Page 1 of 7 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 99
  1. #1
    Mighty Member mystical41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    1,228

    Default How can sexism in WW be faced?

    Since 2011. Her character, lore and cast have been filled with changes where men has spent more time in the center of the stage. WW became weaker and very dependent of a sword and shield. Her origin changed to be one of Zeus's illegitimate kids. The amazons were turned into rapists(that one was changed later on, thank god). Her female cast barely spends time with her. Her villains mostly the women are portrayed as weak and or jobber. Cheetah i'm looking at you. Her stories are most of the time one dimensional and lack imagination. Always the story of fight Ares to stop a war. Or the Who is WW? type of approach. She is also facing all of this and worse outside her title. In other comics and movies, she is never a top gun. Always getting overpowered by most characters with powers, specially male ones. Has a very barbarian personality, or is stiff and think like a soldier with bad temper all the time etc. Sexism has made WW and her world weak, lacking in personality, diversity and flavor. Problems did not start in 2011. But they have been amplified since then.

    Do you see any possible solution?

  2. #2
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    8,260

    Default

    It varies because many times it's even the writers or editors. And if we want to be honest she needs to have her own editors along with the other Wondie family

  3. #3
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    6,807

    Default

    By releasing an issue where she bench presses increasingly heavy things until the Presence announces she's the strongest thing in existence.

    In all seriousness, by embracing the character at her core instead of trying desperately to make her appeal to misogynist middle aged men who can only find her appealing if they strip away every feminine or maternal element to her character sans her physique and instead turn her into a pastiche of Conan, Xena and Red Sonja.

    The Zues origin has to go. A lot of things need to be removed, the sword and shield especially, but it'll take growing pains because you'll have dudebros drag their feet and whine that they made her weak or lesser because she's not gloating about how unlike Batman or Superman, she ends her villains when they act up.

    So yeah, it's never going to happen. It'll always be there in some effect and that's because it's controlled by people raised in a patriarchal society who have toxic views on women. The world has to change first before it can consistently breathe into life stories where a woman is allowed to simply be excellent in all the ways she truly is. Does that suck? Yes. That's why the world desperately needs Wonder Woman.

    I'm too cynical to think otherwise but I would dearly love to be wrong.

  4. #4
    Beyond Good. Beyond Evil. Gaius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Occupied Klendathu
    Posts
    7,873

    Default

    Daddy Zeus can hit the bricks.

  5. #5
    Mighty Member Psy-lock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Moscow
    Posts
    1,210

    Default

    Make Phil Jimenez her editor.

  6. #6
    Extraordinary Member John Venus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    5,074

    Default

    Better writers, editors and executive who care about the character and understands her.

    Fans speaking up, letting their voice heard, letting DC know what they think as well as raising awareness of readers who are clueless about DC is doing. Heck, one of the reasons why I got into Perez run is because there was a hard core WW fan who was mad at the Heinberg reboot and posting about Perez's run online.

  7. #7
    Mighty Member mystical41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    1,228

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    Better writers, editors and executive who care about the character and understands her.

    Fans speaking up, letting their voice heard, letting DC know what they think as well as raising awareness of readers who are clueless about DC is doing. Heck, one of the reasons why I got into Perez run is because there was a hard core WW fan who was mad at the Heinberg reboot and posting about Perez's run online.
    What are the chances for this to happen?

  8. #8
    Beyond Good. Beyond Evil. Gaius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Occupied Klendathu
    Posts
    7,873

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Psy-lock View Post
    Make Phil Jimenez her editor.
    If he'd be interested, sure.

  9. #9
    Original CBR member Jabare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,678

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Daddy Zeus can hit the bricks.
    that will be tough to do while the Gal Gadot Wonder Woman is still around
    The J-man

  10. #10
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    3,298

    Default

    The weird thing is that Diana being the daughter of Zeus has never been made a big deal in the DCEU, but they mention it once per movie. It could easily be removed fron the movie without changing anything, and we could easily forget it's even the case.

  11. #11
    Original CBR member Jabare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    7,678

    Default

    I'd say it was a fairly significant story point of the first Wonder Woman movie and her fight with Ares.

    I don't think it's integral to her character seeing as it wasn't part of her character before 2011 (ignoring what Timm tried to do with Hades in the JL cartoon). So as you say it could be easily ignored or forgotten in future stories, but they stuck it right into her origin. Wonder Woman's first big theatrical film was financially successful and critically acclaimed. Could DC make a point to change the Zeus element, if they wanted to? sure, but I don't see them doing it. So for those who are sticklers of cannon or newly introduced to Wonder Woman that will be something they learn about her.

    If Wonder Woman is recast and they do another Wonder Woman film or a live-action tv show etc. Then I think DC could remove it. For the time being, I don't think it impedes or detracts from her (at least in live-action).
    The J-man

  12. #12
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    3,298

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jabare View Post
    I'd say it was a fairly significant story point of the first Wonder Woman movie and her fight with Ares.
    Not really. All it amounts to is one single line by Ares "Zeus left the child he had with Hippolyta to create the ultimate weapon against Ares". Everything else still works even if she isn't the daughter of Zeus. She could still be a clay figure brought to life with the blessing of the gods in order to destroy Ares and the movie would be the exact same. We never saw either origin, only heard one line about each of them.
    Last edited by Alpha; 06-10-2021 at 07:38 AM.

  13. #13
    Mighty Member mystical41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    1,228

    Default

    Sexism has affected a lot of characters. Including the feminist icon WW. I don't know what can be made. It feels like nothing will ever change.

  14. #14
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    6,807

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Daddy Zeus can hit the bricks.
    Several times, hopefully.

    Phil becoming her editor may be a step in the right direction, but given the glowing reviews of the current run, perhaps let's leave the current creative team in charge and see what they've got.

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member John Venus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    5,074

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jabare View Post
    that will be tough to do while the Gal Gadot Wonder Woman is still around
    Quote Originally Posted by Jabare View Post
    I'd say it was a fairly significant story point of the first Wonder Woman movie and her fight with Ares.

    I don't think it's integral to her character seeing as it wasn't part of her character before 2011 (ignoring what Timm tried to do with Hades in the JL cartoon). So as you say it could be easily ignored or forgotten in future stories, but they stuck it right into her origin. Wonder Woman's first big theatrical film was financially successful and critically acclaimed. Could DC make a point to change the Zeus element, if they wanted to? sure, but I don't see them doing it. So for those who are sticklers of cannon or newly introduced to Wonder Woman that will be something they learn about her.

    If Wonder Woman is recast and they do another Wonder Woman film or a live-action tv show etc. Then I think DC could remove it. For the time being, I don't think it impedes or detracts from her (at least in live-action).
    It's not like Joker being the killer of the Waynes from the Burton movies really stuck either. The identity of the killer has always shifted from one movie to another and not even the comics have made up their minds about it. The thing about WW and WW84 is that they aren't good movies but people were so desperate for a female led superhero movie and many had waited so long for a WW movie that they were willing to accept anything WB was going to hand over to them. Its the movie people needed but not the one they deserved. Once a better adaptation comes along, people will jump ship to that one. Plus Gal seem to getting mired in one controversy after the other, I wouldn't be surprised if she tweets something truly clueless and/or ignorant and ruins the third movie for everyone.

    Also I noticed that even a lot of casuals were confused by the movies decisions like making Zeus benevolent and responsible for the Amazons creation and the movie overt focus on Diana/Steve at the exemption of the Amazons. Some even claimed that they thought it was weird how Ares was the one to murder all the gods. I think general audiences will embrace an adaptation that's closer to Marston/Perez/Rucka vision for the character; Athena/Aphrodite/Artemis being the founders of Themyscira and how WW's take on Greek mythos is supposed to be flip the script on the Olympians.

    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    What are the chances for this to happen?
    Low but not impossible.
    Last edited by John Venus; 06-10-2021 at 02:59 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •