
    Incredible Member prepmaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzigone View Post
    from an in-universe perspective
    Batman is a figure that instills fear onto criminals. It would be a waste to let that figure dies out. When Bruce dies, there would still be a need for Batman. However in comics, Bruce isnt gonna die.
    Last edited by prepmaster; 04-19-2021 at 09:08 AM.

  7. #7
    DC Comics Forum Mod The Darknight Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mathew101281 View Post
    Flash and Green Lantern is more of a title while Superman, Batman and Wonderwoman are characters. Green Lantern and Flash both had lengthy periods of time where other characters were wearing the costume other then the “main” character. But if you do the same thing with a member of the trinity people would freak out. I think it stems from the fact that Hal Jordan and Barry Allen themselves are reboots in a way.
    The reason is Clark, Bruce, and Diana are more well known without their costumes than almost every other superhero with theirs.
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  8. #8
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Darknight Detective View Post
    The reason is Clark, Bruce, and Diana are more well known without their costumes than almost every other superhero with theirs.
    That's really the best way of putting it.

  9. #9

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    The death of Barry Allen pretty much opened the door for replacing Hal Jordan, and as consequence we've had several speedsters and Green Lantern's running about since (John & Guy aside)

    Your right, it's pretty much about the jumpsuit than the actual character now for Flash, and more particularly GL.

    I imagine fans of the trinity don't want the same thing happening to Bruce or Clark, because they've seen how easily replaceable Hal & Barry or Wally have become, and do not wish them to share the same fate.

  10. #10
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Nostalgia View Post
    The death of Barry Allen pretty much opened the door for replacing Hal Jordan, and as consequence we've had several speedsters and Green Lantern's running about since (John & Guy aside)

    Your right, it's pretty much about the jumpsuit than the actual character now for Flash, and more particularly GL.

    I imagine fans of the trinity don't want the same thing happening to Bruce or Clark, because they've seen how easily replaceable Hal & Barry or Wally have become, and do not wish them to share the same fate.
    Indeed, no Trinity fans I’ve talked to are enthusiastic about the idea of divorcing the mantles from the characters they originated with. We’ve seen where that leads with others.
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  11. #11
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    The thing with the Green Lantern's is, that there have always been a whole core of them, and that basically everyone (with sufficient willpower) at any time can be selected to be a member, which makes it in story way easier to introduce new Lanterns or to replace Hal with another Lantern, than it is with any member of the Trinity.

  12. #12
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    Green Lantern, Flash and Batman are all titles really but unlike Green Lantern Flash and Batman are known for one main person (Barry and Bruce) while with GL (earth ones anyway) it seems fairly split between Hal, John and sometimes Kyle.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Nostalgia View Post

    I imagine fans of the trinity don't want the same thing happening to Bruce or Clark, because they've seen how easily replaceable Hal & Barry or Wally have become, and do not wish them to share the same fate.
    Yup. The Batman franchise is already irritating enough with a large Batfamily, and a vocal minority of Batfans who put Batfamily members on a pedestal and hate on Bruce Wayne, but at least Bruce has been and remains the head of the franchise. If the mantle of Batman became like Flash or GL, I'd probably have to stop reading the Batbooks.

  14. #14
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    Indeed, no Trinity fans I’ve talked to are enthusiastic about the idea of divorcing the mantles from the characters they originated with. We’ve seen where that leads with others.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheBatman View Post
    Yup. The Batman franchise is already irritating enough with a large Batfamily, and a vocal minority of Batfans who put Batfamily members on a pedestal and hate on Bruce Wayne, but at least Bruce has been and remains the head of the franchise. If the mantle of Batman became like Flash or GL, I'd probably have to stop reading the Batbooks.
    Yeah, the legacies and mantle sharing the fandom infighting that resulted from them have made the Flash and GL franchises difficult to enjoy.

    The Trinity fandoms have their own issues, adding this on top of it sounds absolutely nightmarish. It'd be like pouring gasoline onto already raging fires.

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