Wonder Woman in animation general discussion

[Perseus]

So, on top of a generally meh portrayal of powers, dodgy cheetah design, flimsy reasoning for being the main antagonist of the film, and getting her character/motivations/personality inaccurate, they also added child trafficking to her resume....

I also watched HOW she got bested, yeah not a fan.

[John Venus]

I mean....with as many arguments go on in this placa about power...probably a good one or 2. So had to rip the bandaid off.

There were fans upset that she abducts children. Eating people be damned.

Ew.

Even Perez's Minerva would generally eat criminals over random innocents, if only for pragmatic reasons.

Abducting children is worse then eating people? Wut.

[SiegePerilous02]

Abducting children is worse then eating people? Wut.

What is she kidnapping the kids for? While she is (presumably) of sound mind,.

They're both awful, but in context the cannibalism is something forced on her by an outside curse and not something she planned for. Outside of killing Leavens for the initial ritual (because he was the only one around and it was her or him), Perez's Minerva would pick people who had some kind of karma coming to them for her targets. Still evil, but not one note.

Rebirth Barbara is even less of sound mind and has basically been reduced to an insane animal.

[WonderLight789]

So, on top of a generally meh portrayal of powers, dodgy cheetah design, flimsy reasoning for being the main antagonist of the film, and getting her character/motivations/personality inaccurate, they also added child trafficking to her resume....

I also watched HOW she got bested, yeah not a fan.

WW and her lore can't catch a break. Sad.

[I'm a Fish]

I mean, who expected her to win in the place? And is Cheetah being a straight up villain a bad thing? Even in the comics she gets sympathy points due to her past friendship with Diana but to anyone else but otherwise she eats people.

I think the people actively complaining about it forgot that.

What is she kidnapping the kids for? While she is (presumably) of sound mind,.

They're both awful, but in context the cannibalism is something forced on her by an outside curse and not something she planned for. Outside of killing Leavens for the initial ritual (because he was the only one around and it was her or him), Perez's Minerva would pick people who had some kind of karma coming to them for her targets. Still evil, but not one note.

Rebirth Barbara is even less of sound mind and has basically been reduced to an insane animal.

While the "Punisher" style "is a bad person who (mostly) kills equally bad people", is a more interesting take on Cheetah, I didn't expect it to be in a Catwoman movie where the only reason she is in it is to have a giant catfight be the climax.

[SiegePerilous02]

While the "Punisher" style "is a bad person who (mostly) kills equally bad people", is a more interesting take on Cheetah, I didn't expect it to be in a Catwoman movie where the only reason she is in it is to have a giant catfight be the climax.

I wouldn't even say she'd be a "Punisher," type figure, she was still very callous but pragmatic instead of sadistic. But wasn't out to "avenge" people either.

But I guess she was screwed right from jump street if they wanted to just have "hurr let's have the two female feline villains fight" as their premise and worked backward from there. She's always screwed when put in Catwoman's orbit no matter what.

[HestiasHearth]

Wait a minute: I can understand the complaints about Cheetah being ridiculously depowered in most of her non-WW appearances and I can most certainly understand the frustration of her fans when she, a magically-powered creature who theoretically speaking can go toe-to-toe with Wonder Woman, gets beaten by non-powered adversaries like Batman or Selina...but what is wrong with her abducting children? She is a villain. That is what villains do. Villains do evil things, and personally, I don't want Cheetah to be Wonder Woman's Harley/Selina (meaning, I don't want Cheetah to be an anti-hero. She is a straight-up villain. Let her do villainous deeds without softening her edges).

Now...having said that, I watched Catwoman: The Hunted, and I fricking HATE that once again DC Comics actively helps feed the perception that Wonder Woman villains are the designated cannon fodder for the DC Universe.
Wow. The way they disposed of Cheetah was just awful.
And Selina only got a painful-looking scratch from Cheetah? Considering that Cheetah is an evil-god-fueled werecreature AND considering her size in the movie (she was pretty much a giantess), her claws connecting with Selina's ribs should NOT have left a scratch; they should have eviscerated Catwoman.
WTF.
Has someone at DC who hates WW made it their mission to have Cheetah be Catwoman's preferred toy? I understand that this is not the first time that a Selina-centric story features Cheetah being completely jobbed.

You know what? Maybe Wonder Woman should indeed be sold to Marvel Studios.
I am so done with the way DC does not give a #$%@ about Wonder Woman's mythos in the same way they nurture and "protect" Superman's and Batman's.

[BiteTheBullet]

Wait a minute: I can understand the complaints about Cheetah being ridiculously depowered in most of her non-WW appearances and I can most certainly understand the frustration of her fans when she, a magically-powered creature who theoretically speaking can go toe-to-toe with Wonder Woman, gets beaten by non-powered adversaries like Batman or Selina...but what is wrong with her abducting children? She is a villain. That is what villains do. Villains do evil things, and personally, I don't want Cheetah to be Wonder Woman's Harley/Selina (meaning, I don't want Cheetah to be an anti-hero. She is a straight-up villain. Let her do villainous deeds without softening her edges).

Now...having said that, I watched Catwoman: The Hunted, and I fricking HATE that once again DC Comics actively helps feed the perception that Wonder Woman villains are the designated cannon fodder for the DC Universe.
Wow. The way they disposed of Cheetah was just awful.
And Selina only got a painful-looking scratch from Cheetah? Considering that Cheetah is an evil-god-fueled werecreature AND considering her size in the movie (she was pretty much a giantess), her claws connecting with Selina's ribs should NOT have left a scratch; they should have eviscerated Catwoman.
WTF.
Has someone at DC who hates WW made it their mission to have Cheetah be Catwoman's preferred toy? I understand that this is not the first time that a Selina-centric story features Cheetah being completely jobbed.

You know what? Maybe Wonder Woman should indeed be sold to Marvel Studios.
I am so done with the way DC does not give a #$%@ about Wonder Woman's mythos in the same way they nurture and "protect" Superman's and Batman's.

Was there ever a doubt that Cheetah would job out to Catwoman? She has beaten her before.

I don't see how I or anyone else can take Cheetah seriously when she is just a low to mid level tier character that street level people like Batman or Catwoman can beat her.

I just don't see the logic of the writers whether it is animation or in print. It wouldn't even be much of a thought for me if I was a writer. Cheetah versus Catwoman over in 2, maybe 5 seconds tops, due to the fact she is supposed to be incredibly strong and has Flash speed. Same thing with Batman. They blink and Cheetah wins. But of course, since it is a Wonder Woman rogue, she goes from 'A' lister to 'D' list in another persons comic or movie and loses.

[I'm a Fish]

I wouldn't even say she'd be a "Punisher," type figure, she was still very callous but pragmatic instead of sadistic. But wasn't out to "avenge" people either.

But I guess she was screwed right from jump street if they wanted to just have "hurr let's have the two female feline villains fight" as their premise and worked backward from there. She's always screwed when put in Catwoman's orbit no matter what.

Interviewer: You've got a veritable who's who of DC supervillains with this film -- everyone from Solomon Grundy to Tobias Whale -- but the heart of it feels like Black Mask and Barbara Minerva. How do they challenge Selina in this film?

Greg Weisman: To me, the heart of it is Barbara.

Black Mask is great, and he is perfect as a crime boss, and it's a terrific way to bring Selina into the story. But the heart of [Catwoman: Hunted] is cat versus big cat and finding out that Selina is operating just the tiniest bit out of her league. Lady Barbara is the core of Selina's opposition. That idea of a catfight taken seriously is what we were looking forward to.

https://www.cbr.com/catwoman-hunted-...man-interview/

[Gaius]

https://www.cbr.com/catwoman-hunted-...man-interview/

[Frontier]

Was there ever a doubt that Cheetah would job out to Catwoman? She has beaten her before.

I don't see how I or anyone else can take Cheetah seriously when she is just a low to mid level tier character that street level people like Batman or Catwoman can beat her.

I just don't see the logic of the writers whether it is animation or in print. It wouldn't even be much of a thought for me if I was a writer. Cheetah versus Catwoman over in 2, maybe 5 seconds tops, due to the fact she is supposed to be incredibly strong and has Flash speed. Same thing with Batman. They blink and Cheetah wins. But of course, since it is a Wonder Woman rogue, she goes from 'A' lister to 'D' list in another persons comic or movie and loses.

Doesn't the execution matter? Like, if it's clear that in a straight up fight Cheetah would wreck them but they find some other way to win, does that necesarilly negate Cheetah being out of their weight class?

[Primal Slayer]

Doesn't the execution matter? Like, if it's clear that in a straight up fight Cheetah would wreck them but they find some other way to win, does that necesarilly negate Cheetah being out of their weight class?

It certainly does matter. But if Catwoman manages to win and lives to tell the tale, it was always going to be controversial.

[BiteTheBullet]

Doesn't the execution matter? Like, if it's clear that in a straight up fight Cheetah would wreck them but they find some other way to win, does that necesarilly negate Cheetah being out of their weight class?

Are we saying it wasn't a straight up fight now? I haven't seen the movie, but to say that Catwoman on any day can beat Cheetah is just god awful bad writing.

I liken it to how Spidey beat up Firelord one time. But at least Spidey is strong, fast and his spider sense prevents his opponents from hitting him most of the time. Sure, even Firelord said he could go supernova and destroy Spidey, but if I remember right, he wanted to win without going the nuclear option.

Catwoman isn't strong, fast or has spidey sense. She is just a normal human, but some can argue that she is at 'olympic level' fitness, still does not hold a candle to Cheetah. Again, 5 seconds max under any situation and Catwoman is either dead or nullified.

And yes, I realize that this is as Catwoman movie but they should not be using Wondy's rogues to illustrate how bad ass she is when she wins. Does this mean under any circumstances that she can beat Wonder Woman? I mean, she has taken care of Cheetah a couple of times, so what makes me think she couldn't take on Diana!

[WonderLight789]

Doesn't the execution matter? Like, if it's clear that in a straight up fight Cheetah would wreck them but they find some other way to win, does that necesarilly negate Cheetah being out of their weight class?

The writer basically said Cheetah is just a little above catwoman. So please, DC keeps treating WW and her lore like trash. There is no way to deny. Show me a big name villain for Superman being treatedas a jobber to catwoman level characters as often as DC uses Cheetah.

[Frontier]

Are we saying it wasn't a straight up fight now? I haven't seen the movie, but to say that Catwoman on any day can beat Cheetah is just god awful bad writing.

I liken it to how Spidey beat up Firelord one time. But at least Spidey is strong, fast and his spider sense prevents his opponents from hitting him most of the time. Sure, even Firelord said he could go supernova and destroy Spidey, but if I remember right, he wanted to win without going the nuclear option.

Catwoman isn't strong, fast or has spidey sense. She is just a normal human, but some can argue that she is at 'olympic level' fitness, still does not hold a candle to Cheetah. Again, 5 seconds max under any situation and Catwoman is either dead or nullified.

And yes, I realize that this is as Catwoman movie but they should not be using Wondy's rogues to illustrate how bad ass she is when she wins. Does this mean under any circumstances that she can beat Wonder Woman? I mean, she has taken care of Cheetah a couple of times, so what makes me think she couldn't take on Diana!

I haven't seen the movie but it sounds like Catwoman was outclassed in a straight up fight and that wasn't how she won at all.

The writer basically said Cheetah is just a little above catwoman. So please, DC keeps treating WW and her lore like trash. There is no way to deny. Show me a big name villain for Superman being treatedas a jobber to catwoman level characters as often as DC uses Cheetah.

I think it was more a thematic similarity rather than saying one character is above or equal to the other.