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  1. #421
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    I have so many ideas for Maxima and, sadly, I think the New 52 take is just kind of dull. There's a huge reservoir to pull from when Max is about that tradition instead of running from it because it presents the argument of Clark having an obligation to try and procreate and keep his race alive. Max is devoted to her heritage whereas Clark goes his own way mixing his heritage with his upbringing.

    He chooses Lois who he doesn't even know if he can have a child with. He chooses selfishly, to pick love over an obligation to try and continue his bloodline. I've talked a lot more about that in her thread, but to be succinct, there was a lot of potential to Maxima both with respect to her own character and Clark's.

    There's a lot there to deal with, but New 52 Max is basically a story about a teenager coming out of the closet to conservative parents. It's a good story and one that's worth telling, but compared to what you're losing it's just not unique enough to really do much with.

    New Max is just not as interesting. They have nothing left to do with her.

    I have no doubts they'd go with New 52 Max if we ever see her again, though.
    I thought old Maxima was pretty fun myself...

  2. #422
    Extraordinary Member Holt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Last Son of Krypton View Post
    Superman Returns did.
    I'd argue it missed the warmth and humor despite aping that aesthetic. Gail Simone had a story about being invited to the set and being horrified when the people working on the film kept bragging to her about the lack of jokes in favor of the focus on Superman as a deadbeat dad. There was character drama and emotional turmoil in the Donner films but they still didn't take themselves as seriously as Singer did.

  3. #423
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holt View Post
    I'd argue it missed the warmth and humor despite aping that aesthetic. Gail Simone had a story about being invited to the set and being horrified when the people working on the film kept bragging to her about the lack of jokes in favor of the focus on Superman as a deadbeat dad. There was character drama and emotional turmoil in the Donner films but they still didn't take themselves as seriously as Singer did.
    Well, that...explains a lot.

  4. #424
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    You guys haven’t heard half of the horror stories behind Superman returns

    Bryan singer was dead set on using his sequel to turn Superman into a child murderer, after brainiac possesses his sons body and he is forced to sacrifice his own son to save humanity, because of his need to have an edgy Jesus fanfic.

    Burnett pitched that story and the fact that he was proud of that idea was fucking horrifying...

    Warners dodged a bullet by rebooting


    How the hell could you ever suggest turning Superman into a child murderer?

    And how did Warners not fire everyone involved the second that pitch was thrown their way, or perhaps they did?


    Can you imagine the toxic reaction that Bryan singer Superman returns sequel would have gotten


    https://www.google.com/amp/s/screenr...storyline/amp/
    Last edited by kryptonian; 06-15-2021 at 11:02 PM.

  5. #425
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Donner superman is very much a jesus parallel .. can't really blame anyone for jesus fanfic..As for lacking warmth..meh! don't really care...never did..I don't really get a kick out of seeing pointless fluff..Clark is kinda jesus in general..The warmth and stuff like that is part of that whole paradigm..He is your dad and lord/savior whether you want one or not..
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 06-15-2021 at 11:11 PM.
    "I swear to devote my life to the destruction of piracy, greed, cruelty and injustice! And my sons, and their sons, shall follow me!"

  6. #426
    Ultimate Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I thought old Maxima was pretty fun myself...
    She serves a purpose that I don’t think is a bad one. I’ve written a bit before on what I’d do with her which basically amounted to giving her more agency and letting her and Clark develop an attraction based on each other’s character rather than her just wanting a eugenics experiment and he just wanting kids.
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

  7. #427
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    She serves a purpose that I don’t think is a bad one. I’ve written a bit before on what I’d do with her which basically amounted to giving her more agency and letting her and Clark develop an attraction based on each other’s character rather than her just wanting a eugenics experiment and he just wanting kids.
    There's a lot to work with. I've got a multi-volume pitch for her that I'd love to give to DC for them to reject (because I'm a hack). Maybe one day I'll post it when I finish the damn thing. Nevertheless, I absolutely agree there's more there than just the eugenics bit, but I don't think it would, could or ever should work between either of them and Clark would be a goddamn fool to try knowing her entire plan is to get pregnant and leave, or turn him into a warlord. It's easy to get hung up on that, but under that whole thing is two very different ideologies and the people who champion them butting heads and presenting paths the other never considered. She comes into his life pretty early, before the marriage so it's safe to assume Clark probably hasn't thought about settling down yet. I imagine he's mostly just been doing the superhero and Daily Planet grind day-to-day and that's enough.

    Now that's all on the table. It's something he's forced to think about. He has to think about what he actually wants out of his relationships and if they can be satisfied by the women in his life. We all know he picks Lois, but I think Maxima's arrival serves as a great catalyst for Clark having to start thinking about his future instead of humanity's. It's very easy for him to put his own needs on the back burner, so getting an excuse to bring them to the forefront of his mind is great.

    And then there's Maxima. She comes from a culture that's seemingly hedonistic, but also has that ugly eugenics experiment to breed the strongest royal heir. There's a lot to unpack, but coming to Earth would be a culture shock. Her culture is one where a woman is in control and slut shaming is most certainly not on the table. Can you imagine coming from that to here? She hears stories of this virile tyrant slayer, comes here and sees our history and then meets the legend to find he's a noble spirit who believes in mercy and can be quite mild mannered in romance or sexual discourse. Simply put, she thought she was getting a jock but got a momma's boy, or that's probably how she'd see it.

    By every metric of the men on Almerac, Clark should be some big alpha chungus but instead he's kind of a wholesome dork-- and she's still into him. That's going to make her ask questions, because he likely doesn't measure up to what she previously considered appealing. It casts doubt into what must have been a resolute mind that believed in Almerac's ways absolutely. It doesn't work between them. Full-stop, it's a non-starter, but for Maxima I think her meeting and attraction to Clark gets her to start questioning what she was raised on and her pride prevents her from growing naturally. She probably drags her feet on it a lot. Hell, she probably isn't even aware what's going on simply because she's too proud to be honest with herself about it. I have a hard time believing Maxima would just internally admit "I was totally wrong for years, this strongman on a backwater planet showed me what's up."

    There's a lot there. I think the eugenics thing ties it all together and gives them a good catalyst to start asking questions they normally don't.

    This is all conjecture, but in continuity we saw her character evolve into a more noble person by the end, even if it was a bumpy ride. She was a pretty great character, and there's a pretty simple way of having both Maximas active (make the New 52 one her daughter) so I do hope DC starts using both instead of throwing the original away. But enough about Maxima, that discussion is probably better suited to her thread.

    Which Perry are we getting? If he doesn't have the Lane Smith incarnation's love of Elvis Presley I'm going to be furious!
    Last edited by Robanker; 06-16-2021 at 01:52 AM.

  8. #428
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Which Perry are we getting? If he doesn't have the Lane Smith incarnation's love of Elvis Presley I'm going to be furious!
    I wonder if they'll base him on Fishburne's Perry, but if he doesn't still say "Great Ceasar's Ghost..."

  9. #429
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I wonder if they'll base him on Fishburne's Perry, but if he doesn't still say "Great Ceasar's Ghost..."
    I'm partial to "Great Shades of Elvis," but I can take either.

  10. #430
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    I'm partial to "Great Shades of Elvis," but I can take either.
    Both work well .

  11. #431
    Astonishing Member DochaDocha's Avatar
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    Is there anything noteworthy about Fishburne's Perry?

  12. #432
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    I'm partial to "Great Shades of Elvis," but I can take either.
    A great shades of Elvis fan!!!! I knew there were more of us.

  13. #433
    Extraordinary Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    Is there anything noteworthy about Fishburne's Perry?
    Telling Clark it's not 1938 anymore.

  14. #434
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nelliebly View Post
    A great shades of Elvis fan!!!! I knew there were more of us.
    My Perry was definitely a hot rodder Rockabilly dude in his youth. Lane Smith's Perry is baked into the character's DNA going forward as far as I'm concerned.

    He added a little bounce in Perry's step that made the old man have a little youth to him. You could just see that glimmer in his eye sometimes that showed the old newshound never got old.

  15. #435
    Ultimate Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    Is there anything noteworthy about Fishburne's Perry?
    Besides the obvious? As a character he suffered from Snyder’s lack of interest in the Clark Kent side of Superman so we barely got anything from him. S&L will be giving us a new Perry soon so I don’t expect Fishburne will leave much in the way of an impact on the character which is a shame given what a great actor he is.
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

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