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  1. #16
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Going to quote myself from the Jason Todd thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    For a story that was supposedly meant to be Jason's big moment in the spotlight, it is impressive how hard it goes out of its way to show Jason's worse facets of his character and barely any of his strong points. He's reckless, emotional, impulsive, easy to anger, and continues to commit rookie mistakes. On the other hand, Bruce is depicted as a pretty decent guy, a well-meaning father that is trying his hardest to connect with his idiot son even though he should've kicked his ass and lock him in his room for being so dumb. Bringing Leslie just now when it could've been done since the first issue also shows how decompressed this story is, a bunch of actions are just there to extend the narrative without actually pushing it forward. I also hate the fact they dropped Rocafort's Robin costume to go back to the pixie boots, I hate that look for Jason and I hate that he's a little kid again instead of a teenager. Making him older when he was with Bruce was one of the many things the N52 did right with Jason. At this point, I will be VERY surprised if this story ends up being anything but yet another "Jason screws up for being a hothead and Bruce has to clean up his mess"

    Oh, and I wouldn't be surprised if we're back again to pushing Jason crushing on Barbara.

    Urban Legends is a massive disappointment.

    As I said before, I skipped the rest of the stories in this book so I have no opinion on them.

  2. #17
    Uncanny King-Kamalu lemonpeace's Avatar
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    I only read this for Lady Shiva's and The Outsiders' stories. gonna edit in my thoughts later.
    SIGNAL (Duke Thomas) is DC's secret shonen protagonist! his fandom wikia
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  3. #18
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Going to quote myself from the Jason Todd thread




    As I said before, I skipped the rest of the stories in this book so I have no opinion on them.
    Sounds like the story hits all the Jason fans pet peeves and then some.

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Pretty much, yeah. Is as if for Jason the last 10 years didn't happen and this was a direct follow-up to UtRH. Very similar to Three Jokers in that regard. I've brought it multiple times in the Jason Todd thread but every time I'm getting more and more convinced that the editorial only idea for Jason is for him to go the way of Bane and get stuck rehashing UtRH.

  5. #20
    Incredible Member Superboy-Prime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Pretty much, yeah. Is as if for Jason the last 10 years didn't happen and this was a direct follow-up to UtRH. Very similar to Three Jokers in that regard. I've brought it multiple times in the Jason Todd thread but every time I'm getting more and more convinced that the editorial only idea for Jason is for him to go the way of Bane and get stuck rehashing UtRH.
    Is it, though? Jason kills in Gotham and Bruce is quite understanding about it, their relationship isn't bad at all. That's a development that's been continued.

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superboy-Prime View Post
    Is it, though? Jason kills in Gotham and Bruce is quite understanding about it, their relationship isn't bad at all. That's a development that's been continued.
    That is something that was already present during UtRH (Bruce never attempted to really take down Jason despite how many people he killed) but is just the same plot beat of Jason being a stubborn ass that can't step aside and think for five seconds to consider Bruce's perspective. Of Jason becoming sloppy and careless by getting his emotions getting the better of him, of getting into a petty fight with Burce for things that could've been solved if he were actually willing to talk things out with Bruce instead of lashing out all the time.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemonpeace View Post
    I only read this for Lady Shiva's and The Outsiders' stories. gonna edit in my thoughts later.
    To me this doesn't felt like Shiva at all.
    That Shiva cares about Cass is completely against how their relationship was written pre crisis.

  8. #23
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Sounds like the story hits all the Jason fans pet peeves and then some.
    Since when Dark is representative of all Jason fans? As far as I have seen many are liking the story so far.
    “Any fool can criticize, condemn, and complain but it takes character and self-control to be understanding and forgiving.”
    – Dale Carnegie

  9. #24
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rise View Post
    Since when Dark is representative of all Jason fans? As far as I have seen many are liking the story so far.
    I thought I had seen issue with those certain story points across the board at various times in his Appreciation Thread, but I could be wrong .

    No fandom is monolith .

  10. #25
    Caperucita Roja Zaresh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I thought I had seen issue with those certain story points across the board at various times in his Appreciation Thread, but I could be wrong .

    No fandom is monolith .
    Haven't read this week's issue yet, but so far, I'm a fan who ˇs very pleased with the story.
    And Rise's right: we're no few.
    Always changing; ever the same.

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  11. #26
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Batman: "We don't assault people unless others are in immediate danger."
    Goons from chapter 2 disagree.

    I will take this version of Jason over this version of Bruce any day. The chapter needed more scenes with Jason and Tyler.

    The Lady Shiva story was unexpected - but pretty consistent with her portrayal in Hill's Batman and the Outsiders run and Taylor's DCeased: Unkillables. I liked it fine.

    Outsiders still didn't manage to fully catch my attention. But the addition of Duke Thomas in future stories sounds promising.

    Grifter is still my favorite story of the anthology.

    Altogether I liked this issue a little bit more than the last one.

  12. #27
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    Batman: "We don't assault people unless others are in immediate danger."
    Goons from chapter 2 disagree.
    Do you mean the same goons that immediately drew their guns and in the case of one of them, immediately called for a killing shot? And even then, the only thing Bruce did was disarm them and let the guy he wanted alone once he talked to him.

  13. #28
    Don't Bully a Hurt Dragon Sergard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Tzitzimine View Post
    Do you mean the same goons that immediately drew their guns and in the case of one of them, immediately called for a killing shot? And even then, the only thing Bruce did was disarm them and let the guy he wanted alone once he talked to him.
    Batman stalked them.
    Batman assaulted them.
    Batman scared the shit out of them and behaved like a monster out of a horror movie.
    Batman literally sent one of them flying with his grappling hook - which is traumatizing to a normal person.

    And what exactly did these people do? They were buying groceries! Nobody was in immediate danger.

    I don't care that they REACTED by drawing their guns and trying to kill him. Batman started and what he did was not justified and contradicts his own statement.

  14. #29
    Astonishing Member Dark_Tzitzimine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergard View Post
    Batman stalked them.
    Batman assaulted them.
    Batman scared the shit out of them and behaved like a monster out of a horror movie.
    Batman literally sent one of them flying with his grappling hook - which is traumatizing to a normal person.

    And what exactly did these people do? They were buying groceries! Nobody was in immediate danger.

    I don't care that they REACTED by drawing their guns and trying to kill him. Batman started and what he did was not justified and contradicts his own statement.
    You can't be serious. Scaring the shit out of people is literally the whole reason for Bruce to dress like a bat. And again, he only wanted to talk with the guy who actually broke his promise with Batman by joining Freeze's gang.

    What he was arguing with Jason was using violence just for violence's sake. He didn't contradict himself at any point.

    Actually, the whole thing is another example of Zdarsky missing completely the point of Jason as a character. The two main reasons that drove Jason to use the lethal option with criminals were: doing acts so horrible that killing them is justified and those rare few that simply aren't scared from Batman. In this issue Jason was merely lashing out and essentially acting like a bully.
    Last edited by Dark_Tzitzimine; 05-11-2021 at 04:21 PM.

  15. #30
    Mighty Member Rise's Avatar
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    It is really interesting how fans always claim that they want their favorites to be three dimensional, but get mad when they don't act as flawless Mary Sue.

    Is Jason being idiotic and reckless here? Absolutely, but it makes sense because he is being emotional and not thinking clearly since the case is becoming personal to him. It's the same with how he acted when he found out about his father and what the Penguin did to him. So, Jason isn't being ooc here and it's actually close to his characterization in rhato (and in general).
    “Any fool can criticize, condemn, and complain but it takes character and self-control to be understanding and forgiving.”
    – Dale Carnegie

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