DC's and Marvel's problems

[abetterday]

What do you think are the biggest problems that DC and Marvel face right now?

I would like to see simple character studies of heroes like Superman, Batman, iron Man, Cyborg etc... told in a simple format and sold in stores like Walmart. Something easy to read but complicated in the way that it examines the psyche of heroes. A book that looks like an all ages format but with themes that attracts adults and makes them want to read it.

[DrNewGod]

Are the people who are in charge of Marvel and DC aware of these problems, do they have any plans to fix them?

There is no single issue, but several here have hit on many of the ills contributing to the problem. To ^this last^ question: Both Marvel and DC are owned by publicly traded companies, whose shot callers may, or may not have any knowledge of, or interest in what makes comics work. It's not like the old days, when both were run by people close to the creators and the customers, and trying to build market. They're now subject to the judgement of executives, running multimedia empires, who may see them only as IP sources, and are willing to publish mainly to preserve legal rights.

As I said, there's no one problem. What I suggest is no more the whole than anything else.

[Rickswordfish]

It sounds to me that if real change doesnt happen both companies are going to die

[TheRay]

Comics are perpetuated as being weird for adults. Adults should be able to get into them without feeling like a total loser.

[Rickswordfish]

Again it sounds like if DC and Marvel don't make som real changes both companies will go under

[MRP]

Again it sounds like if DC and Marvel don't make som real changes both companies will go under

They won't go under, they are part of larger companies and Disney & AT&T/WB are not going away. The Marvel and DC properties and stories will be around for a long time. Will they continue as publishers of periodical comic books? That is open for debate. But they are not going to die or disappear. Change. Sure. Adapt to new realities of the marketplace and change the way they deliver content and in what mediums they do. Sure. But then all companies adapt and change over time.

-M

[Zauriel]

But then all companies adapt and change over time.

-M

Not all companies adapt and change over time. Those that didn't adapt and change went out of business. Charlton. Lev Gleason. Quality. Fawcett. Fox Feature Syndicate. Better/Nedor Comics. Harvey. CrossGen. Malibu. Valiant.

[MRP]

Not all companies adapt and change over time. Those that didn't adapt and change went out of business. Charlton. Lev Gleason. Quality. Fawcett. Fox Feature Syndicate. Better/Nedor Comics. Harvey. CrossGen. Malibu. Valiant.

Yes that's true, I should have said all companies must adapt and change. However, Marvel and DC are not companies, they are brands and subsidiaries of larger companies-Disney and AT&T/Warner, so they won't :go out of business" unless their parent companies choose to discontinue them. Marvel and DC ceased to exist as independent companies long ago.

-M

[TheRay]

Marvel's problem is that it's owned by Disney.

DC's problem is that it's not owned by Disney.

I can agree about DC, but I feel as though Marvel now being a Disney property is a net win. Disney and Marvel are both two huge names, their merger should have meant big news and more eyeballs. A lot of people dedicate a lot of their lives to their love of Disney, at least some of that should translate over into Marvel.

[skyvolt2000]

4. Pricing. Comics are unrealistically expensive and it really doesn’t make sense for any lower to middle income adult to spend $4-$5 on a few minutes of entertainment each week. It just doesn’t make sense. This is stuff that needs to be addressed because my understanding is that comic prices are rising faster than inflation which is completely unsustainable.

There are kids book with less content that go for $5.

Only difference is those are complete stories.

The Little Golden Books say hi. Along with some of the early reader books.

This is just another hole their poor business plans have dug with seemingly no way out. OGN sales in the YA market for books like Dog Boy, Smile, etc. reach those levels of sales and profitability, but Marvel and DC's attempts to enter that market have not reached those sales levels. DC has made some inroads with what was their Ink/Zoom lines, but outside that YA market, sales aren't there to sustain a purely OGN model for super-hero comics yet.

Yes there is a reason for that and it's out of the hands of Dc & Marvel like it is for GQ, Sports Illustrated and others.

They have ZERO control over a store like Wal-Mart to ensure those books are on the shelves.

I can NOT go to Target and pick say Beast Boy, Aqualad & Raven's OGNS. I have to order them ONLINE from Target. Wal-Mart is a crap shot depending on which one you go to and to date I have only seen Raven and Beast Boy not Aqualad or Nubia or Gotham High.

Those DC 100 pagers-we here in Dallas/Fort Worth NEVER saw those books at Wal-Mart. Heck I saw one at Target and the rest at Half Price Books for $2.

Barnes & Nobles-sorry they are NOT everywhere and even there it's a crap shoot. The ones here will stock Wildstorm Michael Cray but won't stock Cyborg, Shazam, Birds of Prey and other well know folks.

Lets toss in libraries. Not all of them have access to order books as I have learned. Batman can collect dust on the shelves while Ms Marvel, Moon Girl, Squirrel Girl and Blue Beetle have waiting lists for months.

A book like Smile or Babysitters Club does NOT have those issues.

[Mister Mets]

This is a good question.

In no particular order...

The major superheroes have been in action for about a decade in-universe, but there are references to stories published decades earlier. Spider-Man went to college in stories published in the 1960s that are still in continuity, as occurring a few years ago. In that time, the media environment has changed, smartphones have become common-place, New York City has become more racially diverse, crime has declined significantly, gay rights has changed, people have gotten married at older ages, etc. There are all sorts of strings that should not be pulled on continuity.

It is very complicated for a new reader to know what they're buying. If you go to the graphic novel section of Barnes & Noble, looking for Batman comics, it'll be hard to navigate through the different versions: Golden Age reprints, 1960s TV-show informed silver age reprints, back to basics Bronze Age comics, crossover heavy 1990s comics, comics set in the 1990s animated cartoon universe, a new continuity in Batman: Earth One, a new version of Batman's first year in the Zero Year, comics featuring Dick Grayson as Batman, etc. This continues to be an issue with various digital releases.

Continuity gets complicated with multiple universes and retcons, as well as the sheer number of titles that are in a particular superhero world.

There are also practical considerations to being owned by being owned by major media conglomerates, with bigger concerns than comics that sell 100,000 copies on a good day. Warner Brothers and Disney don't want to get sucked into a culture war fight, or to find the Chinese government denying an official release to an MCU film because of a Captain America comic.

It's an expensive product to produce, so they want to recoup the costs. Meanwhile, it's an increasingly inefficient purchase. For five dollars, you get something that you can finish in ten minutes, and that is likely part of a larger whole, that requires more purchases.

[green_garnish]

Comics are perpetuated as being weird for adults. Adults should be able to get into them without feeling like a total loser.

Of all the things wrong with comics, this is the least of them. Decades ago comics were deemed acceptable material for ages 8 through 80. Now they are acceptable material for ages 18 through 80. They lost their most important demographic because they forgot what comics are like when they are done really well.

[Iron Maiden]

A library card solves this problem. I buy books of my favorite characters but I BORROW the rest. No need to waste money.

Not every library has an extensive collection of GNs or TPBs. Some of them have none at all.

[Mister Mets]

Some more thoughts on the problems.

- There are some larger questions on the relevance of superheroes as a metaphor that affect Marvel and DC as companies coming up with new superhero stories. Is it a good idea to have stories of white people taking the law into their own hands? There are calls for more radical stories that challenge the status quo, although this leads to the question of what it would mean to have people with this level of power? Can stories about superheroes changing the world fit a real world that has different kind of tradeoffs?

- There are radically different fan bases, including kids, long-time fans and some people who are more avant-garde, and there are all sorts of divides within those groups.

- It is really easy to get bootleg digital comics.

- Some big projects have not been finished. All-Star Batman & Robin #1 is one of the biggest comics of the last twenty years, and that series was cancelled unceremoniously. Thor: The Mighty Avenger was one of Marvel's most acclaimed comics, and that story was never wrapped up.

- A big issue is the lack of new A-list artists. Who is as big as Kirby, Ditko and Romita in the 1960s, Bernie Wrightson and Neal Adams in the 1970s, John Byrne and George Perez in the 1980s, Jim Lee, Todd Macfarlane and Alex Ross in the 1990s, or Frank Quitely, Bryan Hitch and Steve McNiven in the 2000s? And what's led to the lack of A-listers? Is it nichification as fandoms are more divided, bad marketing, changes in production (artists are more reliant on coloring which makes the individual penciler less important), a shortage of great new artists, or the sheer amount of material available making it hard for anyone to stand out?

- A good thing for Marvel and DC is that they're able to get money from generations of comic books, but this does make it harder to find or understand the new material.

[TheRay]

Of all the things wrong with comics, this is the least of them..

There’s not really much else wrong with them.