Lord Boros vs H/P Doomsday

[The Drunkard Kid]

Didn't Post-Crisis Superman need to train under Mongul Jr. to be able to consistently use super speed in combat? Did that happen before or after Hunter/Prey?

[big_adventure]

Nah mate.

Superman was so at a loss on how to beat DD that they dumped him into the end of time to be torn apart by the cosmic forces of the big crunch.

Superman, even amped by a Motherbox, was completely at a loss of how to do meaningful damage to him.

Alright, I graciously concede the point. Which DD story am I thinking of then? I know it was one of them. I thought it was the sequence where:

DD winds up on Apokalypse.

He messes it up pretty well.

He sends DD to the world that initially beat DD eons ago.

The light-based being (can't think of the name) that beat DD before obviously couldn't now.

DD was wrecking the planet.

Supes shows up, with the help of Waverider and a Mother Box. Supes charges DD with the "mach 10" blitz, he uses a sword, etc. There's some giant reactor thing that explodes (or doesn't explode? It's been a while).

Supes and DD fight. Supes isn't really doing damage to DD, but DD also can't really hurt Supes. Supes states "you will never be able to beat me now, because I've already killed you and you're afraid I'll do it again because you're somewhat sentient now" or something. Then they dump him. But I could easily be mixing two stories or confusing some details. Are some of those details things that happened in another DD story?

I'm going to have to search for this, aren't I?

[Captain Morgan]

The lines you quoted were from Our Worlds At War. Think it was Jeph Loeb. The fight didn't make a lot of sense-- over the course of the conversation Doomsday went from tanking a full on blitz from Clark to breaking his claws on Clark's chest. Apparently cuz he felt fear now.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

The lines you quoted were from Our Worlds At War. Think it was Jeph Loeb. The fight didn't make a lot of sense-- over the course of the conversation Doomsday went from tanking a full on blitz from Clark to breaking his claws on Clark's chest. Apparently cuz he felt fear now.

The S on Superman's chest stands for "Spooky".

[big_adventure]

The lines you quoted were from Our Worlds At War. Think it was Jeph Loeb. The fight didn't make a lot of sense-- over the course of the conversation Doomsday went from tanking a full on blitz from Clark to breaking his claws on Clark's chest. Apparently cuz he felt fear now.

THAT'S what it was.

Anyway, I just went back and read H/P. First off, 90's comics art is... wow, just wow. Anytime I look at 90's stuff, that's my thought.

Next, I got most of the story right! Except conflating the OWAW Doomsday's defeat with the H/P one. Mea culpa, as I've already stated.

Finally, Superman's feats in H/P are pretty sad, for Superman. He doesn't do anything at all on the level of what Boros can dish.

OTOH, DD wrecks the crap out of Darkseid. Darkseid, sadly, doesn't have great feats in the series either, but... it's Darkseid. He Omega's DD while monologueing. DD survives and attacks. Darkseid never lands another blow, getting sucker punched a few times and then stunned/KO'd/something that takes him out for a bit.

Anyway... I don't know. This stalemates or ends with DD floating through space until he gets sucked into the gravity well of a star and is atomized. Or something.

[Slade1]

That Superman, post resurrection, written by Bryne, was also the weakest version of Superman since, oh, the Golden Age, wasn't he? He needed a long run up to hit mach 10 flying and didn't really have strength feats on par with most high-end versions. Oh, and he still beat Doomsday.

He didn't beat Doomsday, he used Mother Box and Waverider's time tech to BFR into the Big Bang. Superman would have gotten killed otherwise.

[Bob74h]

Does doomsday even have planet level feats

[Captain Morgan]

THAT'S what it was.

Anyway, I just went back and read H/P. First off, 90's comics art is... wow, just wow. Anytime I look at 90's stuff, that's my thought.

Next, I got most of the story right! Except conflating the OWAW Doomsday's defeat with the H/P one. Mea culpa, as I've already stated.

Finally, Superman's feats in H/P are pretty sad, for Superman. He doesn't do anything at all on the level of what Boros can dish.

OTOH, DD wrecks the crap out of Darkseid. Darkseid, sadly, doesn't have great feats in the series either, but... it's Darkseid. He Omega's DD while monologueing. DD survives and attacks. Darkseid never lands another blow, getting sucker punched a few times and then stunned/KO'd/something that takes him out for a bit.

Anyway... I don't know. This stalemates or ends with DD floating through space until he gets sucked into the gravity well of a star and is atomized. Or something.

A weakened version of the Omega Beams instantly vaporized things Superman couldn't scratch in that story, and Doomsday took them full on unharmed as I recall.

The other thing is Doomsday developed a power that let him kill an energy being whose attacks were measured on... I want to say a continental scale? Can't remember with Radiant exactly. But if Boros can't end Doomsday or BFR him, I expect Doomsday would develop a counter eventually.

[big_adventure]

A weakened version of the Omega Beams instantly vaporized things Superman couldn't scratch in that story, and Doomsday took them full on unharmed as I recall.

The other thing is Doomsday developed a power that let him kill an energy being whose attacks were measured on... I want to say a continental scale? Can't remember with Radiant exactly. But if Boros can't end Doomsday or BFR him, I expect Doomsday would develop a counter eventually.

As far as Darkseid, that's close, but not exactly correct. DS is portrayed kind of all over the map, all in one issue.

He Worfs hard to DD. He fires what appears to be a "normal" Omega beam blast at DD. It smashes him back, all while DS is monologueing about how great he is. He, arrogantly, doesn't expect DD to get up, and says flat out that nothing can survive this, which might be foreshadowing to... all the beings that survive this from this moment forward. Anyway, DD heals or recovers or whatever, then attacks the gloating DS from behind. DS turns, and starts saying "you may have survived that shot, but that was from like 20 feet away. Nothing (seriously, this time) can survive it at point-blank ran..." He stops because DD gets bored listening and knees DS in the face. DS never throws a punch, never lands another shot, and this amount of hitting stuns him/KOs him a little I guess. We see him down on a monitor.

At the same time, Desaad calls the LSH, looking for help from Mr. Miracle or Lightray, who aren't currently members. However, Supes happens to be arriving just as this message arrives. Desaad isn't so stupid as to think that DS will let him keep his head if he asks Supes for help. Maxima says she'll being Supes to Apokalypse, Supes says he can fly there "now" if he only knew how to get there, and anyway, he needs to do this all by his big-boy self. Oberon gives Supes a Mother Box. Mother Sue Box opens a Boom Tube to get Supes to Apokalypse. During all of this time, DD was... chilling? Supes shows up. DS is standing when Supes is there, then... passes out again. Desaad sends DD to Calaton. Cyborg, who was using all of this to come back to life, has regenerated a body. He launches missiles at the population's food. Supes flys up to deal with them.

Supes can't even slow them down with flight. He can't punch through them. His heat vision, in the first of many abject failures here, fail to penetrate the missiles. This is a big chunk of Clark's pathetic feats in this arc. A weakened DS shoots some omega beams that waste the missiles easily. Why would someone make a missile casing that a strong Superman can't penetrate? Kind of the opposite, because unless it's a pure kinetic killer (useless against food), you need the casing to break up. Darkseid being beyond Supes is normal though. But hold on...

Supes flies down to Cyborg. Witty banter, blah blah blah. Their tussle starts, sneaky DS fires some Omega beams (after saying that he was leaving Cyborg to Clark). Clark grabs Cyborg and sticks him in the way of the Omega beams. Clark thoughts "they didn't even hit me but they still gave my arm an ouchie, Lois, please kiss it and make it better" but Cyborg is... largely unharmed. He shoots some heat vision at Supes. This makes Supes, um, madder, I guess, even though this whole arc is Supes alternating between rage and fear, so Supes says "this is pod racing... er... HEAT VISION" and shoots his heat vision. Which then proceeds to annihilate Cyborg's body, the one that was scarcely affected by DS' Omega beams. Contradicting what happened literally seconds before, completely. Cyborg makes a better body, though, as he's linked to DS' tech. Those intervening seconds, though, were evidently enough to restore DS to his "full power" so he shoots some more Omega beams, which utterly annihilate Cyborg. Kind of. Clark gets all pissed off that DS killed Cyborg, even though Clark, not 15 panels earlier, literally pushed Cyborg's body directly into the path of the Omega beams himself, which he clearly expected to annihilate the guy. Hmmmm...

Clark boom-tubes away to Calaton with Waverider. We find out that the Omega beams, a few seconds after failing, didn't kill Cyborg, rather, they imprisoned him in a cool little marble. Which seems like it would have been an epic trick to use against DD.

The Radiant thing is a bit suspect as well. The first Radiant was the combined life force of the planet's royal family thousands of years ago. It fought DD for a week, being basically immune to damage because it seems like he was smart enough to play keep-away and doing... evidently not much as the battle went on for that week. I guess that original Radiant finally got bored, and unleashed his maximum power blast, which killed/KO'd DD and destroyed 1/5th of the habitable surface of the planet.

New Radiant, though? He's an idiot. Despite being able to fly and knowing what it took to kill/KO DD last time, he doesn't do that, rather he shoots some weak blasts that do jack squat, flies too close, lets himself get grabbed, gets thrown, does it again, gets thrown, then unleashes "maximum power" which... doesn't destroy any substantial portion of the planet at all. DD jumps up and swipes right on, er, swipes through Radiant, ripping Radiant in half. Radiant, notably, didn't decide that dodging would ever be a good idea - he's evidently a fan of TFS Gohan.

Anyway, feats are just all over the place in this series. If you count what DD does to Darkseid as doing that to actual Darkseid, he's a collossal force. But DS isn't really at his best in this series. Clark himself is all over the place. DD himself does the DS stuff, but lands a bunch of hits on Clark that don't insta kill or KO him (granted, part of that is Mother Sue... er... Box). DD also has significant struggles smashing up the power reactor McGuffin thing that would destroy Calaton. Of course, DD also fires claw ropes that go straight through Clark's shoulder, and he breaks Clark's Schwarzenegger Plus Plus sized arm, then makes it worse by breaking it more. DD also just kind of stands there while Clark grabs Waverider's bedazzled bracelet and slips it on DD's spike, and also gives Mother Box the time to reprogram the thing to send DD back in time.

Ugh. Lots of ugh.

[Aura Blaize]

I think one thing should be said about Boros. He took MULTIPLE punches from a guy who, up until that fight, ended all of his fights with one punch. Saitama actually blitzed him with said punches. It took a considerable amount of them to have the same effect that he normally would have from one punch. And Boros regenerated from that almost instantly. That has to say something about his durability.

[big_adventure]

I think one thing should be said about Boros. He took MULTIPLE punches from a guy who, up until that fight, ended all of his fights with one punch. Saitama actually blitzed him with said punches. It took a considerable amount of them to have the same effect that he normally would have from one punch. And Boros regenerated from that almost instantly. That has to say something about his durability.

That's all very true, however, it really doesn't matter here. Doomsday will never, ever be able to hit Boros in a Rumbles fight. At all. Ever. The speed difference is positively monstrous.

[Muadib]

That's all very true, however, it really doesn't matter here. Doomsday will never, ever be able to hit Boros in a Rumbles fight. At all. Ever. The speed difference is positively monstrous.

Couldnt Doomsday...evolve the speed during the fight. I mean he evolves counters to his opponents and environment. If he's being consistently blitzed, wouldnt his power set speed him up to cope with that? I'm just spitballing here.

[Captain Morgan]

Couldnt Doomsday...evolve the speed during the fight. I mean he evolves counters to his opponents and environment. If he's being consistently blitzed, wouldnt his power set speed him up to cope with that? I'm just spitballing here.

I think it is more likely this version would develop some kind of aura that drains or negates the power coming off Boros... Assuming he survives that long/doesn't get launched into space.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

I think it is more likely this version would develop some kind of aura that drains or negates the power coming off Boros... Assuming he survives that long/doesn't get launched into space.

I see it going similar to the fight with The Radiant. He got bodied in the first encounter, recovered, and the manhandled The Radiant in their second encounter.

So for the purpose of the Rumble, H/P probably loses.

[Captain Morgan]

I see it going similar to the fight with The Radiant. He got bodied in the first encounter, recovered, and the manhandled The Radiant in their second encounter.

So for the purpose of the Rumble, H/P probably loses.

Yeah, I think that's probably about right. Lord Boros has a lot of similarities to Radiant. Doomsday is a bad character for rumbles. He excels at rematches, has a million different versions who often have different powers all together, but few of them have super speed or flight so BFR remains a consistent weakness for him.