WW's Most Iconic Graphic Novel?

[I'm a Fish]

"It was never this cold on Themyscira."

That line still gives me chills....

[SiegePerilous02]

At this point it's Hiketeia, with maybe Historia coming up. Though the latter may not count as it doesn't focus on Diana herself seemingly all that much.

Hiketeia, without a doubt.

It puts Diana's values and ethics front and center, and crashes them into the modern world. It crashes classic mythology into the modern world as well. It is one of the few stories which dares to pull away and question Batman's moral hegemony, and exposing its classist and sexist core (Brubaker also did it, with "Joy Ride", but there are very few other examples). The stakes and tension are real, because even if Diana's life is never in danger, her values, her honour, and her integrity very much is. It is one of the few examples of a modern story that is built on the template of a classic Greek tragedy.

Is there typically a classist and sexist core though? Batman seems sympathetic to Danielle in the story even if he's trying to remain impartial, far more so than he when he deals with his typical villains. He doesn't give the impression that he condones the situation that lead to her sister's death, in fact it is in his character to fight crime on multiple fronts to prevent those tragedies. Even Diana herself doesn't condone what Danielle did when she learns of it ("it was the law...several thousand years ago.") and the story sort of resolves the situation for her and prevents her from solving the situation with the girl's suicide.

Aside from that, the only time Batman's morals have a sexist core is when writers are trying to handwave away the actions of the likes of Ivy and Harley and paint them as deserving more sympathy than Batman or the male villains, despite the piles of victims they leave in their wake.

IDK, saying this is the core of Batman's character/morals always comes across as saying being a warrior is the core of Wonder Woman's, or naive farmboy is Superman's.

[Nyssane]

Yeah, I'm hoping Historia blows everyone away. The Hiketeia has long been my favorite, but upon reflection it's a little disappointing that her best GN involves Batman.

[Gaius]

At this point it's Hiketeia, with maybe Historia coming up. Though the latter may not count as it doesn't focus on Diana herself seemingly all that much.



Is there typically a classist and sexist core though? Batman seems sympathetic to Danielle in the story even if he's trying to remain impartial, far more so than he when he deals with his typical villains. He doesn't give the impression that he condones the situation that lead to her sister's death, in fact it is in his character to fight crime on multiple fronts to prevent those tragedies. Even Diana herself doesn't condone what Danielle did when she learns of it ("it was the law...several thousand years ago.") and the story sort of resolves the situation for her and prevents her from solving the situation with the girl's suicide.

Aside from that, the only time Batman's morals have a sexist core is when writers are trying to handwave away the actions of the likes of Ivy and Harley and paint them as deserving more sympathy than Batman or the male villains, despite the piles of victims they leave in their wake.

IDK, saying this is the core of Batman's character/morals always comes across as saying being a warrior is the core of Wonder Woman's, or naive farmboy is Superman's.

I'd say Bruce's negative qualities are intentionally amplified in the story, from what I can tell elsewhere that isn't how Rucka usually writes Bruce, but some it's also we don't really get into Bruce's POV in the story.

Yeah, I'm hoping Historia blows everyone away. The Hiketeia has long been my favorite, but upon reflection it's a little disappointing that her best GN involves Batman.

Yeah, I'd be lying if I said I didn't feel this way too. Supes and Bats have plenty of these standalone/evergreen stories that don't feature her at all, so this is why I'm pulling for Historia also.

[Fuzzy Mittens]

At this point it's Hiketeia, with maybe Historia coming up. Though the latter may not count as it doesn't focus on Diana herself seemingly all that much.

Id argue that since Hippolyta has been Wonder Woman and Historia will be focusing on Hippolyta, that it should 100% count

[I'm a Fish]

I'd say Bruce's negative qualities are intentionally amplified in the story, from what I can tell elsewhere that isn't how Rucka usually writes Bruce, but some it's also we don't really get into Bruce's POV in the story.

I felt like Bruce was dialed up because Danielle escaped him twice, so he was proper peeved.

I don't mind Bruce in this book at all. But I would like more WW graphic novels without the other 2 trinity.


Also when is DC going to give Rucka a Black Label WW...or just have more BL WW in general. (Although we are getting Black & Gold so I shouldn't complain.)

[I'm a Fish]

Id argue that since Hippolyta has been Wonder Woman and Historia will be focusing on Hippolyta, that it should 100% count

[SiegePerilous02]

Yeah, I'm hoping Historia blows everyone away. The Hiketeia has long been my favorite, but upon reflection it's a little disappointing that her best GN involves Batman.

I'd say Bruce's negative qualities are intentionally amplified in the story, from what I can tell elsewhere that isn't how Rucka usually writes Bruce, but some it's also we don't really get into Bruce's POV in the story.


Yeah, I'd be lying if I said I didn't feel this way too. Supes and Bats have plenty of these standalone/evergreen stories that don't feature her at all, so this is why I'm pulling for Historia also.

Yes, I feel that we're in for a winner with Historia on multiple fronts, and it lacking the other two members of the Trinity helps.

And yes, missing Bruce's POV from Hiktetia is one of the main reasons. Rucka writes kind of an ******* Bruce in general (I think the only member of the Trinity Rucka nails 100% is Diana), but he still manages to sneak in some sympathetic tone in his voice. His concern that she will hurt herself and wanting to get her out of the rain suits Bruce: gruff, but still cares.

Id argue that since Hippolyta has been Wonder Woman and Historia will be focusing on Hippolyta, that it should 100% count

Guess that works

I felt like Bruce was dialed up because Danielle escaped him twice, so he was proper peeved.

I don't mind Bruce in this book at all. But I would like more WW graphic novels without the other 2 trinity.


Also when is DC going to give Rucka a Black Label WW...or just have more BL WW in general. (Although we are getting Black & Gold so I shouldn't complain.)

Yes, I dislike that our options for stand alone graphic novels either include Batman (Hikiteia), the JL (League of One), or I have to watch her murder Superman and use his skull as a flail (Dead Earth). First two are still good, I want to avoid the latter like the plague.

Rucka did have Diana's Daughter, and it's a shame he abandoned it because he couldn't get the story to work. That Circe mini he floated out would be a cool BL book.

[Psy-lock]

Yeah, I'm hoping Historia blows everyone away. The Hiketeia has long been my favorite, but upon reflection it's a little disappointing that her best GN involves Batman.

And he even occupies most of the cover while Diana is just a foot. I'm sure we can do better than that.

[Fuzzy Mittens]

Rucka did have Diana's Daughter, and it's a shame he abandoned it because he couldn't get the story to work. That Circe mini he floated out would be a cool BL book.

So thats what happened to that? I hadn't heard anything about it in ages and just assumed DC scrapped it.
Thats a shame, but understandable if he couldn't make the story happen.

[Gaius]

I felt like Bruce was dialed up because Danielle escaped him twice, so he was proper peeved.

I don't mind Bruce in this book at all. But I would like more WW graphic novels without the other 2 trinity.


Also when is DC going to give Rucka a Black Label WW...or just have more BL WW in general. (Although we are getting Black & Gold so I shouldn't complain.)

Yeah, I definitely got the sense Bruce had something of a bruised ego that Danielle escaped from him twice.

Rucka did have Diana's Daughter, and it's a shame he abandoned it because he couldn't get the story to work. That Circe mini he floated out would be a cool BL book.

I'd be all over that too. Get Sharp to do the art also since I think Circe was the only big WW villain he didn't do art for in Rucka's run.

[Alpha]

As for the boot on the head rather than simply lassoing Batman, there is nothing simple about Diana's use and non-use of the lasso in Rucka's narrative. Batman is an irresistible force, and the Lasso of Truth will not change his mind. It is also, from a narrative standpoint, both over-used and over-kill. As a weapon, it is a thing of last resort for Diana, not to be used lightly. Diana has been shown far too often tying people with it, that showing a bound Batman would have any real impact on the reader. The boot on the head, however, has that real visceral symbolic impact that the narrative calls for.

Why do people keep bringing up the truth power? I'm not saying she needed the truth power of the lasso, just the indestructibility of the rope.

If you show me a hero doing that to a character than that "hero" isn't acting like a hero, or even with honor. Putting your foot on top of another person's head while she is lying on the ground isn't honorable in any situation. It's pure humiliation. Even in the real world, no police officer has a reason to put his foot on top of the head of a man lying on the ground. I'm not saying it ruins the whole book, but I hate that it's the freaking cover considering the fact that it's a disgusting image that represents the opposite of what Diana should be. She can be agressive and cocky, but she should never take away someone's dignity.

[kjn]

Is there typically a classist and sexist core though?

Hell yeah. Look at the murderers who Batman didn't put in jail: Roy Braddock, Artie Mason, Steve Rittenhouse, and Peter Collins. Look at the person who Batman failed to protect: Melody Wellys.

Batman in this story is one-dimensional, but he represents the same flawed justice that too many women or people of colour face in the USA and other places.

[Fuzzy Mittens]

Its a little off topic, but what are peoples thoughts on the other OGNs featuring Wonder Woman?

[Gaius]

Its a little off topic, but what are peoples thoughts on the other OGNs featuring Wonder Woman?

Of the ones listed so far, I've only read League Of One and the Earth One series.

League of One is pretty great. The Earth One series I'm more mixed on but I've developed some appreciation for what Morrison was going for with it even if GA Wonder Woman isn't really to my tastes.