Rumblers League Round 2: Jcogginsa vs TheBookDragon

[KJS]

Here we go!

Voting and debate rules:

- To avoid mass unreadable debate, each participant is allowed 8 posts to make their argument in their matches.
- Each match is open for discussion for 72 hours.
- Once all match discussions are over, vote threads will be posted on Thursday with polls (we have special dispensation from the board to allow polls). These will last for two days.

JCOG
Jean Grey (10) w/ Shocked by Genetically Altered Eels (7) & Staff of Devosynn, The 2)
Flash (9) w/ Mimetic Polyalloy Upgrade (6), Terrigenesis upgrade, Joey Gutierrez (4), Medusa's Head w/ Bag (9) & Kungai Demon's Tak Horn (2)
Cyborg (7) w/ Mutari Generator, The (3), Protection Amulet (5), Terrigenesis upgrade, Yo-Yo (5) & Sarcophagus Crystal (2)
Adam Monroe (2) w/ Draconian Katra (2) & Neuralyzer (6)
Hal Jordan (9) w/ Band of Blacknil (2)
Ares (8) w/ Soul Stone, The (4) & Power-Sucking Athame (6)
Godzilla (Final Wars) 10
vs
BOOKDRAGON
Godzilla (10)
Kong (10) w/ ALZ-112 Exposure (1), AT-M6 (4) & Ghost Rider Contract (7)
Skullcrawler (7) w/ Leviathan Possession (7)
Smaug (6) w/ Cursed Aztec Gold Coin (4) & Exposure to Parallax Energy (4)
Indominus Rex (5) w/ Hollow Symbiote (9), Nanogenes (7), Jumanji (3) & Sorting Hat (1)
Xenomorph (3) w/ Gamma Mutation (Dog) (6) & Immortality (4)
Blue (2) w/ Vampirism Infection (4) & Radioactive Spider Bite (5)
Shelob (1) w/ Metebelis Crystal (5), Monsterpocalypse Chemical Mutation (3) & NZT-48 Pills + Injection (7)

[KJS]

OPENING MOVES

Cyborg will engage with the Indominus Rex, using the Mutari Generator to drain the Hollow into it. The Mutari generator opens a portal to a negatively charged dimension, so not only will it naturally suck in the Hollow's energies, the Hollow's own desire for power will draw it in. Last fight there was some debate of how exactly the Mutari Generator worked. I was able to verify the wiki's claims using the video Tomzilla posted. The explanation comes when Wesley shows Angel the gun, about 32 minutes in. While he's doing this, he'll also use his technopathy to command the indominus' nanogenes to destroy it. With Cyborg's super speed, he'll be able to reach the Idominus fairly quickly. Once Cyborg has taken care of the hollow, he will then proceed to Kong, using his technopathy to take control of the AT-M6, to set Kong up for using the Mutari Generator to drain his hellfire. Even if the Mutari Generator were incapable of draining that much energy, the Pocket dimension no contains the Hollow, effectively adding it's magic draining abilities to the Mutari Generators. Once both of these are accomplished, Cyborg will take his time draining other magic users as needed, starting with the Skullcrawlers.

Jean Grey will psychically attack all of the opposing team except Kong and the Skull Crawler. She will freeze them in place. Even Shelob's new mental abilities should not be enough to over come her, but if they are she will prioritize Shelob.

Hal Jordan will fly around, using his ring to dimension dump fighters starting with Shelob. His order of targeting will be Shelob then Smaug then Godzilla then Kong then the Skullcrawler then the Indominus then Blue then the Xenomorph, skipping over any already defeated.

Godzilla will be using his atomic breath to blast the Kaiju sized enemies back as they approach. Given the power he's shown, he should be able to halt just about any charge

Barry Allen will first carry Adam Monroe to the opposing Godzilla's feet, in order to allow Adam to apply the Draconian Katra to switch with Godzilla's, then bring Ares there to absorb Godzilla's soul into the Athame. Adam-In-Godzilla will then join my Godzilla in blasting other Kaiju. Barry will then speed around with Ares, stabbing enemies with the Tak Horn while also petrifying them with Medusa's head. Ares will steal their souls with the Soul Stone and play defense with his powers. The Leviathan will be their first Target

[KJS]

TheBookDragon v Jcogginsa

Shelob
Shelob will be linking everyone’s minds together, allowing it to direct and enhance team efficiency. It will also blast psychic energy at any enemies that are winning there fights or are trying to escape.

The NZT-48 Pills + Injection will allow him to multi task and predict the enemies movements.

Godzilla VS Godzilla
The two Godzillas will be drawn to each other, as they are both used to fighting monsters of the same size. Their fight will turn into a battle of attrition, meaning that Godzilla (MonsterVerse) will win, because it will be healing from the ambient radiation of the other Godzilla. This means that many Godzilla (Final Wars) most powerful radiation based attacks will only heal Godzilla (MonsterVerse).

Hal Jordan VS Smaug
Hal Jordan was fairly evenly matched with Hector Hammond while he was infused with the Parallax Energy. Smaug will be even more powerful, because he will induce more fear. And do to having a powerful mind.
First Smaug is scarcer then Hector. During their fight Hal was more interested in saving Hector then being afraid of him. Hal still saw Hector as a loser from school, and Hector had that self image of himself as well. Smaug is powerful and he knows it, he liked causing fear in people around him.
Second, the ambient fear should be greater than in Hal battle Hector Hammond. With the Amazons, and all the animals all being afraid of the monsters that have just arrived on their island.
Third, Smaug will try to keep Hal in the atmosphere, and avoid going into space. If the battle does go into space, he isn’t going to go near any stars, or black holes.

Adam Monroe VS Blue
Blue is fast, and has amazing jumping powers. Blue will target Adam charging close enough to leap and decapitate him. If Blue misses or if Adam fails to be decapitated, then blue will call on his bats to help him attack. The bats will hamper any use of Draconian Katra or the Neuralyzer while latching on to him and drinking his blood. While they are doing this Blue will also be eating parts off of Adam.

Indominus Rex VS Jean Grey and everyone
Indominus Rex will use the power it has taken from Jumanji, to create a vortex pulling in all of the enemy team, with a extra focus on Jean. There are feats of Jumanji pulling in multiple people, selectively choosing it’s targets, and bring in objects that weren’t related to it.
The range limit might be a debatable point, as the people that it absorbed were within the same room as it, but it absorbed all the animals, and things that it had released from how ever far away they were. (Presumable around the city and outlying areas, more then five miles)
The Hollow Symbiote should be able to work even without a working mind in the Indominus Rex because the Nanogenes will keep the body alive. And the Hollow Symbiote only switched bodies after the host died.


Ares VS Kong
Kong will focus on catching Ares. Kong will also cover himself in soul burning fire, and have the AT-M6 firing Hell fire shots, to weaken Ares enough to allow Kong to use the penance stare on Ares. The penance stare should be very effective on Ares, as it will burn based on the number of sins he has committed, such as murder, and cruelty.


Cyborg VS Skullcrawler + Xenomorph
Skullcrawler and the Xenomorph will be fighting together against Cyborg. Together they should be able to keep Cyborg busy until other people can come and join the fight. Though Cyborg has ranged attacks and can enhanced strength both Skullcrawler and the Xenomorph will come back from any wounds that they suffer. The Skullcrawler will burrow onder the ground and try to get surprise attacks on Cyborg. If the Xenomorph can explode near Cyborg it may cause temporary problems for the metal or human parts of him, if the Skullcrawler can damage the flesh it can inject black Leviathan blood into him and kill him that way.

Flash VS. Shelob and Team
The one weakness to exploit against the Flash is that he will have to stop long enough for the Medusa's Head to work. The Tak horn was only seen only shown work once, so hopefully even if he can stab someone with it, it won’t be a good constant weapon. Whenever Flash stops Shelob will mind blast him, and direct the others to attack him, based on how the fights are going.

After Indominus Rex absorbs Jean Grey, it will release the hunter from Jumanji. The Hunter always knew, and felt a compelled to hunt Alan Parrish, because he rolled the dice. In this case the Hunter would be targeting Flash, and Shelob would link to the hunters mind allowing it to now where the Flash is. Even if it didn’t allow Shelob to attack real time, it would allow him to predict the movement and set up optimum counter strikes it the moments when the Flash slows down or attacks.

Second Strike
Each team member after defeating their target will move on to help the members that are in the most trouble. The attacks will be coordinated allowing Shelob to give them insights on where they are needed and how to attack.

Final Strike
If the Flash has evaded all the attacks, and the rest of the team has won, or lost. The team will use large the area attacks to destroy the island and all life on it. Godzilla will blast radiation beams, Kong and AT-M6 will be firing lots of soul attacks, Smoug will bath the land in fire and Parallax Energy, Shelob will blast psychic energy. If they attack together then it will hit the flash or force him to leave the island.

[The MunchKING]

I haven't seen the Flash TV show, did Barry have feats of carrying people around at Super speed?

[Darth Drizzle]

I haven't seen the Flash TV show, did Barry have feats of carrying people around at Super speed?

Wrong Flash. He has DCEU Flash from the movies.

[The MunchKING]

Wrong Flash. He has DCEU Flash from the movies.

Fair enough. I haven't seen that one either.

[TheBookDragon]

Alright I see several flaws with Jcogginsa's strategy.
First the Mutari generator takes time to aim and fire the energy that it used wasn’t instantaneous, this means Cyborg may be able to aim and fire faster then normal but the beam will still take a while to drain powers out of the Indominus Rex. This means that Cyborg will be siting still while waiting for the Mutari generator to hit the target and then to see if it worked.

the Hollow's own desire for power will draw it in.

Second, we only saw the Mutari generator drain her innate power, and don’t have any evidence that it would work on an externally generated power source like the Hollow. I’m not sure why you would think that the Hollow would see a void universe as a power. More likely it would try to copy the powers of the Mutari generator, how it functioned (Magic or Science) was not explained in the Angel show. If the Hollow couldn’t it couldn’t copy the powers I don’t think that it would abandoned a host without a greater host to take it.

Once Cyborg has taken care of the hollow, he will then proceed to Kong, using his technopathy to take control of the AT-M6

Has Cyborg taken control of any semi living technology? Because the AT-M6 isn’t just technology, it’s infused with the soul of vengeance. Ghost Rider has also be shown to control his vehicle even when it isn’t infused with his power so even if Cyborg tries to control it will still be a contest of wills.

Hal Jordan will fly around, using his ring to dimension dump fighters starting with Shelob. His order of targeting will be Shelob then Smaug then Godzilla then Kong then the Skullcrawler then the Indominus then Blue then the Xenomorph, skipping over any already defeated.

The Band of Blacknil were only spoken to help the demon travel to the earth, and to return. What we saw wasn’t nearly so impressive. The demon appeared wearing the ring but when Angel put on the ring, a member of Wolfram & Hart offered Angel a ride on an elevator, where they talked for a while the elevator went down, only to arrive right back where they started.

Also Angel had to wear the ring, not aim and point or any area of effect. So at best Hal would need to put the ring on the enemy to dimension dump them and then the ring is gone.

The feats don’t support its dimension dump abilities, and they don’t support reusing on multiple people, or effecting multiple people in a single use.


There are some things that will help my strategy here.

Cyborg positioned himself right near the Indominus Rex, and waiting for the Mutari generator to work. Indominus Rex is opening a portal to the Jumanji world. Meaning that the Cyborg should be an easy target, and close enough that the range shouldn’t need to be argued.

Adam Monroe is braving to the side of Godzilla's feet, where if he doesn’t get stepped on then Blue should decapitate him before the transfer is over. That wasn’t a fast transfer, and Faith had to hold Buffy’s had as she tried to break loss. So if Blue is attacking, or Godzilla steps away then the transfer will be broken.

Godzilla is facing Godzilla which will lead to my Godzilla winning.

Hal’s first target was Shelob leaving allowing Smaug to get the jump on him.

Won’t using the Medusa's head cause them to have to stop and wait for people to focus on it, possibly even take some time for the effects to start. How fast did it effect someone. Each stop means possible time to target them.

[Jcogginsa]

Alright I see several flaws with Jcogginsa's strategy.
First the Mutari generator takes time to aim and fire the energy that it used wasn’t instantaneous, this means Cyborg may be able to aim and fire faster then normal but the beam will still take a while to drain powers out of the Indominus Rex. This means that Cyborg will be siting still while waiting for the Mutari generator to hit the target and then to see if it worked.



Second, we only saw the Mutari generator drain her innate power, and don’t have any evidence that it would work on an externally generated power source like the Hollow. I’m not sure why you would think that the Hollow would see a void universe as a power. More likely it would try to copy the powers of the Mutari generator, how it functioned (Magic or Science) was not explained in the Angel show. If the Hollow couldn’t it couldn’t copy the powers I don’t think that it would abandoned a host without a greater host to take it.



Has Cyborg taken control of any semi living technology? Because the AT-M6 isn’t just technology, it’s infused with the soul of vengeance. Ghost Rider has also be shown to control his vehicle even when it isn’t infused with his power so even if Cyborg tries to control it will still be a contest of wills.



The Band of Blacknil were only spoken to help the demon travel to the earth, and to return. What we saw wasn’t nearly so impressive. The demon appeared wearing the ring but when Angel put on the ring, a member of Wolfram & Hart offered Angel a ride on an elevator, where they talked for a while the elevator went down, only to arrive right back where they started.

Also Angel had to wear the ring, not aim and point or any area of effect. So at best Hal would need to put the ring on the enemy to dimension dump them and then the ring is gone.

The feats don’t support its dimension dump abilities, and they don’t support reusing on multiple people, or effecting multiple people in a single use.


There are some things that will help my strategy here.

Cyborg positioned himself right near the Indominus Rex, and waiting for the Mutari generator to work. Indominus Rex is opening a portal to the Jumanji world. Meaning that the Cyborg should be an easy target, and close enough that the range shouldn’t need to be argued.

Adam Monroe is braving to the side of Godzilla's feet, where if he doesn’t get stepped on then Blue should decapitate him before the transfer is over. That wasn’t a fast transfer, and Faith had to hold Buffy’s had as she tried to break loss. So if Blue is attacking, or Godzilla steps away then the transfer will be broken.

Godzilla is facing Godzilla which will lead to my Godzilla winning.

Hal’s first target was Shelob leaving allowing Smaug to get the jump on him.

Won’t using the Medusa's head cause them to have to stop and wait for people to focus on it, possibly even take some time for the effects to start. How fast did it effect someone. Each stop means possible time to target them.

1. So? The Indominus isn't fast enough to react in that time, and will be getting torn about by it's own nanomachines
2. It's a negatively charged universe. charge is energy, and the Hollow wants to absorb energy
3. Considering Kong will be busy with two Godzilla's at that point, a contest of wills is unlikely to be something it will win
4. God, the buffy wiki is freaking Worthless
5. The portal to the Jumanji World is not going to open faster than the Mutari Generator does.
6. You're assuming Barry stops on the side of Godzilla that Blue is on, rather than any other place outside of Blue's eye sight.
7. Your Godzilla is weaker than mine, and also rapidly going to be on my side thanks to the Katra
8. Assuming Smaug's mind is even active at that point
9. Technically only the Medusa Head needs to stop, so holding it up to the enemy's eyeline, then moving away long enough for it to take effect, then retrieving the head is perfectly valid

[TheBookDragon]

1. So? The Indominus isn't fast enough to react in that time, and will be getting torn about by it's own nanomachines

If the Nanogenes go rouge we don’t have any feats of them killing (And the modifications that they made often took time). They simply made normal people into combat ready mind controlled slaves. So if Cyborg tries to make them kill him, I don’t think they would. And if they try to control him to turn on the team the Hollow will still absorb everyone.

5. The portal to the Jumanji World is not going to open faster than the Mutari Generator does.

The Mutari generator takes about ten seconds from being fired until it drained Illyria. The best feat of Jumanji disintegrating people starts only six seconds after Alan says Jumanji and triggers the game to start pulling everything (game related) into it. Though it did pull in a non-game bullet and gun showing that it can effect non-game objects and people. The feat of the Jumanji game pulling Alan into the game was eleven seconds from the time he read effects of his roll. When it pulled four people into it, from the first person starting to disintegrating until the last person was fully disintegrated was in about twenty seconds.

This means that the time it takes for Cyborg to fire the Mutari generator is long enough that Jumanji would already have pulled him into it.

2. It's a negatively charged universe. charge is energy, and the Hollow wants to absorb energy

The hollow isn’t going to leave a host without a better host that has killed it’s previous host. So Indominus Rex can and will survive. While taking out Cyborg.

3. Considering Kong will be busy with two Godzilla's at that point, a contest of wills is unlikely to be something it will win
…
6. You're assuming Barry stops on the side of Godzilla that Blue is on, rather than any other place outside of Blue's eye sight.

The Draconian Katra took eight seconds after the connection was made, that is a long time in combat. Assuming Godzilla isn’t going to move his feet while fighting, Blue could loop around and attack in that time. Also Blue has the Radioactive Spider Bite which will help his reaction speed, and Agility. This should help him to locate Adam and take him out before the transfer is complete.

7. Your Godzilla is weaker than mine, and also rapidly going to be on my side thanks to the Katra

Blue’s eaten Adam negating the threat of my Godzilla turning, and my Godzilla will be eating your Godzilla’s radiation allowing it to heal constantly while damage inflicted to yours will remain.

9. Technically only the Medusa Head needs to stop, so holding it up to the enemy's eyeline, then moving away long enough for it to take effect, then retrieving the head is perfectly valid

Ha, half my team would probably eat a falling head without any more provocation then movement in their peripheral vision. You said that the first target of the Tak Horn while also petrifying them with Medusa's head was the Leviathan.

The Skullcrawlers (the host of the Leviathan) doesn’t hunt with sight, it uses its other senses much more because it was subterraneous. The Tak Horn was only shown to work on a humanoid auction demon that didn’t show any special power. Leviathan’s were immortal (in the fact they wouldn’t die of old age) so the Tak Horn that drains life force will be unable to drain it’s life. Most likely will overload the magical nature of the item, or will simply be unable to do anything to it.

8. Assuming Smaug's mind is even active at that point

Did we ever see Jean engage in a mental battle, besides the time when she linked into the fight between Professor X and Apocalypse. Given that it implied that was linking into Professor X’s mind to join that fight.

[Jcogginsa]

If the Nanogenes go rouge we don’t have any feats of them killing (And the modifications that they made often took time). They simply made normal people into combat ready mind controlled slaves. So if Cyborg tries to make them kill him, I don’t think they would. And if they try to control him to turn on the team the Hollow will still absorb everyone.



The Mutari generator takes about ten seconds from being fired until it drained Illyria. The best feat of Jumanji disintegrating people starts only six seconds after Alan says Jumanji and triggers the game to start pulling everything (game related) into it. Though it did pull in a non-game bullet and gun showing that it can effect non-game objects and people. The feat of the Jumanji game pulling Alan into the game was eleven seconds from the time he read effects of his roll. When it pulled four people into it, from the first person starting to disintegrating until the last person was fully disintegrated was in about twenty seconds.

This means that the time it takes for Cyborg to fire the Mutari generator is long enough that Jumanji would already have pulled him into it.



The hollow isn’t going to leave a host without a better host that has killed it’s previous host. So Indominus Rex can and will survive. While taking out Cyborg.



The Draconian Katra took eight seconds after the connection was made, that is a long time in combat. Assuming Godzilla isn’t going to move his feet while fighting, Blue could loop around and attack in that time. Also Blue has the Radioactive Spider Bite which will help his reaction speed, and Agility. This should help him to locate Adam and take him out before the transfer is complete.



Blue’s eaten Adam negating the threat of my Godzilla turning, and my Godzilla will be eating your Godzilla’s radiation allowing it to heal constantly while damage inflicted to yours will remain.




Ha, half my team would probably eat a falling head without any more provocation then movement in their peripheral vision. You said that the first target of the Tak Horn while also petrifying them with Medusa's head was the Leviathan.

The Skullcrawlers (the host of the Leviathan) doesn’t hunt with sight, it uses its other senses much more because it was subterraneous. The Tak Horn was only shown to work on a humanoid auction demon that didn’t show any special power. Leviathan’s were immortal (in the fact they wouldn’t die of old age) so the Tak Horn that drains life force will be unable to drain it’s life. Most likely will overload the magical nature of the item, or will simply be unable to do anything to it.



Did we ever see Jean engage in a mental battle, besides the time when she linked into the fight between Professor X and Apocalypse. Given that it implied that was linking into Professor X’s mind to join that fight.

1. Then Cyborg just shoots it dead after it gets the Hollow sucked out of it.
2. From the sounds of things, pulling non-game things takes longer than the Mutari Generator more often than not, so the Indominus is still gonna get the Hollow (And the Jumanji powers for that matter) sucked out of it. (Side note: Does the Hollow absorb the actualy powerset, or just the power. Wiki is unhelpful)
3. Even if it doesn't willingly leave, the Generator is still gonna drain it regardless.
4. Adam could easily just hold onto the foot while applying the Katra, meaning that foot movements wouldn't interrupt the process. Meanwhile, Blue won't even be aware of Adam's presence, and by the time Blue does become aware, Ares will be there, who can one shot Blue.
5. As already stated, Your Blue has zero awareness of Adam's presence, so he won't be eating anything
6. They might do that if they had any chance to react to it, but their won't. It's just gonna appear right in front of them long enough for it's presence to register and the effect to begin, then disappear
7. She doesn't exactly need more feats than that one. That's her taking part in a psychic battle.

[TheBookDragon]

1. Then Cyborg just shoots it dead after it gets the Hollow sucked out of it.
2. From the sounds of things, pulling non-game things takes longer than the Mutari Generator more often than not, so the Indominus is still gonna get the Hollow (And the Jumanji powers for that matter) sucked out of it. (Side note: Does the Hollow absorb the actualy powerset, or just the power. Wiki is unhelpful)

I’m not sure that the Hollow can be drained from the Indominus Rex by the Mutari Generator. First the hollow only left a host when they died. When the lesser demons were killed by the charmed ones, and the hollow returned to it’s box with there powers. When the Source was killed they had to recite a spell on the box to release the powers that the hollow had taken and reseal it away. In short it’s bound till death or the witches recite a spell while having the box right there draining away the hollow.

What and how much powers the Mutari Generator will take seem debatable. Illyria was leaking her powers, on the verge of exploding them. The Mutari Generator drained a lot of her active powers, but still left her with many enhanced stats. So it didn’t drain her of all her powers.

In this case how much would it be able to drain? The hollow isn’t a force radiating out of the hosts, it was only noticeable when magic was used on it, or was being used to active draw magic out of a target. (Billie and Christy actively drained Wyatt’s force field)
Would it be able to take the hollow? Or is a concealed power inside someone going to be harder to drain.

As for the speed aspect, the Mutari Generator would be able to hit the Indominus Rex before being absorbed. If it doesn’t take the Hollow, or if it takes longer to drain the magical powers from the sorting hat, Jumanji, and the Hollow, then it took to drain half of Illyria then Cyborg would be a target for the Jumanji to pull him in. Draining Illyria took ten seconds, Jumanji disintegrating the bullet only took six seconds.

(Side note: Does the Hollow absorb the actualy powerset, or just the power. Wiki is unhelpful)

It seemed to be based on power groups. Page lost all her whitelighter powers, Piper lost her freeze time and exploding power, but both could still use there witch powers to make spells and do incantations. Though Wyatt had his force field absorbed but was still able to teleport, so I don’t think that his force field was a whitelighter power. Implying unrelated powers shouldn’t be drained without a use from that group of powers.
At least that is how I understood it.

4. Adam could easily just hold onto the foot while applying the Katra, meaning that foot movements wouldn't interrupt the process. Meanwhile, Blue won't even be aware of Adam's presence, and by the time Blue does become aware, Ares will be there, who can one shot Blue.

Adam was basically a man with regeneration and sword skills right? Holding on to Godzilla’s leg if he moves it isn’t going to be easy, harder when you remember that he will need to be careful not to break the Katra, or break contact with Godzilla. So that is limiting his movement to clamp onto Godzilla’s leg to one hand and his legs.

True Blue doesn’t have any supernatural ways of tracking him compared to the others. Blue can track, She was used to track in the Jurassic World movie to find the Indominus Rex. Tracking to find the human isn’t a hard game for her, now she is going vampire fast, reaction times that are much faster than normal and a taste for blood.

6. They might do that if they had any chance to react to it, but their won't. It's just gonna appear right in front of them long enough for it's presence to register and the effect to begin, then disappear.

How long does it take to take effect? I mean a second, a minute, did they simply hold the head up in the air until they were sure it had worked? I haven’t seen Clash of the Titans, so I don’t know how they did it. But it blinking in and out of focus before the enemy can react, seems like it would have to be carefully calculated to get the right amount of time without giving anyone else a chance to know where the Flash would be.

Also is there some way that the Flash is avoiding looking at the head as he is transporting it around? Dashing to grab it, and move it to a new location without looking or even glancing at it seems trick to say the least.

7. She doesn't exactly need more feats than that one. That's her taking part in a psychic battle

Right that was my fault for poorly wording that question.

In Professor X and Apocalypse’s mental fight, Professor X said that he was opening the door to Apocalypse’s mind, because of there link. Professor X also linked to Jean’s mind to let her join in the fight. (At least that is how it seemed to me)

Did we ever see her attack someone else’s mind? By which I mean enter, or subdue someone’s mind without Professor X creating a link for the minds to connect. My point is she is powerful but does she have feats of actually linking her mind with another person’s mind.

[Jcogginsa]

I’m not sure that the Hollow can be drained from the Indominus Rex by the Mutari Generator. First the hollow only left a host when they died. When the lesser demons were killed by the charmed ones, and the hollow returned to it’s box with there powers. When the Source was killed they had to recite a spell on the box to release the powers that the hollow had taken and reseal it away. In short it’s bound till death or the witches recite a spell while having the box right there draining away the hollow.

What and how much powers the Mutari Generator will take seem debatable. Illyria was leaking her powers, on the verge of exploding them. The Mutari Generator drained a lot of her active powers, but still left her with many enhanced stats. So it didn’t drain her of all her powers.

In this case how much would it be able to drain? The hollow isn’t a force radiating out of the hosts, it was only noticeable when magic was used on it, or was being used to active draw magic out of a target. (Billie and Christy actively drained Wyatt’s force field)
Would it be able to take the hollow? Or is a concealed power inside someone going to be harder to drain.

As for the speed aspect, the Mutari Generator would be able to hit the Indominus Rex before being absorbed. If it doesn’t take the Hollow, or if it takes longer to drain the magical powers from the sorting hat, Jumanji, and the Hollow, then it took to drain half of Illyria then Cyborg would be a target for the Jumanji to pull him in. Draining Illyria took ten seconds, Jumanji disintegrating the bullet only took six seconds.



It seemed to be based on power groups. Page lost all her whitelighter powers, Piper lost her freeze time and exploding power, but both could still use there witch powers to make spells and do incantations. Though Wyatt had his force field absorbed but was still able to teleport, so I don’t think that his force field was a whitelighter power. Implying unrelated powers shouldn’t be drained without a use from that group of powers.
At least that is how I understood it.


Adam was basically a man with regeneration and sword skills right? Holding on to Godzilla’s leg if he moves it isn’t going to be easy, harder when you remember that he will need to be careful not to break the Katra, or break contact with Godzilla. So that is limiting his movement to clamp onto Godzilla’s leg to one hand and his legs.

True Blue doesn’t have any supernatural ways of tracking him compared to the others. Blue can track, She was used to track in the Jurassic World movie to find the Indominus Rex. Tracking to find the human isn’t a hard game for her, now she is going vampire fast, reaction times that are much faster than normal and a taste for blood.



How long does it take to take effect? I mean a second, a minute, did they simply hold the head up in the air until they were sure it had worked? I haven’t seen Clash of the Titans, so I don’t know how they did it. But it blinking in and out of focus before the enemy can react, seems like it would have to be carefully calculated to get the right amount of time without giving anyone else a chance to know where the Flash would be.

Also is there some way that the Flash is avoiding looking at the head as he is transporting it around? Dashing to grab it, and move it to a new location without looking or even glancing at it seems trick to say the least.



Right that was my fault for poorly wording that question.

In Professor X and Apocalypse’s mental fight, Professor X said that he was opening the door to Apocalypse’s mind, because of there link. Professor X also linked to Jean’s mind to let her join in the fight. (At least that is how it seemed to me)

Did we ever see her attack someone else’s mind? By which I mean enter, or subdue someone’s mind without Professor X creating a link for the minds to connect. My point is she is powerful but does she have feats of actually linking her mind with another person’s mind.

1. Unless it resisted other forms of power draining, I don't see anything that would let it resist the Generator.

2. What I was trying to ask was: Does te Hollow use the powers that it drains? You mentioned it took away a Forefield, does it then use that Forcefield?

3. Since the process only takes 8 seconds, and Godzilla is unlikely to notice his presence, it should be easy to hold onto Godzilla long enough to do the Transfer

4. Blue's Tracking abilities still require her to know she needs to be looking for something.

5. Just takes a look in the eyes for the Medusa head to work. All Flash has to do is not look at the eyes to avoid it himself

6. Psychics in the X-Men films are generally shown to all have the same abilities, just at different levels of power and skill. No reason Jean wouldn't be able to engage in psychic combat

[TheBookDragon]

1. Unless it resisted other forms of power draining, I don't see anything that would let it resist the Generator.

I’m going for it works on different principles and there for won’t be power drained.

2. What I was trying to ask was: Does te Hollow use the powers that it drains? You mentioned it took away a Forefield, does it then use that Forcefield?

Oh, sorry I didn’t realize that is what you meant. Yes it can use any powers it drains.

3. Since the process only takes 8 seconds, and Godzilla is unlikely to notice his presence, it should be easy to hold onto Godzilla long enough to do the Transfer

8 seconds of combat, with another Godzilla. Moving around to fight is a normal part of a Godzilla fights.

4. Blue's Tracking abilities still require her to know she needs to be looking for something.

Smell for human males. That should be Cyborg, Hal Jordan, and Barry Allen. Cyborg probably smell like machines, and Hal Jordan had the green bubble around him containing his smell that leaves Barry.
Yes, I know it’s a stretch to say that the raptor should be able to smell and process every smell within five miles but it did track the Indominus Rex, across the island at a run so you know that it’s ability to track are really good.

5. Just takes a look in the eyes for the Medusa head to work. All Flash has to do is not look at the eyes to avoid it himself

You need to make contact with the eyes specifically then my team is fine. They were all big monsters, before there mental enhancements they will still be more likely to eat a head that appears without giving it any serious attention.

6. Psychics in the X-Men films are generally shown to all have the same abilities, just at different levels of power and skill. No reason Jean wouldn't be able to engage in psychic combat

The argument that Professor X (Or any other psychics) can do something there for Jean should be able to, is faulty. If she never shows the ability to target someone else’s mind and start a mental battle, then I don’t think she gets to claim she can mind kill my whole team.


Questions anyone? Anyone need to see a feat to prove a point?

[Darth Drizzle]

Interesting fight here between polar opposite team's.

I think the overestimation of the Buffy items(Generator/Katra/Band) and the underestimating of the enemies items(Jumanji, Hollow, Ghost Rider) plays a big role again in this match up.

The Ghost Rider Transformation Trump's Cyborgs Technopathy imo as the Riders ability to magically transform any vehicle/Mount into his personal ride is above pure Science Technopathy.

The Hollow also wouldn't be drawn to the Mutari Generator, and Adam trying to dance around the feet of a Kaiju while a Spider Man enhanced Raptor chases after him doesn't look to good for him and his survival.

Jean has used her Telepathy to cloak her team from sight as the people walk right by them without noticing, but besides that she never really uses her Telepathy to battle like Xavier does and while powerful she doesn't have any real skills at doing so.

Barry is asked to do alot between carrying Ares, stabbing people, and turning them into Stone. This Flash wasn't very coordinated at times(knocking himself out on Superman's ship) and was very much against stabbing people to death(he could have used WW sword if he wanted to in the fight) so him carrying a knife in one hand, a giant Head in another, and carrying a large fully Armored person and running at full speed darting around target to Target seems a bit much even with general leeway.

A good fight here, still looking over details.

[Jcogginsa]

I’m going for it works on different principles and there for won’t be power drained.


Oh, sorry I didn’t realize that is what you meant. Yes it can use any powers it drains.


8 seconds of combat, with another Godzilla. Moving around to fight is a normal part of a Godzilla fights.


Smell for human males. That should be Cyborg, Hal Jordan, and Barry Allen. Cyborg probably smell like machines, and Hal Jordan had the green bubble around him containing his smell that leaves Barry.
Yes, I know it’s a stretch to say that the raptor should be able to smell and process every smell within five miles but it did track the Indominus Rex, across the island at a run so you know that it’s ability to track are really good.



You need to make contact with the eyes specifically then my team is fine. They were all big monsters, before there mental enhancements they will still be more likely to eat a head that appears without giving it any serious attention.



The argument that Professor X (Or any other psychics) can do something there for Jean should be able to, is faulty. If she never shows the ability to target someone else’s mind and start a mental battle, then I don’t think she gets to claim she can mind kill my whole team.


Questions anyone? Anyone need to see a feat to prove a point?

1. Magic is magic. No reason to assume a magic drain is gonna be less effective on it
2. Godzilla combat isn't exactly fast. Adam's got plenty of time to complete the change
3. The thing is Blue doesn't know the difference between Adam's scent and any other characters. Since your plan doesn't mention Blue acting in defense of Godzilla, then Blue's most likely going to prioritize looking for her target over investigating whatever is at Godzilla's foot. And that focus will, ironically, lead to her missing the target entirely.
4. Big Monster's still have eyes. And anything without Superspeed will be in the middle of petrification by the time they could move to eat the head
5. To say that Jean can win a psychic fight but not start a psychic fight is faulty logic

Interesting fight here between polar opposite team's.

I think the overestimation of the Buffy items(Generator/Katra/Band) and the underestimating of the enemies items(Jumanji, Hollow, Ghost Rider) plays a big role again in this match up.

The Ghost Rider Transformation Trump's Cyborgs Technopathy imo as the Riders ability to magically transform any vehicle/Mount into his personal ride is above pure Science Technopathy.

The Hollow also wouldn't be drawn to the Mutari Generator, and Adam trying to dance around the feet of a Kaiju while a Spider Man enhanced Raptor chases after him doesn't look to good for him and his survival.

Jean has used her Telepathy to cloak her team from sight as the people walk right by them without noticing, but besides that she never really uses her Telepathy to battle like Xavier does and while powerful she doesn't have any real skills at doing so.

Barry is asked to do alot between carrying Ares, stabbing people, and turning them into Stone. This Flash wasn't very coordinated at times(knocking himself out on Superman's ship) and was very much against stabbing people to death(he could have used WW sword if he wanted to in the fight) so him carrying a knife in one hand, a giant Head in another, and carrying a large fully Armored person and running at full speed darting around target to Target seems a bit much even with general leeway.

A good fight here, still looking over details.

1. Cyborg's technopathy isn't purely scientific. He's not just limited to conventional controls, he can also directly control the form of the tech, as shown when he willed a crushed audio recorder back into working form
2. Godzilla's foot is so big that he wouldn't be dancing around anything. All he needs to do is hug it like a rock climbing wall, and it'll be trivial for him to stay attacked long enough for the Katra switch to work. And as previously stated, Blue won't know he's even there until it's too late.
3. Jean literally beat Apocalypse in a psychic fight
4. Barry is more coordinated in the Snyder Cut, which is useable for this league.