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  1. #1
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    Default Batman: Urban Legends #3 Preview

    Batman: Urban Legends #3 Preview (Red Hood)
    Writers: Chip Zdarsky, Che Grayson, Brandon Thomas, Matthew Rosenburg
    Artists: Eddy Barrows, Eber Ferreira, Jesus Merino, Alberto Jimenez Albuquerque, Max Dunbar, Ryan Benjamin




  2. #2
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    I know there's all this talk about Batman being terrible or abusive, but I always appreciate it when they show how good he is with kids .

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    Astonishing Member OBrianTallent's Avatar
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    Jason's last line in the preview is perfect. While all the boys are different and while they mostly have shared experiences they have different life circumstances. Bruce took in Dick fairly immediately. Tim has had his family. Damien had family, even if they are a twisted bunch. Only Jason had any experience in foster care. So I can see Jason having a different perspective on how to handle things despite his time under Bruce's wings.

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    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I know there's all this talk about Batman being terrible or abusive, but I always appreciate it when they show how good he is with kids .
    Manipulating a kid with sweets is not something I'd consider "good with kids". If Bruce was really "good", he'd apologize - at least to Tyler for scaring him. But Bruce should also go back to the goons from the last chapter and apologize to them too. The way he treated them was out of proportion compared to what they did - buying food for Mr. Freeze.

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    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    Manipulating a kid with sweets is not something I'd consider "good with kids". If Bruce was really "good", he'd apologize - at least to Tyler for scaring him. But Bruce should also go back to the goons from the last chapter and apologize to them too. The way he treated them was out of proportion compared to what they did - buying food for Mr. Freeze.
    I don't see it as manipulating him. He's obviously using the soft touch here to let the kid know he's not a threat and not something to be scared of. He's trying to make him feel safe.

    Now you're making me wonder about proportional response to goons .

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    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I don't see it as manipulating him. He's obviously using the soft touch here to let the kid know he's not a threat and not something to be scared of. He's trying to make him feel safe.

    Now you're making me wonder about proportional response to goons .
    I don't know about you, but a guy who puts on a fake smile and then - when the person is gone - immediately goes full "I'm so aggro, I clench my teeth really hard" fury furry mode doesn't make me feel safe.

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    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    I don't know about you, but a guy who puts on a fake smile and then - when the person is gone - immediately goes full "I'm so aggro, I clench my teeth really hard" fury furry mode doesn't make me feel safe.
    The smile seems perfectly genuine to me, and then he just takes a more frank and professional tone with Jason. But I guess I think Bruce can shift between genuine emotions that quick.

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    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    I mean, Jason did went all wrong with the whole situation and put the kid at unnecessary risk with his little stunt. What, did you expect Bruce to congratulate Jason and throw a party?

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    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    I mean, Jason did went all wrong with the whole situation and put the kid at unnecessary risk with his little stunt. What, did you expect Bruce to congratulate Jason and throw a party?
    Because, of course, the kid would be way better off with his dad alive. A dad who likes to drug his own child and wife.

    I don't expect anything from Bruce anymore. It's always the same. That's why I tend to avoid stories with him.
    Last edited by Sergard; 05-08-2021 at 02:27 PM.

  10. #10
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Not with his dad, but he would be definitely better elsewhere than holing up in the hideout of a vigilante with such deep psychological issues.

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    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Not with his dad, but he would be definitely better elsewhere than holing up in the hideout of a vigilante with such deep psychological issues.
    How much time do you think has passed since the first chapter? Maybe one, two hours at best. Finding a - temporary - safe place for the kid is something ANYBODY would do in such a situation. And feeling guilt is not a deep psychological issue but a normal reaction. (I know it's rare in the DC universe because most characters are more prone to call out others on their mistakes than dealing with their own.)

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    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    How much time do you think has passed since the first chapter? Maybe one, two hours at best. Finding a - temporary - safe place for the kid is something ANYBODY would do in such a situation. And feeling guilt is not a deep psychological issue but a normal reaction. (I know it's rare in the DC universe because most characters are more prone to call out others on their mistakes than dealing with their own.)
    Lashing out because you got PSTD from your past counts as deep psychological issues. A hideout for a vigilante currently in the middle of an investigation that deals with Gotham dangerous rogues, is not a safe place unless there's someone there to keep an eye on the kid while you deal with the criminals. Jason's reticence towards the authorities also comes from nowhere because there's not really a precedent for Gotham to be that awful in that regard since in the past, the system has been shown in a positive light; the very few times it has been shown. Leslie and Gordon are available, Barbara too, so far the story doesn't seem like is taking into account the anti-vigilantism push of Mayor Nakano nor it has acknowledged the whole Magistrate program. So again, Jason's actions are completely nonsensical and show a deeply troubled man that has zero relation with the way he was handled in his own title, or even how he was in his brief appearance in Grifter.

  13. #13
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Lashing out because you got PSTD from your past counts as deep psychological issues.
    How exactly is Jason's PTSD risking Tyler's safety in the hideout?

    A hideout for a vigilante currently in the middle of an investigation that deals with Gotham dangerous rogues, is not a safe place unless there's someone there to keep an eye on the kid while you deal with the criminals.
    Is he still in the middle of the investigation? At least for me, chapter 2 felt like Jason had - at least temporarily - given up on the investigation in order to figure out how to handle the situation with Tyler. I could be wrong though.

    Jason's reticence towards the authorities also comes from nowhere because there's not really a precedent for Gotham to be that awful in that regard since in the past, the system has been shown in a positive light; the very few times it has been shown. Leslie and Gordon are available, Barbara too, so far the story doesn't seem like is taking into account the anti-vigilantism push of Mayor Nakano nor it has acknowledged the whole Magistrate program. So again, Jason's actions are completely nonsensical and show a deeply troubled man that has zero relation with the way he was handled in his own title, or even how he was in his brief appearance in Grifter.
    Remember the Rebirth start of RHatO? Ma Gunn was going to reestablish her little "school" business, teaching kids how to become a criminal. But then Black Mask happened and everything changed for her. Two years or so ago Tom Taylor wrote a story about a Gotham orphanage in which children went missing without anybody noticing. I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I misunderstand something. But I think Jason is completely in his right to question Tyler's well-being if he really becomes an orphan.

  14. #14
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    How exactly is Jason's PTSD risking Tyler's safety in the hideout?
    He's acting rashly, is on an edge and is completely unfocused. His state of mind is so bad that he can't even properly defend himself let alone a kid with zero fighting experience.


    Is he still in the middle of the investigation? At least for me, chapter 2 felt like Jason had - at least temporarily - given up on the investigation in order to figure out how to handle the situation with Tyler. I could be wrong though.
    Let's assume he stopped the investigation to take care of Tyler. What he's planning to do next? He can't remain holed up in there with the kid all the time, is he planning to take Tyler to school? how will he provide for all of Tyler needs? Even something as simple as going out for some food will put the kid in risk whether he takes with him or not.

    Remember the Rebirth start of RHatO? Ma Gunn was going to reestablish her little "school" business, teaching kids how to become a criminal. But then Black Mask happened and everything changed for her. Two years or so ago Tom Taylor wrote a story about a Gotham orphanage in which children went missing without anybody noticing. I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe I misunderstand something. But I think Jason is completely in his right to question Tyler's well-being if he really becomes an orphan.
    And you're ignoring completely the existence of Leslie or the Gordons, there are also stories where Children Services actively question Bruce capacity to adopt so many children, one particular story in the old Gotham Knights even have him go under fire over Jason's death. There's that youth center that was introduced when Bruce got amnesia and Gordon took over as Batman, point being, there's more examples of the System in Gotham working now that Batman and his many allies are around than examples of the system being broken. So no, Jason's paranoia isn't justified.

  15. #15
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    He's acting rashly, is on an edge and is completely unfocused. His state of mind is so bad that he can't even properly defend himself let alone a kid with zero fighting experience.
    He's sitting in his hideout and thinking about Tyler's future. That's hardly "acting rashly". And of course, he's on edge - everybody would be on edge in such a situation. Nobody is going to break in - except Batman, who's an assh*le to Jason but would never harm a kid (that's not his own). And again, this is maybe one, two hours later. With more time passing by, Jason would naturally become more focused again. But the incident from chapter 1 is still fresh. I also highly doubt that Barbara is not monitoring the place. Jason and Barbara are still in contact.


    Let's assume he stopped the investigation to take care of Tyler. What he's planning to do next? He can't remain holed up in there with the kid all the time, is he planning to take Tyler to school? how will he provide for all of Tyler needs? Even something as simple as going out for some food will put the kid in risk whether he takes with him or not.
    I guess they'll have to wait and see if the mother pulls through or not. I'm not a doctor, I don't know how long it takes to be sure if she'll survive or not. Maybe it's only a matter of waiting until the next morning or one/two days. School is hardly a priority. I'm not sure if Tyler even goes to school. How is going out for food a problem? He wouldn't go out in his Red Hood gear. Depending on the mother's situation, Jason would pull all strings available to assure that Tyler has a happy life. But thanks to spoilers from the solicitation that's all hypothetical.


    And you're ignoring completely the existence of Leslie or the Gordons, there are also stories where Children Services actively question Bruce capacity to adopt so many children, one particular story in the old Gotham Knights even have him go under fire over Jason's death. There's that youth center that was introduced when Bruce got amnesia and Gordon took over as Batman, point being, there's more examples of the System in Gotham working now that Batman and his many allies are around than examples of the system being broken. So no, Jason's paranoia isn't justified.
    I'm not ignoring their existence but it's naive to assume that everything is fine in Gotham because there are a handful of people helping out.
    Last edited by Sergard; 05-09-2021 at 02:41 AM.

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