Superman: son of Kal-El

[kryptonian]

Taylor has an annoying habit of selling very well despite expectations. Only major exception at DC so far has been Suicide Squad. I’m expecting this to sell well just like his Nightwing. However I find myself trapped in an odd situation.

On one hand I dislike Taylor’s writing tropes intensely. I find his style a mix of barebones decompressed plots, cheap fanservice, and mix of wholesome bait with edge to be painfully boring. So in that regard Taylor getting Jon is a lucky break, least he’s not screwing up Clark who I’m sure he’d take in a heartbeat if he could, and if he fails with Jon he likely will be contained to Batman, Injustice and other non-Superman books where I can ignore him. I also liked kid Jon even if I was disappointed with how little they had done to differentiate him from his father, how under Tomasi he was essentially Clark Jr. So I wouldn’t be too broken up about kid Jon returning.

But on the other hand, the people complaining about Jon also typically want to essentially jettison the last few years so we can go back to the “glory” years of everyone on a farm with Lois baking pies for the boys and Clark lecturing Jon about the dangers of Hollywood glorifying criminals. And Sweet Jesus do I have ZERO desire to return to that status quo, so part of me wants Taylor to succeed. Jon has already been aged up longer than he was a kid at this point, or he’s very close to passing that mark. If Taylor does well, Jon being a teenager will stick, and there’s the potential for Jon to really take off as his own character with his own stuff that he never would’ve gotten otherwise. There’s enough intriguing concepts that have been teased from Future State and the solicits that there’s a chance I might really enjoy this. So part of me is rooting for Taylor to achieve success and then **** off to go write Batman and the inevitable Injustice 3, but in all likelihood he’d broker his success with Jon into getting to write Clark which is my doomsday scenario.

Tough place to be in where I’m struggling to decide which outcome is preferable for me. For now I’m rooting for Taylor to succeed, I want to move forward not back.

Sorry, but that is bullshit


Name ONE intriguing concept introduced that cannot be given to Clark...

Every single “unique” concept given to Jon can be given to Clark by future writers...including his catchphrase and political storylines


Say what you will about rebirth...but kid Jon was sustainable and hard to erase without getting the dreaded backlash from Superman fans for being too dark


Teen Jon isn’t sustainable

He either gets de-aged or erased, and no one will care because they got Clark back from space


Those are his only two options as a teen

[Iclifton]

It's mostly the latter for me. Doing this pretty much ruined everything I looked forward to seeing in the character so now I just don't really have a reason to care anymore. Nothing about him sounds unique or interesting anymore. It's Taylor so I'm sure he'll be written wonderfully. But he just sounds like another dime a dozen YA character now.

Don't get me wrong. I love those characters. It's why the Teen Titans are my favorite DC franchise. But that's what I have them for. I had Jon for what I thought would be a really cool coming of age story but now they not only skipped to almost the end of that, but the end is something that doesn't interest me at all. Even if this was always his destination, regardless of if he was force grown, I could have at least had more time to enjoy the ride there before I got off the train.

So yeah, if this book goes belly up and they decide to just get rid of Jon instead of fixing him...I'm fine with that. He's already been dead to me anyway. I feel bad saying that because I love Taylor's work. And don't want him to fail as a writer.. But it is what it is.

That said, I would never discourage anyone else from enjoying where Jon is heading. Don't let my frustrations get you down. I may complain a lot here but I love y'all lol

Fair Criticism, hopefully the book is good enough to ease the pain. Had it been Damien, who I am fond of, I would probably feel the same.

[kryptonian]

Fair Criticism, hopefully the book is good enough to ease the pain. Had it been Damien, who I am fond of, I would probably feel the same.

The book can be the next watchmen

It still going to fail to live up to DC’s sales expectations and Jon is going to be erased or de-aged


Those are the only two paths and by god what decision they make next could determine whether or not Superman is even a character that I can be called a fan of

Because if they erase Jon...there is one conclusion

Superman NEVER had an interesting idea that was sustainable, while Batman seems to get iconic side characters or stories every few years

No wonder this franchise is unpopular...it deserves it

[Iclifton]

My opinion is entirely subjective when it comes to Taylor, I want to make sure I establish that . His success proves that my taste is not shared by many others, and I freely admit that I have a rather natural bias against some of his work due to my own fanboyism with regards to Superman that prejudices me against stuff like Injustice. If you like his Nightwing, I think you will enjoy his other work, I’ve found his Nightwing so far to be a cut above his regular work, but in general none of his DC work has done it for me. I don’t like Injustice, DCeased, any of his one off work in Annuals or Anthologies or Anniversary issues. His style is a turn off for me, I don’t connect and I don’t really understand why others do. He can surprise me sometimes, like when he killed off Batman in the first issue of DCeased when anyone else would’ve made Batman the main star, but even afterwards I just was left thinking it was an ok comic at best.

His Marvel work I’ve enjoyed more, likely because I don’t care as much about that universe and don’t mind when he takes liberties with the material. I liked All-New Wolverine and I liked Superior Iron Man over there, I might check out Dark Ages we will see. Didn’t like his Spider-Man though.

Ultimately if you read a writer for a long enough time, if you read enough of their work, you start to recognize their “tropes” and then you either love them or you don’t like them. Scott Snyder loves his narration boxes, villainous monologues, big bombastic storytelling that promises to CHANGE EVERYTHING, and of course Batman. Snyder’s Batman was insanely popular but by the time of Death Metal people were starting to loudly complain (despite Death Metal still selling great) about his style of storytelling. It’s inevitable at some point and for Taylor I reached that point rapidly because I just don't like his style.

Yeah, I have read any of those books. I am also not fan of evil Superman so I never gave Injustice a chance. I totally get the Snyder example, he definitely lost me over time. Well hopefully this is the book that changes your mind!

[Journey]

I mean I don't even think its just comics at this point, look at TV as well. Lois & Superman is doing well as a show and it stars the introduction of not just one but two teenage sons of superman, one of which has powers, not just on cable but they put it on HBO MAX as well. Which by the way, was created because a crisis aged up his and lois' baby. Some people might already be getting used to the idea of Superman having a teenage son with powers

Superman & Lois is a good show but I honestly hate what they've done with Jon haven't caught up on the last 3 episodes but essentially Jordan gets all the shine/attention & Jon is just there & it is so annoying Jordan will literally never exist in a comic meanwhile even though I want this to fail horribly Jon needs all the exposure he can get to make people invested.

[Iclifton]

People are saying that “Tom is saying all the right things”


This is objectively false


Every word that has come out of his mouth indicates that he foundationally is creating a character with a target on his back for erasure the second Clark comes back


And it’s not like Jon is popular...he objectively hasn’t been popular since his age up


And Tom Taylor isn’t going to change that

If Scott Snyder(who was more beloved and critically acclaimed than Taylor ever had been) couldn’t save new 52 Superman with Superman: Unchained...what hope does Jon have?

I don't understand why every story has to carry the burden of where the franchise will be in 5-10 years. Taylors take on a Superman equal parts Kent/Lane that explores the modern Golden Age concepts sound interesting. If the boo is good, its good. Its not his job to worry about what editorial decides to do with Clark after his run.

[Blue22]

Fair Criticism, hopefully the book is good enough to ease the pain. Had it been Damien, who I am fond of, I would probably feel the same.

See I'd have been okay with aging Damian up (as long as it's not done in the ridiculous way they did with Jon) and I like what they're doing with him now where he has been slowly growing up. He was ten when he was first introduced back in the early 2000s and he's 14 now. That's fine. Hope they keep it up. And I can't wait to see the kind of adult he'll eventually be.

What's going on with Jon just feels...way too soon and unearned. If Jon had been around for longer before they did this...it would still suck because the way they aged him up was stupid. But I'd probably be less pissed. It still wouldn't be the ideal situation though because, again, I was looking forward to actually seeing this character grow. What they're doing now feels like they took a book and cut out everything between the first and second to last chapter.

[Journey]

The way I see it if this fails (which I want) Jon either gets deaged, & Clark returns, shipped off to limbo & Clark returns until they bring in some other hack to try & make Teen Jon work, or Jon gets killed off Jason Todd style maybe Doomsday has his way with him & Clark hears it from space & returns, inevitably no matter what happens Clark comes back.

[kryptonian]

I don't understand why every story has to carry the burden of where the franchise will be in 5-10 years. Taylors take on a Superman equal parts Kent/Lane that explores the modern Golden Age concepts sound interesting. If the boo is good, its good. Its not his job to worry about what editorial decides to do with Clark after his run.

Editorial cares about sales and nothing more

All it takes is mark waid or some other A-list comic writer to come to them with a story pitch about killing or erasing Jon and boom


He is dead


Because Clark is the one and only Superman, and making Jon Superman puts a target on his back


Keeping him Superboy was his only protection

[Journey]

Editorial cares about sales and nothing more

All it takes is mark waid or some other A-list comic writer to come to them with a story pitch about killing or erasing Jon and boom


He is dead


Because Clark is there one and only Superman, and making Jon Superman puts a target on his back

At this point I wouldn't mind if they killed off Jon it be the most interesting thing done with him in 2 years. And it provides story/growth for multiple characters.

[Iclifton]

Agreed. Then he will be brought back. And around and around we go. Such is the nature of comics.

[Superlad93]

Name ONE intriguing concept introduced that cannot be given to Clark...

The concept of being placed in the most important job in the world, and being expected to uphold a certain standard of heroics set by the Superman before you.

Jon's story is of both upholding a legacy, and seeing where the cracks in it are and trying to better it. You actually can't do that with Clark. Clark is the start of his legacy. Neither Jor-El, Lara, Martha, or Pa were superheroes for Clark to have to live up to as far as the whole world is concerned.

Also, the very simple idea that this is a Superman who is 17 while the full on DCU is up and running. Functionally you can never do that with Clark because that doesn't just de age the whole DCU, but rather it makes quite a few aspects of his particular myth impossible in the present day. Jon's is an idea similar to Spider-Man: a boy having to play the role of a man, and gradually grow into it.

That metaphor in itself is exploding with story potential. Hell, a Superman as a freshmen in college as the status is already an extremely fresh idea that Clark can't replicate even with a reboot that leaves him unmarried because that takes away to much of his personal myth. Even making Clark (specifically) that young in comics these days is pushing it. Back in the New 52 I remember how quite a few people would rant about how Clark looked and acted like they should address him as Superboy rather than Superman even though he was 22. And Clark being unmarried in this day and age is even less likely given the TV show, so that's just a wheelhouse Clark can't actually play in with any present day main continuity story.

___________

Once Taylor added in the idea of college and an underground news network, his take became quite sustainable. That's building a community, cast, and personal direction for Jon's character that is totally autonomous of his parents. It's also very self contained, and that gives readers the ability to start with issue #1 of this new Superman. It's the same way he's built such a solid foundation for Dick over in Nightwing. Dick doesn't even have to use Bruce's money anymore, and he's got a clear and distinct community and personal direction for his character.

Say whatever you want about Taylor as a writer you like or don't like, but never say the man can't sell a character. He was the head writer, creator, and producer for his own successful cartoon show afterall. And I expect that sweetened the deal of getting him to launch a new Superman for DC given the fact 5G ideas were heavily rumored to be "optioned" for TV, film, and cartoons, and that's why there's still such a big push for them.

[kryptonian]

Agreed. Then he will be brought back. And around and around we go. Such is the nature of comics.

No he won’t


No writer in DC comics actually likes Jon as a concept, none that would be in a position to force a resurrection, this would be a golden opportunity to keep him dead

And most writers wouldn’t waste it

Just like they never brought back Chris


Jon is literally the only character who wouldn’t come back after getting killed off

[Iclifton]

See I'd have been okay with aging Damian up (as long as it's not done in the ridiculous way they did with Jon) and I like what they're doing with him now where he has been slowly growing up. He was ten when he was first introduced back in the early 2000s and he's 14 now. That's fine. Hope they keep it up. And I can't wait to see the kind of adult he'll eventually be.

What's going on with Jon just feels...way too soon and unearned. If Jon had been around for longer before they did this...it would still suck because the way they aged him up was stupid. But I'd probably be less pissed. It still wouldn't be the ideal situation though because, again, I was looking forward to actually seeing this character grow. What they're doing now feels like they took a book and cut out everything between the first and second to last chapter.

Yeah, I like how Damian has been handled so far, I was more referencing an artificial aging. While I am fan of the comcept of this run and Jon Superman, it is because he is already aged up and if it making the best of a bad situation. This would not be my preference. I have not read Superman since the Bendis era specifically because of how he threw out everything Tomasi had built through rebirth.

[Iclifton]

Doubt it. Look at Jason Todd.

Chris no where near close to Jons popularity or importance. Just like Damien will never be permanently gone.

Even if that were the case, regardless of Taylors run that would be a possibility. Its not his job to worry about that, its his to deliver a good comic. Based on what's been shown so far, he looks like he is on track to do so.