Superman: son of Kal-El

[HsssH]

Just to give you an idea, it is as if in the 1960s they had published a comic book where Superman wore a beatnik beret while playing bongos and saying "Make love not war, man!". With one difference - in Silver Age that would have rightfully be very ironic. Whereas Taylor wants the readers to take his Superman in jail very seriously, as if he was writing something socially relevant. What the heck, it's a Superman comic book! Make the character discover a planet full of magic flying piranhas who eat smog and have him solve the problem of climate change by making Superman unleash the piranhas in Earth's atmosphere. Yes, of course, it wouldn't be realistic. But is putting an incredibly powerful character in jail for, I don't know, one night, without making him use his powers in an effective way more realistic? Or even interesting? I mean, that's the point - what's so interesting about Jon in the end? Take the more or less fake awareness away, or the sexual orientation - never fully developed story-wise but sensationalistic enough to make some sites speak about it for a couple of days - and what you are left with is a very generic Superman story where Superman has an ugly hairstyle. By comparison, some Gen13 stories from the 1990s look written by Alan Moore.

Common argument is that such storylines would be disrespectful to real people struggling with these problems. For example, fans want Wonder Woman as an icon for feminism/LGBT, but they don't want storylines where she was active in early 20th century and participated in these movements that gave women right to vote and so on. So you know, idea probably is that if Jon actually did something to fight climate change then activists (and people in general who care about this subject) would be offended. DC would piss off audience that they supposedly want to attract.

Lets take another example, Ennis thinks that Captain America is a disgrace to real WW2 soldiers. Common counter argument is that Captain America was actually popular with the soldiers so Ennis is full of ****. So question is, how do we know that people interested in feminism/LGBT/climate change would be offended if WW or Jon actually did something? DC probably thinks its better to be safe than sorry and well, thats why we are where we are.

[rpmaluki]

Future State's Imperial Lex comes to mind where Superman knew what the problem and solution were but it wasn't so simple. That story didn't conclude well but I liked the questions it raised while showing Superman doing his thing in a unsuspectingly complex situation. Watching Jon in a similar position of constantly trying to find a super but workable solution for every problem that crops up, including the ones born as consequences of his his own actions, showing the POV of the people he's trying to help, like what if there are people who don't want to be saved along with the ones who clearly do? How does Jon deal with that? Show the complexity of the story, don't gloss over it. Show Jon's progression in dealing with these situations, don't show him as already knowing what to do (and succeeding), he needs a learning curve to what needs to be done as opposed to what's been done before. Taylor may be doing that for all I know but I get the feeling that's not the case. Jon's book should not be only filled with headline grabbing moments but should be delving deeper, further than the veneer. Jon being arrested could have a been a great little arc, a three issue maybe and do not have Superman bailing him out, that was belittling to everything they are trying to do with him at the moment. Maybe he should have waited until Clark was off world or something.It sounds like I'm asking for a little deconstruction, and maybe I am and with Jon. He needs something, anything at this stage.

[Myskin]

Common argument is that such storylines would be disrespectful to real people struggling with these problems. For example, fans want Wonder Woman as an icon for feminism/LGBT, but they don't want storylines where she was active in early 20th century and participated in these movements that gave women right to vote and so on. So you know, idea probably is that if Jon actually did something to fight climate change then activists (and people in general who care about this subject) would be offended. DC would piss off audience that they supposedly want to attract.

Ok, so they'd basically tackle with climate change WITHOUT tackling with climate change in the style and form you'd think a superhero book would deal with it? Isn't it even more disrespectful - I mean, they slap protesters on a cover just to sell a bunch of copies more? Thankfully I don't know any climate change activist who reads superhero books.

All in all, unfortunately superhero books really have become the scourge of comics in general. They don't have anything to do with art - the mere idea seems laughable - but they don't have anything to do with clever entertainment either. The moment when mangas (or BD, whatever) make them disappear from the market will never come too soon.

[rpmaluki]

Superhero comics may not be the pinnacle of great storytelling any more but throwing the baby out with the bathwater isn't really an option either. These books for all their faults still count for something even if most of us readers don't necessarily subscribe to that anymore. They need to adapt, not die and that should work in tandem with creativity (not to deface what's come before but enhance it).

[D.Z]

He seems to be another woke bomb sales wise. And I say this as multiple minorities in one.

[Superboy-Prime]

He seems to be another woke bomb sales wise. And I say this as multiple minorities in one.

As a proud Kryptonian, I say that his sales are THE bomb. In a good way. Nightwing's gonna get 'em even higher too.

[ZuLuLu]

He seems to be another woke bomb sales wise. And I say this as multiple minorities in one.

It is not at least based on digital numbers.

The last issue ranked above Spider-Man on ComiXology. All the released issues was still ranked in the top 100 this week on Amazon.

As for ICv2 top 50 ranking, there are months Robin which by all accounts is a good seller don't make the rankings as was the case with Robin Annual.

I hope with the buzz Action Comics is getting sales increases but base on the numbers we do have Son of Kal-el is still the selling better than any book that is not part of the Bat-Family if the book stabilize around or just below what it is currently selling it is not going to be cancel any time soon.

[Vordan]

As a proud Kryptonian, I say that his sales are THE bomb. In a good way. Nightwing's gonna get 'em even higher too.

I’m expecting the Nightwing crossover to boost Jon’s sales up as well.

It is not at least based on digital numbers.

The last issue ranked above Spider-Man on ComiXology. All the released issues was still ranked in the top 100 this week on Amazon.

As for ICv2 top 50 ranking, there are months Robin which by all accounts is a good seller don't make the rankings as was the case with Robin Annual.

I hope with the buzz Action Comics is getting sales increases but base on the numbers we do have Son of Kal-el is still the selling better than any book that is not part of the Bat-Family if the book stabilize around or just below what it is currently selling it is not going to be cancel any time soon.

Jon’s selling fine as far as I can see. Better than Kaldur whom they continue to push despite his mini bombing, and Taylor can get his scripts turned in on time unlike Joelle which is what got Yara’s WG book cancelled I expect. Barring another major change at the top in terms of direction, I expect Jon will get to keep going as Superman until Williamson wraps up his story at the very least (since the JL will be “dead” and if Clark is one of the “dead” that means Jon is going to be the only Superman again).

[HsssH]

Yeah, from all the "replacements" Jon is doing the best probably.

[Vordan]

Yeah, from all the "replacements" Jon is doing the best probably.

Similar to Jace I think Jon’s going to live or die by what happens when they do a “Jon Kent Superman” adaption in film. “Jon” is already getting adapted as a kid but the longevity of the current take really depends on how well a major adaption with a lot of money at stake is received. Good comparison would be what the MCU is doing. ANAD Marvel was a massive flop with a few exceptions. Marvel attempting to replace their mainstays with more “diverse and progressive” mains resulted in low sales to the point Marvel undid it all. But now that stuff is getting used in the MCU, and you’re starting to see it return. Sam will be Cap again. Jane is going to be Thor. Personally I still think the next time we get a white Superman on film it will likely be a Jon adaption where he takes over for Sasha after she’s done, and that will be his make it or break it moment.

Till then I think the sales look fine enough for DC to just let Taylor keep doing what he wants with Jon.

[DABellWrites]

Ok, so they'd basically tackle with climate change WITHOUT tackling with climate change in the style and form you'd think a superhero book would deal with it? Isn't it even more disrespectful - I mean, they slap protesters on a cover just to sell a bunch of copies more? Thankfully I don't know any climate change activist who reads superhero books.

All in all, unfortunately superhero books really have become the scourge of comics in general. They don't have anything to do with art - the mere idea seems laughable - but they don't have anything to do with clever entertainment either. The moment when mangas (or BD, whatever) make them disappear from the market will never come too soon.

Superhero comics are never going away. They're intrinsic in the medium and has loyal fans. If anything, I see more people going to do their own superheroes rather than just give all their ideas to DC/Marvel. DC and Marvel may become more a niche in the industry, seeing where things are going. The name of the game is going to be original titles going into the future.

[DABellWrites]

I was replying to someone, but it kinda got away from me so its open to everyone now.

If it looks like a character, walks like a character, and talks like a character, they are a character. Just because Jon hadn't fully developed as a character in some people's eyes doesn't mean he wasn't a viable enough character to stick around as is. Yes, Jon upon his introduction was basically "Clark Jr." But who else was he supposed to be? If given enough time, we would've been allowed to tell a more diverse amount of Jon stories that would've shed this bland reputation that he's been saddled with.

What a lot of people can't seem to understand is that "Jon is just Clark Jr." was just a seed, a starting point, a basic premise simple enough that it's good on its own in the short run but also leaves room for future expansion and development, that was planted in the fertile soil of Rebirth. Trees don't grow overnight and neither do characters. By the end of Jon's first two years, he had barely sprouted above the soil but was developed enough to have really resonated with fans. Super Sons of Tomorrow felt every bit the conclusion to the emotional arc the Super Sons had been on since they first teamed up two years ago, and that was just their first arc. People were excited to see more from the Super Sons, in both singles- and tag-team competition, to borrow a metaphor from pro wrestling.

It wasn't unreasonable at the time to think in no more than five years after his debut that, if given that time to have more stories written about him and develop him further, Jon would eventually get his own solo book where he was finally on his own For The First Time Ever^TM. A book dedicated all to him and give him that alleged oh-so-needed character development (even though he would have had at most five years of character development that justified giving him a solo in the first place).

By the end of those five years, Jon would've been reasonably "developed" enough to satisfy even the biggest skeptics of his character and warrant finally giving him a solo book. Combined with what was supposed to be three more years of character development for him, people would no longer see him as Clark Jr. but finally as Jon Kent, Superboy. If Jon hadn't been aged up but still got a solo book that was announced and released on the same day as SSoK was, people would've considered that late but inevitable.

What I don't understand is this impatience so many people have with Jon as a character. Like, did you expect him to pop out of Convergence with a complete character bio and history? It takes time to develop those things, so of course you're not going to see Jon bear fruit after just two years. He had barely gotten started as character (and what a start it was) before they just slapped the reset button and still haven't justified doing so so early into Jon's existence and lifespan as character. I mean, look at him. DC has stunted his growth and they refuse to acknowledge that they even did anything to him.

You make good points, but why did it need to take Jon five years to get his own solo book? Connor had his own book within a year. So did Bart. Tim got his own solo in 1993 after several mini-series(s?). Now, I know it took Damian years to get his own solo book, which is shocking for a Batman character and the son of Bruce Wayne at that. Not every character is going to get their own book (*looks at Cassie*), but for the son of Superman not to get his own Superboy book? Just seems strange, especially when Connor wasn't around during Rebirth at all (New52 Superboy had his own book). Like, was the whole point of Jon was to make him Superman fast as possible?

[DABellWrites]

You're not understanding that I don't disagree with that, but just that the way those traits are expressed would and should be different because he's a different person.



That's a longer and more nuanced conversation than I feel like having on here these days. But to sum it up (while still being pretty long), Bendis' Jon in Legion was kind of a fun little dip **** who also happened to be charismatic enough to the people around him that they'd let him slide on stuff they probably shouldn't. And on top of that he maintained this sense of awe and wonder, and had a willingness to try new things. He'd also just flat out ignore rules in a way that wasn't like very rebellious, but rather just adorably flippant, and as stated before he'd just hope a combination of his strength and charm could get him out on top. He was a character that didn't think ahead more than one move, but had so much faith in himself and the people around him that it would be enough.

One of the most inspired aspects of that run is the fact even though Jon was asked to the future for this great and important reason, and he should've totally spent more time training and what not...he spends the vast majority of his time seeing the sights, kissing his girlfriend, and eating cool alien food. It's so unique and special that viewed that time as his actual college years. And it's an idea Bendis gives a voice to when Jon tells his dad that he doesn't want to go to normal school anymore.

Bendis' Jon took the line between Superman/Superboy and his "normal" life and did away with it. Again, an idea that is given voice when Jon tells Clark that he doesn't see the point of a secret identity.

So when you fast forward to Taylor's super stiff and joyless take that yearns for a "normal" life and is sheepish about everything, it's total whiplash.

Edit: Benids' Jon was the kid at the college party who can't dance to save his life, but is the first one on the floor leading the dace. Taylor's Jon is the kid at the party who can't dance...and has decided to sit over to the side for the reminder of the night refilling drinks or some other lame **** like that.

You should like, write Jon. You always make him seem interesting.

[Superlad93]

You should like, write Jon. You always make him seem interesting.

I appreciate that, thank you!

I'd never place myself above these people that do this for a living, but I do think the vast majority of people (fan included) are so dead set on what Jon represents-- be it The Son of Superman, the cute kid of the family, Damian's friend, or "the queer Superman"-- that they forget that there's actually a great character in his own right just sitting there. The context that he was born into-- at even a base level-- leaves him in a position to be such a fun character/Superman.

It's all on the page. I didn't make it up. Any writer working today that's willing to just take a look beyond what he represents could have themselves the legit Superman of the 21st century.

__________

As an aside, it genuinely shocks me that Taylor or those that work at DC's Superman editorial don't even get what Jon really "represents" and how powerfully needed it is right now. The only writer who has ever even hinted at this when it comes to the Superman IP is Christopher Priest. It's something that you take a step further and works so much better for Jon. This would be the only thing that I'd ever be interested in digging into when it comes to what Jon represents. And I think it's something that truly enhances and legitimizes his claim to the Superman in a way that this empty climate crisis take simply doesn't. And again, it's something that's Jon's and Jon's alone.

[Vordan]

I appreciate that, thank you!

I'd never place myself above these people that do this for a living, but I do think the vast majority of people (fan included) are so dead set on what Jon represents-- be The Son of Superman, the cute kid of the family, Damian's friend, or "the queer Superman-- that they forget that there's actually a great character in his own right just sitting there. The context that he was born into-- at even a base level-- leaves him in a position to be such a fun character/Superman.

It's all on the page. I didn't make it up. Any writer working today that's willing to just take a look beyond what he represents could have themselves the legit Superman of the 21st century.

__________

As an aside, it genuinely shocks me that Taylor or those that work at DC's Superman editorial don't even get what Jon really "represents" and how powerfully needed it is right now. The only writer who has ever even hinted at this when it comes to the Superman IP is Christopher Priest. It's something that you take a step further and works so much better for Jon. This would be the only thing that I'd ever be interested in digging into when it comes to what Jon represents. And I think it's something that truly enhances and legitimizes his claim to the Superman in a way that this empty climate crisis take simply doesn't. And again, it's something that's Jon's and Jon's alone.

I’m intrigued, what are you referring to? Something from his Deathstroke/JL runs?