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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by HypnoHustler View Post
    Challenge accepted. Come up with 10 funny quips about Kingpin that don’t reference his weight (maybe we should also take him being rich off the table… we wouldn’t want to hurt rich people’s feelings either)

    And… go.
    You are exactly right. Jerry Seinfeld warned about the woke thought police and their adverse effect on comedy. It is a disgusting thought but Classic movies like Animal House cannot be made today. Think of when Dean Wormer ( talk about a perfect name) talked about Flounder being Going through life Fat and stupid” and Flounder threw up on him. One of the funniest moments in Motion Picture History and it would be a no no because someone who is hypersensitive is offended. Same applies to Kingpin: A corrupt, rich evil and yes fat politician. Sorry if I have no sympathy for his weight being mocked. Think of all the bad things he has done to Peter, Matt and countless others.
    Last edited by NC_Yankee; 06-10-2021 at 05:33 AM.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    You are exactly right. Jerry Seinfeld warned about the woke thought police and their adverse effect on comedy. Think about it. Classic movies like Animal House cannot be made today. Think of when Dean Wormer ( talk about a perfect name) talked about Flounder being “Fat and stupid” and Flounder threw up on him. One of the funniest moments in Motion Picture History and it would be a no no because someone who is hypersensitive is offended. Same applies to Kingpin: A corrupt, rich evil and yes fat politician. Sorry if I have no sympathy for his weight being mocked. Think of all the bad things he has done to Peter, Matt and countless others.
    Don't even get me started on Blazing Saddles.

  3. #78
    Ultimate Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Sometimes, I forget how reactionary folks can be.

    But hey as long as we get our low hanging jibes about fictional fat people all is well.

    Blazing Saddles is amazing but overt sensitivity is not why it wouldn't get made today, and the 'woke police' don't have quite the influence that people are attributing to it. common decency does, however.

    Anyway, as I am not a professional author nor writing Spider-Man, and there are already numerous examples in the books of having fun at his expense that the low hanging fruit of fat jokes is rarely gonna be as necessary and funny as a bunch of reactionaries think it is.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingkalamari View Post
    For people complaining about overt sensitivity this is a completely fruitless topic, since Parker can only engage with Kingpin via proxy anyway since CZ gets the first call on him in DD, if you're caught up on ASM you should know that since we just had the big Kingpin arc with no Kingpin/Spidey direct interactions, I can only assume this topic is brought up because of Slott's tweet.

    I dont know how many times this needs to be said but comedy is ever evolving and always evolving and the do's and don'ts will always change, especially in a risk aversive all ages book like ASM.
    Except the “do’s” never grow, but the “dont’s” list always grows until everything will be deemed offensive one day.

    And Spidey hasn’t been “all ages” since Kraven swallowed the business end of a shotgun.

    Plus, if none of that reaches you, it's been done. It's tiresome af, you can read the old comics if those are your digs, that was the time and place for them.
    Maybe, maybe not… I can see a not-far-off future where old issues are permanently taken out of print the same way old episodes of ‘30 Rock’, ‘Community’ and ‘It’s Always Sunny…’ were scrubbed from streaming services last year. You literally can no longer watch them.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    You are exactly right. Jerry Seinfeld warned about the woke thought police and their adverse effect on comedy. Think about it. Classic movies like Animal House cannot be made today. Think of when Dean Wormer ( talk about a perfect name) talked about Flounder being “Fat and stupid” and Flounder threw up on him. One of the funniest moments in Motion Picture History and it would be a no no because someone who is hypersensitive is offended. Same applies to Kingpin: A corrupt, rich evil and yes fat politician. Sorry if I have no sympathy for his weight being mocked. Think of all the bad things he has done to Peter, Matt and countless others.
    Jerry Seinfeld also dated a high schooler when he was 39, perhaps he's not the best person to have a opinion on the matter.

    Animal House has had several decades worth of successor frat boy comedies that all did the same jokes, it wore itself into the ground. It's legacy is immense but if you keep doing the same jokes over and over, it wears itself into the ground, and simply becomes terrible and easy writing, not to mention at some point antiquated. These things dont simply happen once and disperse, the same thing for comics. There's a reason Deadpool currently doesnt have an ongoing after spending the 2010s as potentially the most highest selling and successful solo Marvel character, his shtick burned out many after excess amounts of exposure to him.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    I mean, seriously, if you can't think of a way to insult the frigging Kingpin that doesn't really on the fact that he's big, I honestly don't know what to say to that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Anyway, as I am not a professional author nor writing Spider-Man, and there are already numerous examples in the books of having fun at his expense that the low hanging fruit of fat jokes is rarely gonna be as necessary and funny as a bunch of reactionaries think it is.
    So in other words you can’t do the thing that you said was so easy you “honestly don’t know what to say” to anyone who couldn’t.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by HypnoHustler View Post
    Except the “do’s” never grow, but the “dont’s” list always grows until everything will be deemed offensive one day.

    And Spidey hasn’t been “all ages” since Kraven swallowed the business end of a shotgun.



    Maybe, maybe not… I can see a not-far-off future where old issues are permanently taken out of print the same way old episodes of ‘30 Rock’, ‘Community’ and ‘It’s Always Sunny…’ were scrubbed from streaming services last year. You literally can no longer watch them.
    The do's totally grow. You're just not looking in the right places. In comics, Hellions is the funniest Marvel book by a longshot. (Written by Zeb Wells, famous for a writer on Robot Chicken, who did make jokes that punch down but has since grown as a writer and can make the funniest comic in a hot minute without needing any low hanging fruit)

    ASM is for sure all ages. A few shockingly dark moments against decades of a run doesnt detract the fact it appeals to children/teens/adults alike, those moments are made to appeal to older readers. X-Force, Daredevil, and Immortal Hulk by contrast are much more explictly shown to be for mature audiences, and the violence and gore in those series blow anything ASM has done out of the water by a longshot.

    You can still watch any of those episodes if you had them on blu-ray/DVD, frankly that's more a criticism of streaming culture than any degree of censorship since it's a private company making their own buisness decisions. If you dont like it dont engage. Physical media is always better imo, but in terms of censorship its simply sky is falling nonsense. If you want real censorship issues look at Sam Raimi almost facing jailtime for obscenity laws in the UK for the violence in Evil Dead by the government, that happened 40 years ago and if select instances were a precursor to overreaching censorship, we'd already be there.
    Last edited by Kingkalamari; 06-10-2021 at 06:07 AM.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by HypnoHustler View Post
    So in other words you can’t do the thing that you said was so easy you “honestly don’t know what to say” to anyone who couldn’t.
    No, I'm just not going to indulge you. That's the difference. If you want examples, they're out there. I mean, there were already two examples in the thread. XD

    Edit: fine. I'll give you one: "hey, did you hear about the Kingpins new police protection racket? Yeah, they call it 'Stop and Fisk'"
    Last edited by Tendrin; 06-10-2021 at 06:07 AM.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingkalamari View Post
    Jerry Seinfeld also dated a high schooler when he was 39, perhaps he's not the best person to have a opinion on the matter.

    Animal House has had several decades worth of successor frat boy comedies that all did the same jokes, it wore itself into the ground. It's legacy is immense but if you keep doing the same jokes over and over, it wears itself into the ground, and simply becomes terrible and easy writing, not to mention at some point antiquated. These things dont simply happen once and disperse, the same thing for comics. There's a reason Deadpool currently doesnt have an ongoing after spending the 2010s as potentially the most highest selling and successful solo Marvel character, his shtick burned out many after excess amounts of exposure to him.
    The entire point is if the Thought Police were as prevalent in 1979 as 2021 Animal House is not getting green lit. Same for Trading Places.( 1983). Randolph Duke using the “N” word and Mortimer Duke agreeing with him. Not to mention the idea of Beeks being raped by a male gorilla. I know the N Word is bad but it’s use was necessary for Valentine ( Eddie Murphy) to hear it so he could learn that he and Louis Winthorpe were both being used and without Valentine hearing it, Louis ( Dan Aykroyd) would have committed Suicide ( it was Valentine who saved him), Valentine would have been back in the streets and the Duke’s would win.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    The entire point is if the Thought Police were as prevalent in 1979 as 2021 Animal House is not getting green lit. Same for Trading Places.( 1983). Randolph Duke using the “N” word and Mortimer Duke agreeing with him. Not to mention the idea of Beeks being raped by a male gorilla. I know the N Word is bad but it’s use was necessary for Valentine ( Eddie Murphy) to hear it so he could learn that he and Louis Winthorpe were both being used and without Valentine hearing it, Louis ( Dan Aykroyd) would have committed Suicide ( it was Valentine who saved him), Valentine would have been back in the streets and the Duke’s would win.
    My last post I mentioned Sam Raimi nearly faced jailtime for the Evil Dead because of obscenity laws, that was 1981 and is far more extreme than anything in modern day that is being presented as censorship.

    You also miss my point that you keep referring to decade old movies that had decades of movies that were inspired by them/ripped them off and ran the joke formats to the ground, on top of social normalities changing. There were people in the late 70s/early 80s griping about new comedy not resembling the 1940s/50s comedies just as people now complain about modern comedy not resembling something from 40 years ago. It's the progress of time and the evolution of pop culture, it's nothing new whatsoever.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingkalamari View Post
    My last post I mentioned Sam Raimi nearly faced jailtime for the Evil Dead because of obscenity laws, that was 1981 and is far more extreme than anything in modern day that is being presented as censorship.

    You also miss my point that you keep referring to decade old movies that had decades of movies that were inspired by them/ripped them off and ran the joke formats to the ground, on top of social normalities changing. There were people in the late 70s/early 80s griping about new comedy not resembling the 1940s/50s comedies just as people now complain about modern comedy not resembling something from 40 years ago. It's the progress of time and the evolution of pop culture, it's nothing new whatsoever.
    What is coming out in Hollywood and music is not progress, I argue it is far worse. Take music. Does anyone actually think Lady Gaga’s music is on the level of Led Zeppelin or Elvis? Most people who have heard all three do not, but she won more competitive Grammy’s then Zeppelin and Elvis put together. Take Hollywood is there anyone except perhaps Dwayne Johnson that people would pay to see at the movies? I remember when guys like Will Smith, Arnie, Cruise or Stallone could sell a film all on their own ( it is also why people like John Wayne who died over 40 years ago are still popular). Taking this to Spider-Man, there is Marvel Adventures for the kids, let’s have something like DC’s Black Label so if adults want to see fat quips about Fisk and other non PC stuff they have the opportunity. ps. If it is okay for Captain America to be a Nazi then why not Fisk to be fat?

  12. #87
    Ultimate Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NC_Yankee View Post
    What is coming out in Hollywood and music is not progress, I argue it is far worse. Take music. Does anyone actually think Lady Gaga’s music is on the level of Led Zeppelin or Elvis? Most people who have heard all three do not, but she won more competitive Grammy’s then Zeppelin and Elvis put together. Take Hollywood is there anyone except perhaps Dwayne Johnson that people would pay to see at the movies? I remember when guys like Will Smith, Arnie, Cruise or Stallone could sell a film all on their own ( it is also why people like John Wayne who died over 40 years ago are still popular). Taking this to Spider-Man, there is Marvel Adventures for the kids, let’s have something like DC’s Black Label so if adults want to see fat quips about Fisk and other non PC stuff they have the opportunity. [/quoteps. If it is okay for Captain America to be a Nazi then why not Fisk to be fat?
    Honestly, dude. You just sound old. I don't mean that meanly. You just sound no different than any other 'back in the day' sort, and I think it shows that you're used to feeling like your tastes were better catered to. I think you could do with some examination on that front.

    What you're feeling, though, isn't new.

    Anyway, being a nazi is a choice. Being fat frequently isn't.
    Last edited by Tendrin; 06-10-2021 at 07:18 AM.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Anyway, being a nazi is a choice. Being fat frequently isn't.
    Um, yeah it is… you do know there’s these things called ‘gyms’ and ‘diets’, right? It’s hard to lose weight and get in shape, but millions of people do it every year. It’s a hard choice, but it’s definitely a choice.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by HypnoHustler View Post
    Um, yeah it is… you do know there’s these things called ‘gyms’ and ‘diets’, right? It’s hard to lose weight and get in shape, but millions of people do it every year. It’s a hard choice, but it’s definitely a choice.
    I'm really unsurprised by the illiteracy of this post. There are a *lot* of reasons someone can be fat and it doesn't always come down to a lack of motivation to diet and exercise.

  15. #90
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    This is an occassion for me to be the guy who leaves the board for a couple of days and finds discussion going way off-topic. How is any of this stuff pertain to the stuff in Spencer's ASM?

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