How to restore Jor-El from the Circle mess?

[Thor-Ul]

In the last series the figure of Jor-El was twisted from a resigned scientist who wanted to save his son and transformed in a indiferent conspirator willing to hide planetary genocides for the greatest good. As many of the aspects of the previous run are being undone, how would you restore the reputation of Jor-El as the heroic father of Superman?

[Vordan]

Dude who cares? Johns/Jurgens were the ones who “ruined” Jor-El by making him Oz. That storyline was ages ago, just ignore it and let it die the way DC is clearly planning to. We don’t need a “fix fic”.

[Thor-Ul]

I, for one, care. Maybe I am the only one. And probably it will be take onboard when Jon Kent goes against Ultraman, becuase it was of that Jor-El than Jon was lost on earth 3. Everytime Jon Kent touch that point, unless is retconed, it will be bring on the table.

But I am not talking about Mr. Oz mess. I am talking about what was done in the next run, when the writer after Tomasi and Jurgens wrote Jor-El as being corrupt since before the destruction of Krypton. A Jor-El who was part of a team of cosmic illuminated conspirators who secretly plotted the destructions of worlds for the well being of the whole galaxy, being capable of left JKrypton at will. Also, by his actions, he was indirectly responsible of the destruction of Krypton.

It was a miracle that writer didn't wrote Pa Kent as a war criminal member of some secret militia inside the US army, who had caused massacres in war ravaged countries.

[magha_regulus]

Count me in with those who absolutely despise what happened to Jor-El's character. I'd say the corruption came about from Dr. Manhattan (or maybe even the Time Trapper) interfering and experimenting with Superman's timeline. I really want Morrison's New 52 version of Krypton restored. That version of Jor-El and Lara were tragic heroes. I really dislike when they try to add shady, morally gray aspects to the heroes' backstories when they weren't originally there in the first place. Its such an overused trope at this point.

[Prime]

Wasn’t Jor-El sent back to die anyway? Sure, it sucked but they closed that plot hole

[CosmeticSkull]

Jor-El can only be redeemed by a hard reboot.

[dornwolf]

Dude who cares? Johns/Jurgens were the ones who “ruined” Jor-El by making him Oz. That storyline was ages ago, just ignore it and let it die the way DC is clearly planning to. We don’t need a “fix fic”.

To be honest we still don’t really know what the Oz plan actually was. Seemed to be punted when Bendis came on board and basically wrote out fun.

[exile001]

To be honest we still don’t really know what the Oz plan actually was.

Let's not forget it was supposed to tie into Doomsday Clock. Lol.

I love that Superman's Dad came back from the dead and was stalking around as a potential big bad for the DCU, and his presence had more story impact on Tim Drake (Robin) than it did Clark.

[Kuwagaton]

Wasn’t Jor-El sent back to die anyway? Sure, it sucked but they closed that plot hole

Unfortunately I think this is as accurate as it gets. And it's not like I have so much confidence in revisiting Krypton

[JAK]

In the last series the figure of Jor-El was twisted from a resigned scientist who wanted to save his son and transformed in a indiferent conspirator willing to hide planetary genocides for the greatest good. As many of the aspects of the previous run are being undone, how would you restore the reputation of Jor-El as the heroic father of Superman?

Easy: he was "a" Jor-El, not "the" Jor-El. With so many universes out there, it's the easiest swap in the world.

That all having been said, I still want to know what Jurgens's original plan was. Because clearly, Jor was being controlled by the staff he was holding. So my guess is a rescue mission, followed by something that forces him back to his own place again, redeemed. There is no way in hell that Jurgens would have left Jor-El like that - he hated that it was done to Emil Hamilton, let alone Superman's actual father.

[Thor-Ul]

Count me in with those who absolutely despise what happened to Jor-El's character. I'd say the corruption came about from Dr. Manhattan (or maybe even the Time Trapper) interfering and experimenting with Superman's timeline. I really want Morrison's New 52 version of Krypton restored. That version of Jor-El and Lara were tragic heroes. I really dislike when they try to add shady, morally gray aspects to the heroes' backstories when they weren't originally there in the first place. Its such an overused trope at this point.

That is the point of Jor-El, a tragic figure, not a suspicious conspirator. I could not like the whole Oz bussiness, but at least it keep the original story of the character: on Krypton, he was a good man, but after being abducted by Manhattan he was tortured and twisted. He still was a tragic figure. But as a member of the Circle, he was a duplicious figure who already had collaborated in planetary genocides and was a cosmic wanted criminal. All this character destruction came in a time when many other characters were confronted with failing father figures, being the better and close example the Thomas Wayne from the Flashpoint universe who had a big role in Tom King's Batman run.
However at difference of Jor-El, Thomas was redeemed, even if he keep his attitude in Justice League Incarnate and Flashpoint Beyond.

Wasn’t Jor-El sent back to die anyway? Sure, it sucked but they closed that plot hole

Unfortunately I think this is as accurate as it gets. And it's not like I have so much confidence in revisiting Krypton

Krypton was just revisited in the last World of Krypton series by Venditti and Oeming, which restablishes again the kindly scientist (without any trace of planetary killers and Krypton dying by its own nature). Until now has been the only (kind of) redemption than Jor-El has received, but as the status of this series is unclear, continuity wise, I am worried about how the next story of Jon Kent will be developted, because, as you rmemeber it was this "Jor-El" fault than the kid was lost in the multiverse. and was send to earth 3 where he lost 3 years of his life prisioner naked in a volcano. So for the moment the reputation of Jor-El is in hands of Tom Taylor.

[Thor-Ul]

Let's not forget it was supposed to tie into Doomsday Clock. Lol.

I love that Superman's Dad came back from the dead and was stalking around as a potential big bad for the DCU, and his presence had more story impact on Tim Drake (Robin) than it did Clark.

Doomsday Clock still is having repercussions, just check the last Lazarus Planet tie-in.

[Thor-Ul]

Easy: he was "a" Jor-El, not "the" Jor-El. With so many universes out there, it's the easiest swap in the world.

Either that or someone else messing with Jor-El timeline. Or any other solution I can't think of right now.

That all having been said, I still want to know what Jurgens's original plan was. Because clearly, Jor was being controlled by the staff he was holding. So my guess is a rescue mission, followed by something that forces him back to his own place again, redeemed. There is no way in hell that Jurgens would have left Jor-El like that - he hated that it was done to Emil Hamilton, let alone Superman's actual father.

I would like to think the idea to finish the Oz/Jor-El plot was going to be in that direction. Jurgens likes the characters and maybe he wors many times in the confort zone, but he delivers and I think he could had accomplished that. But then another writer, with more fame than talent had to came woith a Jor-El who always was corrupt. What a great idea. (Italics to be read in a sarcastic mode, please).

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

In the last series the figure of Jor-El was twisted from a resigned scientist who wanted to save his son and transformed in a indiferent conspirator willing to hide planetary genocides for the greatest good. As many of the aspects of the previous run are being undone, how would you restore the reputation of Jor-El as the heroic father of Superman?

Retcon Mr. Oz as being Kru-el.

https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Kru-El_(Earth-One)

https://youngjustice.fandom.com/wiki/Kru-El

Or make Mr. Oz a resident of Flashpoint Earth. His son's imprisonment made him cynical of humanity but he had skeletons in his closet way before Krypton exploded.

[magha_regulus]

Retcon Mr. Oz as being Kru-el.

https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/Kru-El_(Earth-One)

https://youngjustice.fandom.com/wiki/Kru-El

Or make Mr. Oz a resident of Flashpoint Earth. His son's imprisonment made him cynical of humanity but he had skeletons in his closet way before Krypton exploded.

I like these ideas.