Justice Society Movie Complaint *SPOILERS*

[WonderLight789]

Did you guys notice how WW keeps going lower in the power tiers? Now our ''mighty'' and ''badass'' warrior woman can't even match aquaman's strength on land. He catched her fist with one hand and slammed her into the ground. She had to use both hands to get free of aquaman grabbing her neck with just one hand. And Steve had to interfere to help her get free from his grab. I think it is worth discussing how this current trait of WW looking like the weaker one among super beings continues to be in full motion. What do you think of how her power was handled? Is it ok for WW to be below aquaman too in terms of power?

[Robanker]

While I thought it was BS too, power scaling is the least of that movie's problems.

[WonderLight789]

While I thought it was BS too, power scaling is the least of that movie's problems.

People can discuss other problems of the movie in another thread. This one is to discuss how WW was once again more nerfed than others and jobbed to Aquaman even on land.

[Alpha]

I personally find this argument unecessary.

I'm guessing you care about this fight because of the early 2000s when there were stories like A League of One, Hiketeia, Infinite Crisis and the one after Eyes of Gorgon, where she was seen fighting other members of the league and winning. This is because outside of her own stories DC didn't care about Diana's world so they decided that her being the most powerful fighter was the only way she could stand out. I don't recall Diana being compared to other League members ever before. To be honest, I never cared about this because it didn't do anything for her world. People aren't gonna read WW just because she is hyped up as the strongest.

Fact is, the reason why Aquaman was portrayed as being so strong was because he was the antagonist of the movie. He was the powerhouse they had to defeat. If DC chose Diana as the antagonist then she would be the strongest one there is. Heck, if Superman was there he too would have struggled against Aquaman, because Aquaman was the villain.

This doesn't take anything away from Diana. She was the freaking leader of the Justice Society and portrayed that way. Her strength of character was the one quality she had (she actually didn't have much of a personality in the movie beyond being a soldier commander)

[Alpha]

DC didn't care about Diana's world so they decided that her being the most powerful fighter was the only way she could stand out.

Her being the strongest and most skilled isn't a true investment in the character. DC has now decided that the best way to prove that Diana is respected isn't via her physical stats but via her being the oldest. That's why 5G was gonna make her alive since WW2 and why the DCEU and JS WW2 have her in the past. It's just another superficial way to pay respect.

[Primal Slayer]

Her being the strongest and most skilled isn't a true investment in the character. DC has now decided that the best way to prove that Diana is respected isn't via her physical stats but via her being the oldest. That's why 5G was gonna make her alive since WW2 and why the DCEU and JS WW2 have her in the past. It's just another superficial way to pay respect.

This movie has a very specific reason why she's in the past.

[WonderLight789]

I personally find this argument unecessary.

I'm guessing you care about this fight because of the early 2000s when there were stories like A League of One, Hiketeia, Infinite Crisis and the one after Eyes of Gorgon, where she was seen fighting other members of the league and winning. This is because outside of her own stories DC didn't care about Diana's world so they decided that her being the most powerful fighter was the only way she could stand out. I don't recall Diana being compared to other League members ever before. To be honest, I never cared about this because it didn't do anything for her world. People aren't gonna read WW just because she is hyped up as the strongest.

Fact is, the reason why Aquaman was portrayed as being so strong was because he was the antagonist of the movie. He was the powerhouse they had to defeat. If DC chose Diana as the antagonist then she would be the strongest one there is. Heck, if Superman was there he too would have struggled against Aquaman, because Aquaman was the villain.

This doesn't take anything away from Diana. She was the freaking leader of the Justice Society and portrayed that way. Her strength of character was the one quality she had (she actually didn't have much of a personality in the movie beyond being a soldier commander)

DC still doesn't care much about her. So nothing changed there. If DC had WW as a villain. We would get something like flashpoint. Where she fought aquaman and he still looked like a more competewnt oponent than she did in this new movie. Or Inmjustice. Where being a villain has her getting her ass kicked a lot. So no, you can not tell me that things would have been the same if tables had turned. And they have been talking about how powerful WW is for decades, so of course i care to see how they portray the powerful WW in battle. They have a lot of explaning to do given how much they hype her compared to the end results. I couldn't care less about WW beating up other heroes. But if fights like that must happen. I would expect the so called amazong Goddess that can hang with top tiers. To be powerful enough to not lose to aquaman on land.

[Alpha]

DC still doesn't care much about her. So nothing changed there. If DC had WW as a villain. We would get something like flashpoint. Where she fought aquaman and he still looked like a more competewnt oponent than she did in this new movie. Or Inmjustice. Where being a villain has her getting her ass kicked a lot. So no, you can not tell me that things would have been the same if tables had turned. And they have been talking about how powerful WW is for decades, so of course i care to see how they portray the powerful WW in battle. They have a lot of explaning to do given how much they hype her compared to the end results. I couldn't care less about WW beating up other heroes. But if fights like that must happen. I would expect the so called amazong Goddess that can hang with top tiers. To be powerful enough to not lose to aquaman on land.

Mother Earth, why are you so insecure about this character? Wonder Woman was always supposed to be an incredibly strong woman, but what was significant about her was always her ideology.

DC doesn't really like her ideology and that's why in the 2000s they had to create a myth around her fighting prowness. It was a way to make it seem like their feminist icon was actually respected because she was treated as the best superhuman fighter, and ignored her transgressive political ideas.

But making her the strongest fighter, it never made her the most interesting character. "JLA: A League of One" is all about her taking down every member of the JLA, but that's not even what's interesting about the story. Her mentality is what makes that story interesting.

And stop with the "goddess" bs, I don't want Diana to be turned into a goddess. She is an artificial woman created in a paradise for liberated women isolated from the rest of the world. That's what's interesting about her origin, not "goddess".

Take that Greek Pantheon as far away from her stories as possible. It's what has been holding her down. If we didn't use the Greek Gods in the stories then the writers would be forced to expand the rest of her mythos way more than they do. Dr Poison would be a mastermind that has created dozens of magico-scientifical monstrosities. Themyscira wouldn't be stuck in the boring greco-roman aesthetic (that is literally the most overused classic style) and instead it would have creative designs around nature like Wakanda but if it was Art Noveau. Diana would actually train the Holliday girls as an indepent army of activists. We would have those astral projections stories back that showcased the new age aesthetic of her world. But you guys keep bringing up the "goddess" idea as if it's a good thing.

[Alpha]

Wonder Woman easily beating Aquaman wouldn't make her more respected. You should complain about the lasso being a prop instead. But at least we finally saw for once than Diana is plenty strong without needing a sword and a shield.

And again, that bs about Diana being the best fighter on the JLA and defeating any of them only existed in the 2000s and never helped her character very much.

[WonderLight789]

Mother Earth, why are you so insecure about this character? Wonder Woman was always supposed to be an incredibly strong woman, but what was significant about her was always her ideology.

DC doesn't really like her ideology and that's why in the 2000s they had to create a myth around her fighting prowness. It was a way to make it seem like their feminist icon was actually respected because she was treated as the best superhuman fighter, and ignored her transgressive political ideas.

But making her the strongest fighter, it never made her the most interesting character. "JLA: A League of One" is all about her taking down every member of the JLA, but that's not even what's interesting about the story. Her mentality is what makes that story interesting.

And stop with the "goddess" bs, I don't want Diana to be turned into a goddess. She is an artificial woman created in a paradise for liberated women isolated from the rest of the world. That's what's interesting about her origin, not "goddess".

Take that Greek Pantheon as far away from her stories as possible. It's what has been holding her down. If we didn't use the Greek Gods in the stories then the writers would be forced to expand the rest of her mythos way more than they do. Dr Poison would be a mastermind that has created dozens of magico-scientifical monstrosities. Themyscira wouldn't be stuck in the boring greco-roman aesthetic (that is literally the most overused classic style) and instead it would have creative designs around nature like Wakanda but if it was Art Noveau. Diana would actually train the Holliday girls as an indepent army of activists. We would have those astral projections stories back that showcased the new age aesthetic of her world. But you guys keep bringing up the "goddess" idea as if it's a good thing.

WW was not treated as the greatesdt fighter in the 2000s. She got her ass kicked many times against super beings that weren't even remotely close to her combat experience. I don't know what you are trying to do here. WW was overpowered by Aq and yes i have a problem with that. Being a powerhouse has always been part of her character. And i want to see that part of her character being well portrayed. We can discuss ideology in a thread about that. But since you want to talk about WW's origin. Wonder Woman was very powerful during the Marston era. And i wouldn't mind seeing that WW coming back, including her ideology and concepts. Many of them are still very interesting topics to discuss. And the classic WW from marston era wouldn't look like she looked fighting aquaman in the justice society movie.

[AmiMizuno]

Well this isn't set in the past but a different universe. And it makes you wonder what does the main universe Wonder Woman stats are. Because this one is golden age. Diana never flied

[BiteTheBullet]

My personal view on Aquaman has always been that he is a 2nd tier status guy among his fellow superheroes, and more on the low end of that spectrum.

I can grudgingly say that Aquaman should have the advantage in water over Wonder Woman, but not by much since Wonder Woman should be on a much higher power level than AQ to begin with.

But on land, even with a trident, Wonder Woman should be putting him into la la land within a minute, tops. She has her bracelets, her lasso, tiara among weapons to use (barring sword and shield if she happens to be using it), but besides that, her superior strength and speed combined with what most peoples perception is that she is the worlds most competent melee fighter should not make this much of a fight.

Many people are stating that his trident is giving him the advantage, but then again was WW struck by stupidity to not use her lasso or tiara or bracelets smartly? Or why was AQ arguably stronger than WW? Or that if we assume AQ can beat WW in the water, why is it that WW needs an out by getting saved by Trevor with a car versus her being able to beat AQ all by herself (no interference)? I mean, she is supposed to have an advantage on land, right? Maybe if she could use her flying ability to help her out in the fight against AQ.....oops, my fault, they are trying to get rid of that ridiculous power for Wonder Woman!

So, even if AQ is supposed to be the villain in this movie, why do they have people like WW job out to him? At least it feels like she is jobbing out. And if my head canon makes AQ a low level 2nd tier hero, what the hell does that make WW? Apparently street fight level status now, for me. Wonder if she could take on Black Canary now!

[Frontier]

My personal view on Aquaman has always been that he is a 2nd tier status guy among his fellow superheroes, and more on the low end of that spectrum.

I can grudgingly say that Aquaman should have the advantage in water over Wonder Woman, but not by much since Wonder Woman should be on a much higher power level than AQ to begin with.

But on land, even with a trident, Wonder Woman should be putting him into la la land within a minute, tops. She has her bracelets, her lasso, tiara among weapons to use (barring sword and shield if she happens to be using it), but besides that, her superior strength and speed combined with what most peoples perception is that she is the worlds most competent melee fighter should not make this much of a fight.

Many people are stating that his trident is giving him the advantage, but then again was WW struck by stupidity to not use her lasso or tiara or bracelets smartly? Or why was AQ arguably stronger than WW? Or that if we assume AQ can beat WW in the water, why is it that WW needs an out by getting saved by Trevor with a car versus her being able to beat AQ all by herself (no interference)? I mean, she is supposed to have an advantage on land, right? Maybe if she could use her flying ability to help her out in the fight against AQ.....oops, my fault, they are trying to get rid of that ridiculous power for Wonder Woman!

So, even if AQ is supposed to be the villain in this movie, why do they have people like WW job out to him? At least it feels like she is jobbing out. And if my head canon makes AQ a low level 2nd tier hero, what the hell does that make WW? Apparently street fight level status now, for me. Wonder if she could take on Black Canary now!

They've been bumping up Aquaman to powerhouse status for a while now. I'd say he's not necessarily as strong as the super, super, powerhouses but he's up there even if he has other stuff (his trident, command of sea life) that bolsters that.

[BiteTheBullet]

They've been bumping up Aquaman to powerhouse status for a while now. I'd say he's not necessarily as strong as the super, super, powerhouses but he's up there even if he has other stuff (his trident, command of sea life) that bolsters that.

Sure, if we are talking about AQ and his powers while he is in water, then great. But to go toe to toe with what we think is a powerhouse in Wonder Woman on land and is beating her all the while showing that he is at least, if not more, as strong than WW, then whatever.

All I can hope for is for Wonder Woman to only have solo animated or live movies so we don't have to worry about other heroes anymore and her jobbing out to them. Of course, in my head canon, we can leave WW84 out of this mix! Maybe treat it as an elseworlds story like the Azz Nu52 series.

[AmiMizuno]

I mean this is Golden age Wonder Woman. Which is a bit weak.