Zack Snyder and the Snyderverse

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I liked Man of Steel more than most of Marvel's Phase 2. However BvS feels like a more ambitious Iron Man 2 but suffers the same core problems. The worldbuilding is a distraction not a benefit.

My interest in the Snyderverse is just sympathy for Snyder and Terrio. It's easier to take their side over the executives in Warner Brothers.

Beyond that I'm curious how it would've turned out but I'm not 100% that in love with his take on the characters.

[CosmiComic]

I liked Man of Steel more than most of Marvel's Phase 2. However BvS feels like a more ambitious Iron Man 2 but suffers the same core problems. The worldbuilding is a distraction not a benefit.

My interest in the Snyderverse is just sympathy for Snyder and Terrio. It's easier to take their side over the executives in Warner Brothers.

Beyond that I'm curious how it would've turned out but I'm not 100% that in love with his take on the characters.

Yeah, WB doesn't really merit sympathy at least from what I've heard of them

[SiegePerilous02]

It's annoying, but will most likely die out because all signs point to it not happening. Putting up with the online screaming may just be a fitting consequence for WB putting Snyder in charge and then firing him in such a sleazy way and allowing Whedon to run amok. Plus, it is in part backlash from all the toxic anti-Snyder fans. The pro Snyder camp seems far worse now, but if went back to post-MOS and pre-BvS the other side was definitely comparable and totally had a hand in creating the current fandom beast we have now. Reap what you sow, etc.

The coming of a god-like being on Earth won't go unnoticed. Of course it'll warrant some deep soul-searching. Who did you want ? A rehasing of the first Superman movie, so it'd tank hard because it's so dated it's outdated nowadays ?

Saying people want a rehash of Reeve/Donner because they don't want Snyder's versions is a disingenuous. They are not and never have been the only two possible options.

Fans just want a good Superman movie, and many people think this just wasn't it. Deep soul searching as a result of an alien God on Earth can be a good idea. These movies are not remotely deep though, and nothing really mattered because it all devolved into punches, explosions and laser beams anyway. Embracing that truth a bit more is why JL was better than BvS.

[Holt]

His fanbase can be pretty annoying, but it's not worth getting upset over. By all accounts he's done and his vision for Superman is being abandoned.

[Vordan]

Yeah, WB doesn't really merit sympathy at least from what I've heard of them

As an anti-Snyder person I’ve got zero problem with them going after the WB suits lol.

[SiegePerilous02]

As an anti-Snyder person I’ve got zero problem with them going after the WB suits lol.

I think Snyder did the Joker scene and keeps dropping tidbits like John Stewart specifically so the WB suits know no peace.

Which if so...well played lol.

[superduperman]

I mean, Gal Gadot is hot. When a basketball star dies and someone uses the tribute tweets to him to ask to "restorethesnyderverse", yeah, it's kind of inappropriate to say the least. There is such a thing as toxic fandom. And when you literally harass the studio to do something on anything the studio posts no matter what it is, that's kind of crossing a line.

[Primal Slayer]

Or you do'nt like his take but it was actually far better than any other super-hero flick because things mattered, and heroes didn't kill thousands of grunts each movies without having consequences until the other company put out a movie about such events affecting the world realistically ?

I mean, you don't like it, but people like you are just as bad as the one calling for a return of the Snyderverse.

What exactly mattered in his films that didnt matter in other films? Supermans death didn't matter one bit. We didnt even get to have an emotional connection to Clark. Bruce went from wanting Superman dead to acting like the two went to kindergarten together and were best friends. Wonder Woman blew up a guy when she could've easily had knocked him out instead of putting everyone outside in danger of being crushed by all the falling debri.

I am fine with Snyderfans tweeting their support for the universe....but leave it in your own little corner. Don't need to come under every thing that has nothing to do with Snyder with restorethesnyderverse....that's annoying. Or if someone disagrees you flood them with constant #restorethesnyderverse just to annoy them.

[Gaius]

[CosmiComic]

Why didn't Bruce use "Martha" to stop Clark after he was resurrected?

[JAK]

I wouldn't even mind dark & gritty if the subject material actually warranted it. A superhero movie about a heavy subject like drug dealers or civil conflicts might warrant a gritter approach. But Snyderverse just took basic concepts and made them dark for no reason I can think of.

This. I thought that both SR and MoS had an opportunity to show how Superman can truly be a light and inspire light in a world that seems dark. That *could* be an inspiring tale. But it doesn't work if your entire emotional color palette is the same shade of grey.

The coming of a god-like being on Earth won't go unnoticed. Of course it'll warrant some deep soul-searching. Who did you want ? A rehasing of the first Superman movie, so it'd tank hard because it's so dated it's outdated nowadays ?

It'd do better than you think, but of *course* those are the only two options and nuance and something in-between doesn't exist. As I've said before, I didn't want another Reeve re-hash. Doesn't mean the only other option was what I got.

I liked Man of Steel more than most of Marvel's Phase 2. However BvS feels like a more ambitious Iron Man 2 but suffers the same core problems. The worldbuilding is a distraction not a benefit.

It's funny; after MoS I felt sick - because even though the sequel could go either way, I just knew they'd be doubling down on the worst aspects of it and not things that would make MoS better in hindsight. If I'd known how right I was, I wouldn't have even bothered watching BvS.

My interest in the Snyderverse is just sympathy for Snyder and Terrio. It's easier to take their side over the executives in Warner Brothers..

I can certainly understand that.

As an anti-Snyder person I’ve got zero problem with them going after the WB suits lol.

I think Snyder did the Joker scene and keeps dropping tidbits like John Stewart specifically so the WB suits know no peace.

Which if so...well played lol.

Agreed on both counts. I give Snyder and Goyer crap, but it's not like their marching orders didn't completely suck. I can respect and appreciate that they were doing the job they were hired to do while simultaneously feeling the product lived up to such craptacular expectations. Heck, if WB'd had their way completely, it would have been worse (by newer accounts). Soo.... yep. Let 'em have it.

[CosmiComic]

This. I thought that both SR and MoS had an opportunity to show how Superman can truly be a light and inspire light in a world that seems dark. That *could* be an inspiring tale. But it doesn't work if your entire emotional color palette is the same shade of grey.:

Or the literal color palette. And JL wasn't even really gritty, just mopey and grey. Batfleck had no energy outside of the Knightmare scene. And once again Superman barely interacts with anyone. The point of Clark is he stands up for what's right even in harsh times. I wish we could've seen that instead of him mostly staring at people silently for 2 movies

[Korath]

It's annoying, but will most likely die out because all signs point to it not happening. Putting up with the online screaming may just be a fitting consequence for WB putting Snyder in charge and then firing him in such a sleazy way and allowing Whedon to run amok. Plus, it is in part backlash from all the toxic anti-Snyder fans. The pro Snyder camp seems far worse now, but if went back to post-MOS and pre-BvS the other side was definitely comparable and totally had a hand in creating the current fandom beast we have now. Reap what you sow, etc.

Saying people want a rehash of Reeve/Donner because they don't want Snyder's versions is a disingenuous. They are not and never have been the only two possible options.

Fans just want a good Superman movie, and many people think this just wasn't it. Deep soul searching as a result of an alien God on Earth can be a good idea. These movies are not remotely deep though, and nothing really mattered because it all devolved into punches, explosions and laser beams anyway. Embracing that truth a bit more is why JL was better than BvS.

You kidding right ? Each of Snyder's movies was extremely complex and far deeper than any other superhero flick ever was, even the last two Avengers movies.

Yes, WB vutchered the BvS release in theatres but even then it wasn't that hard to understand what each character felt and why. But it required the audience to not just be eating popcorn and laughing the whole movies to do so, unlike Marvel's. That's why so many peoples derided the Martha scenes when it's one of the most poignant moments, because it's Batman snapping out of "Superman is a thing which must be destroyed" to "he's perhaps a person" and then Lois confirming it, which meant that at that moment, Batman was basically Joe Chill. That's why he throws the spear away with disgust, that's why he's clearly driven by suicidal impulses in the Jl movies (both versions, even if the Snyder Cut is so much bettert than the frankensteined monstorsities concocted by WB and Whedon).

It'd do better than you think, but of *course* those are the only two options and nuance and something in-between doesn't exist. As I've said before, I didn't want another Reeve re-hash. Doesn't mean the only other option was what I got.

No, it wouldn't. Want to know why ? Because that movie was already down, it was Superman Returns, and it sucked. BEcause it tried to be a movie which was already outdated when it came out. In 2006.

That's what a lot of people don't understand : you can have box-offices successes with movies without any depth; in fact it's easier that way (case in point, Godzilla vs Kong, which I really loved but if you stop and start thinking fior a moment in the movies, it can literally fall apart. At any point) beause most people who come into theatres don't want to have to think, and Marvel has formated the super-hero genra to be basic, even sometimes dumb, adventures, over saturated with jokes and self-references to previous stories.

Snyder didn't do that. There were flaws (he fucked up his writing of Pa Kent, for instance, which has been a huge weakness to MoS and even down the line really) but he treated those characters like they would be in a world where they exists : both litterally super and crushed by the weight of their duties.

We know in BvS that Batman has been basically broken by his, that 20 years in Gotham has made him disillusioned and that he don't believe he can make a difference. We know why he hates Superman instead of seeing him like an ally. We know why Clark wouldn't be able to see Batman as anything else than a villain at the start.

It's all freaking here, but you don't have a character doing jokes while explaining all of that.

[JAK]

Or the literal color palette. And JL wasn't even really gritty, just mopey and grey. Batfleck had no energy outside of the Knightmare scene. And once again Superman barely interacts with anyone. The point of Clark is he stands up for what's right even in harsh times. I wish we could've seen that instead of him mostly staring at people silently for 2 movies

LOL, right? And something I would love to see, and I've said this after (again) both SR and MoS, is for the movie to start very grey and dark, and get brighter and more colorful in a slow and natural way as Superman's presence in people's lives inspires the city and it's citizens. Make him literally a "light to show the way" on a cinematic level, not just saying it because it sounds good and never really paying it off.

[manwhohaseverything]

It'd do better than you think, but of *course* those are the only two options and nuance and something in-between doesn't exist. As I've said before, I didn't want another Reeve re-hash. Doesn't mean the only other option was what I got.
:

In betweens don't work for many things.
"Superman isn't a one man vigilante force"
"Superman is a vigilante"
How can you do an in-between?Superman is partial vigilante?

No. But there's a difference between soul-searching and being devoid of any happiness. I like introspection but I don't think superman or most of the Snyder heroes really have much introspection

riiight,Asking whether existence of superman is Actually good or not is not introspection at all?

I liked Man of Steel more than most of Marvel's Phase 2. However BvS feels like a more ambitious Iron Man 2 but suffers the same core problems. The worldbuilding is a distraction not a benefit.

My interest in the Snyderverse is just sympathy for Snyder and Terrio. It's easier to take their side over the executives in Warner Brothers.

Beyond that I'm curious how it would've turned out but I'm not 100% that in love with his take on the characters.

pretty much this.These guys put in heart and soul into these.To do something.I appreciate the voice.