Is there really a difference between Titans and JL?

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

When a Nightwing, Wonder Girl, or Superboy book routinely outsells Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman, there's maybe a chance. Until then...

I mean, I don't see the X-Men telling the Avengers to pack it in or the Avengers telling the Fantastic Four they need to stop. Heck, we don't even see the JLA doing that to the Doom Patrol. So, why should the Titans be subjected to that?

[Sutekh]

I mean, I don't see the X-Men telling the Avengers to pack it in or the Avengers telling the Fantastic Four they need to stop. Heck, we don't even see the JLA doing that to the Doom Patrol. So, why should the Titans be subjected to that?

I wouldn't be surprised if Batman, for instance, continued to treat Dick as a 'kid sidekick' well into his thirties. Plenty of parental figures don't really grow out of the habit of treating their fully-adult children as if they are the same as they remember them as kids (having not been as involved in / aware of whatever growth and development their kid has been through since).

But Donna and Wally never had that sort of relationship with Diana or Barry, and it definitely doesn't feel as appropriate for *anyone* on the League to feel that they have any business telling Starfire, Raven or Cyborg, adults whom they've known for years, and who have never lived in their homes or been their legal wards, what to do.

Flying in and ordering another group to disband, with absolute self-appointed authority, seems kinda despotic, and the fact that they don't regularly do this to other competing teams they might not approve of like the Doom Patrol, Suicide Squad, Power Company, etc. makes it seem particularly strange.

[Digifiend]

Don't forget, Batman usually funds the Titans, due to Nightwing being their leader. That's what gives him the power to disband the team, as he did in Rebirth.

Of course, he often funds the Justice League as well, though currently that's Green Arrow's responsibility.

[king81992]

One team has some of the most marketable characters in pop culture on their roster and the other team is the Titans.

In all seriousness, the Titans do feel more like a family as the League kind of seems like co-workers. Unfortunately, the Titans often lack a purpose. I like the idea of them training the next generation of heroes like in the Young Justice tv show. I haven't liked the Titans Academy book but I like the concept.

Titans Academy's problem is that the new characters aren't interesting and the book exists to shill Red X instead of focusing on the Titans.

[king81992]

I wouldn't be surprised if Batman, for instance, continued to treat Dick as a 'kid sidekick' well into his thirties. Plenty of parental figures don't really grow out of the habit of treating their fully-adult children as if they are the same as they remember them as kids (having not been as involved in / aware of whatever growth and development their kid has been through since).

But Donna and Wally never had that sort of relationship with Diana or Barry, and it definitely doesn't feel as appropriate for *anyone* on the League to feel that they have any business telling Starfire, Raven or Cyborg, adults whom they've known for years, and who have never lived in their homes or been their legal wards, what to do.

Flying in and ordering another group to disband, with absolute self-appointed authority, seems kinda despotic, and the fact that they don't regularly do this to other competing teams they might not approve of like the Doom Patrol, Suicide Squad, Power Company, etc. makes it seem particularly strange.

Batman treats everyone like a sidekick or worse, not just Nightwing.

[king81992]

I mean, I don't see the X-Men telling the Avengers to pack it in or the Avengers telling the Fantastic Four they need to stop. Heck, we don't even see the JLA doing that to the Doom Patrol. So, why should the Titans be subjected to that?

Because the writers treat the Titans as second rate, use them as cannon fodder and rehash old storylines.The franchise has been a bad joke for years due to questionable writing decisions and the current direction , while a step up is sort of bland.

[Sutekh]

Don't forget, Batman usually funds the Titans, due to Nightwing being their leader. That's what gives him the power to disband the team, as he did in Rebirth.

I don't know if that's a current thing, but back in the day, Cyborg's dad paid for their HQ, so that's something new (which makes sense, since Cyborg may or may not have ever been a Titan this week. I can't even keep track.).

[LAWtoyoto 432]

Because the writers treat the Titans as second rate, use them as cannon fodder and rehash old storylines.The franchise has been a bad joke for years due to questionable writing decisions and the current direction , while a step up is sort of bland.

As a X-Men fans, we suffer like this before when Marvel try to replace the brands with Inhumans. But that everything changes when Jonathan Hickman, our saviour writer to create "HOX/POX" which brings a bright future for the X-books.

[abetterday]

It's sad that we will probably never know how Cyborg became a member of the Justice League in this new era because during every reboot (or unreboot in this case) DC always neglect the B and C list characters for the most part. But I would think that a definitive Cyborg origin featuring the Justice League and the Titans would be a big seller.

[DrNewGod]

I mean, I don't see the X-Men telling the Avengers to pack it in or the Avengers telling the Fantastic Four they need to stop. Heck, we don't even see the JLA doing that to the Doom Patrol. So, why should the Titans be subjected to that?

That's because the X-Men, Avengers, and FF didn't grow out of one another. Nor do the Doom Patrol have any such connections to the JL. The Titans do have such a connection to the JL, just as Infinity Inc is a JSA outgrowth.

[Restingvoice]

JL are the world's greatest heroes working together to handle world's greatest threats, Titans are old and/or new friends hanging out together and occasionally handle world's greatest threat when the League is incapacitated.

[Robotman]

Titans Academy's problem is that the new characters aren't interesting and the book exists to shill Red X instead of focusing on the Titans.

Totally agree!

[Jim Kelly]

Batman treats everyone like a sidekick or worse, not just Nightwing.

These blanket statements always bug me. If someone said, "In the current version of Batman, he treats everyone like a sidekick or worse, not just Nightwing," I would have no qualms. But when these statement aren't qualified to apply to a specific treatment of the character, then it's saying that this treatment is now the de facto version of Batman--and all the other versions don't count, are forgotten.

If we keep repeating this, it's like giving in. We don't have to accept the current Batman as the only one we've got. We can stand our ground and insist on a different vision of the character.

Given the Teen Titans were introduced in 1964, there were a few decades where the Batman that interacted with them was a completely different character.

[K7P5V]

It's sad that we will probably never know how Cyborg became a member of the Justice League in this new era because during every reboot (or unreboot in this case) DC always neglect the B and C list characters for the most part. But I would think that a definitive Cyborg origin featuring the Justice League and the Titans would be a big seller.

In agreement with you about both the Titans & Justice League working together being a big seller.
Back in '98/'99, Devin Grayson proved rather successfully that it can work...

[Digifiend]

I don't know if that's a current thing, but back in the day, Cyborg's dad paid for their HQ, so that's something new (which makes sense, since Cyborg may or may not have ever been a Titan this week. I can't even keep track.).

At the time, Cyborg had indeed never been a Titan. That was restored soon afterwards - in one issue of Priest's brief Justice League run, the league was founded five years ago, and Cyborg was a founder. In the following issue, it was suddenly 15 years ago - the No Justice event that followed confirmed that Martian Manhunter was now a JL founder instead - the team's silver age origins had been restored, and the Teen Titans history with it. Which was confirmed in Justice League Odyssey, when Cyborg and Starfire referred to each other as old friends - in New 52 they were strangers, as Kori was hanging around with Red Hood while Vic was with the League.

Luckily, you can easily handwave his origin in the first arc of New 52 Justice League as Cyborg merely being upgraded (he didn't previously have Mother Box tech I believe?) instead. He just joined the JL after previously being a Titan, then rejoined the Titans after the events of JL Odyssey and Death Metal.

The Titans team that reformed after No Justice was still Batman funded, and it even used the Hall of Justice as a HQ. I assume Nightwing now funds the Academy himself, as he actually has more money than Bruce nowadays.