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  1. #631

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jbenito View Post
    Right? Let's see what happens in SWORD and bask in the glory of a living, breathing Mars in the meantime.
    Periodddd

    Im ready for Storm’s speech !

  2. #632
    Ultimate Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    There's also probably intergalactic law about owning
    Dead planets

  3. #633

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    There's also probably intergalactic law about owning
    Dead planets
    In guardians they wandered onto a planet and was talking about how absolutely rare and unheard of it is to find an uninhabitable planet that can sustain life and the one they were on turned out to be spoilers:
    ego the living planet
    end of spoilers so it's definitely a big deal just bringing one back to life. I wonder how much those services could be sold for.
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.
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  4. #634
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Re: Why is Arakko now the head planet of the Sol system?

    I'd say it's likely because EVERYONE witnessed its rebirth by Mutant hands and will, putting its name on everyone's tongue and mind...and not just its name, but the name of those who DID the deed..."Mutants".

    Add to that the fact that Planet Arakko has no humans on it, a point of contention among MANY of the space-faring races with having to deal with Earth, previously. It doesn't have the baggage of all those 'Look at those backwards apes killing each other over things like skin color or imaginary lines on a map..God, I hate them...' prejudices that cosmic races tend to carry for Earth.

    THEN add in that, given how it was born and who is operating things, it is likely the strongest planet - in terms of defensive and offensive capabilities, as well as technology - in the system.

    Finally, considering that mutants did the work, mutants created a diplomatic hub, mutants have made connections to races humanity has driven away from the table - directly or indirectly - with their xenophobia, and...why shouldnt mutants claim the results of their own work? Why SHOULDN'T they declare themselves the face of Sol to the greater galactic cultures? What has humanity done for the universe OTHER than birth what many civilizations consider a plague of superhuman? Why shouldn't a race that can rightly call itself humanity's children, the next step in evolution, do mighty works and ask the greater civilizations to recognize them on their own terms? The Avengers (a collection of mutates, gods, magical beings, and a small number of baseline humans with fancy gear) don't represent humanity. To the galaxy at large, humanity is, at BEST, Nova or Captain America or Iron Man. But those faces are associated with mutates and superhumans, not 'baseline' humanity. For that, we get...people like Gyrinch. With him as the face of baseline humanity in space, is it any wonder the other galactic civilizations would probably rather deal with a unified nation of mutants who appear willing to serve the interests of the Sol System itself over a handful of mutates who serve the fractious interests of human masters...?

    I have to say, I love when parents hate seeing their children thrive and surpass them, and plot to murder their children horribly for the offense of doing better than their parents did. So 616 humanity's rage-boner to murder their own children at every turn should be fun to watch play out, as will all the people defending them as their fear and ignorance lead then to try to murder humanity's future... ('love' and 'fun' are used ironically, here, in case that isnt' clear by the tone of the rest of the words...)

    More fun than that dragged out CRADLE crap that hasn't really gone anywhere, anyhow...
    Last edited by zinderel; 06-18-2021 at 05:43 PM.

  5. #635

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    Quote Originally Posted by zinderel View Post
    Re: Why is Arakko now the head planet of the Sol system?

    I'd say it's likely because EVERYONE witnessed its rebirth by Mutant hands and will, putting its name on everyone's tongue and mind...and not just its name, but the name of those who DID the deed..."Mutants".

    Add to that the fact that Planet Arakko has no humans on it, a point of contention among MANY of the space-faring races with having to deal with Earth, previously. It doesn't have the baggage of all those 'Look at those backwards apes killing each other over things like skin color or imaginary lines on a map..God, I hate them...' prejudices that cosmic races tend to carry for Earth.

    THEN add in that, given how it was born and who is operating things, it is likely the strongest planet - in terms of defensive and offensive capabilities, as well as technology - in the system.

    Finally, considering that mutants did the work, mutants created a diplomatic hub, mutants have made conne tions to races humanity has driven away from the table with their xenophobia, and...why shouldnt mutants claim the results of their own work? Why SHOULDN'T they declare themselves the face of Sol to the greater galactic cultures? What has humanity done for the universe? Create the Avengers? A bunch of gods, mutates and humans in fancy gear? Woohoo. They don't represent humanity to the universe at large the way people like Gyrinch have and continue to do. With him as the face of baseline humanity in space, is it any wonder the other galactic civilizations would rather deal with mutants...?

    I have to say, I love when parents hate seeing their children thrive and surpass them, and plot to murder their children horribly for the offense of doing better than their parents did. So 616 humanity's rage-boner to murder their own children at every turn should be fun to watch play out, as will all the people defending them as their fear and ignorance lead then to try to murder humanity's future...

    More fun than that dragged out CRADLE crap that hasn't really gone anywhere, anyhow...
    You just summoned up the Kree and Skrulls history plus every other empire’s current history including the Shi’ar kidnapping incident.
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  6. #636
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Covetous_One View Post
    You just summoned up the Kree and Skrulls history plus every other empire’s current history including the Shi’ar kidnapping incident.
    Oh, I know. Lol. But EVERY time Earth comes up in the cosmic setting, it is ALWAYS referred to as a planet of violent, backwards apes...and also, Avengers/Fantastic Four/X-Men. Other than the mutates, supernatural beings, and mutants who call Earth home, most of galactic civilization has been shown to view Earth as barely better than a bunch of animals beating one another to death with clubs. The Kree and Skrull have millennia on Earth's civilization. That kind of timeline tends to breed a superiority complex and blinders to how similar ALL civilizations are, in how they come to be. That's how prejudices work...we blame other people for things we did or do ourselves, but pretend we don't...

    But, the way humanity's youth and inexperience with cosmic matters manifests in them usually bumbling in and forcing their way into helping fix things only AFTER they made it worse first, and their reputation as backwards, primitive and warlike to the greater galactic civilizations, it all makes them an easy target for prejudice.

    Meanwhile, yes, mutants are young, which normally would be a mark against them. But the galaxy just witnessed what a handful of them can do when working together: a feat that displays power, skill and focus beyond their years, as well as control and planning. And that will, or at least SHOULD, have earned a good amount of respect from galactic civilization because it was a show of strength with an act of creation, rather than destruction. Of rebirth, and looking to the future, not regressive obsession with the past.

    Humanity will be hard pressed to equal or top that feat. And other than maybe Reed and Tony, most of humanity as we know them will work to unmake mutantkind's feat, and kill their children, as they always do. Which will only serve to reinforce the prejudices the galactic civilizations have (and have expressed) against Earth, and humanity in general.
    Last edited by zinderel; 06-18-2021 at 05:34 PM.

  7. #637

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    Quote Originally Posted by zinderel View Post
    Oh, I know. Lol. But EVERY time Earth comes up in the cosmic setting, it is ALWAYS referred to as a planet of violent, backwards apes...and also, Avengers/Fantastic Four/X-Men. Other than the mutates, supernatural beings, and mutants who call Earth home, most of galactic civilization has been shown to view Earth as barely better than a bunch of animals beating one another to death with clubs. The Kree and Skrull have millennia on Earth's civilization. That kind of timeline tends to breed a superiority complex and blinders to how similar ALL civilizations are, in how they come to be. That's how prejudices work...we blame other people for things we did or do ourselves, but pretend we don't...

    But, the way humanity's youth and inexperience with cosmic matters manifests in them usually bumbling in and forcing their way into helping fix things only AFTER they made it worse first, and their reputation as backwards, primitive and warlike to the greater galactic civilizations, it all makes them an easy target for prejudice.

    Meanwhile, yes, mutants are young, which normally would be a mark against them. But the galaxy just witnessed what a handful of them can do when working together. They basically did a feat that displays both power, skill and focus beyond their years, and they should have earned respect by showing their strength with an act of creation, rather than destruction.

    Humanity will be hard pressed to equal or top that feat. And other than maybe Reed and Tony, most of humanity as we know them will work to unmake mutantkind's feat, and kill their children, as they always do. Which will only serve to reinforce the prejudices the galactic civilizations have (and have expressed) against Earth, and humanity in general.
    You forgot Strange and Doom in your analysis, plus when it comes to budding empires even if they have rare resources they will most likely now more than ever start targeting Sol even more. Humanity trying to destroy mutants is a tiresome trope which I hope could be mitigated by showing more humans who stand up to mutant prejudice but showing that really doesn’t sell well after all that’s what many posters on this thread love an “us vs them” story
    “There is no defense against the Scarlet Witch's HEX!

  8. #638
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Covetous_One View Post
    You forgot Strange and Doom in your analysis, plus when it comes to budding empires even if they have rare resources they will most likely now more than ever start targeting Sol even more. Humanity trying to destroy mutants is a tiresome trope which I hope could be mitigated by showing more humans who stand up to mutant prejudice but showing that really doesn’t sell well after all that’s what many posters on this thread love an “us vs them” story
    I want nothing more than to be wrong about how humanity will react. But I have ZERO faith in anything a new Illuminati will come up with, given the sheer scope and repetitiveness of their past failures, however, and we all know Doom will only be interested in conquest, in whatever way he enters this. It would be GREAT to see the Ta Nehisi Coates' Wakandan Space Empire stuff come into play, and show humanity RISING to the new challenges presented by their official entry into galactic civilization, rather than regressing into the comfortable security of hate, ignorance and fear, but...I just don't have much hope, given the existence and awfulness of ORCHIS, XENO, Coven Akkaba...
    Last edited by zinderel; 06-18-2021 at 05:45 PM.

  9. #639
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinderel View Post
    I want nothing more than to be wrong about how humanity will react. I have ZERO faith in anything a new Illuminati will come up with given the sheer scope of their past failures. And we all know Doom will only be interested in conquest, in whatever way he enters this. It would be GREAT to see the Ta Nehisi Coates' Wakandan Space Empire stuff come into play, and show humanity RISING to the challenge rather than regressing into the comfortable security of hate, ignorance and fear, but...I just don't have much hope, given the existence and awfulness of ORCHIS, XENO, Coven Akkaba...
    It could be interesting and hopeful for at least *some* Earth factions to be open to establishing embassies at the new place, including Atlantis, Attilan, Wakanda, etc. Maybe even a branch of Strange Academy, as Dr. Strange attempts to make inroads to whatever magical traditions exist in Arakko (such as the Summoners).

    It could be fascinating to see the greater MU get involved in this storytelling possibility, and not just wash their hands of it and ignore it.

  10. #640
    Braddock Isle JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinderel View Post
    Oh, I know. Lol. But EVERY time Earth comes up in the cosmic setting, it is ALWAYS referred to as a planet of violent, backwards apes...and also, Avengers/Fantastic Four/X-Men. Other than the mutates, supernatural beings, and mutants who call Earth home, most of galactic civilization has been shown to view Earth as barely better than a bunch of animals beating one another to death with clubs. The Kree and Skrull have millennia on Earth's civilization. That kind of timeline tends to breed a superiority complex and blinders to how similar ALL civilizations are, in how they come to be. That's how prejudices work...we blame other people for things we did or do ourselves, but pretend we don't...

    But, the way humanity's youth and inexperience with cosmic matters manifests in them usually bumbling in and forcing their way into helping fix things only AFTER they made it worse first, and their reputation as backwards, primitive and warlike to the greater galactic civilizations, it all makes them an easy target for prejudice.

    Meanwhile, yes, mutants are young, which normally would be a mark against them. But the galaxy just witnessed what a handful of them can do when working together: a feat that displays power, skill and focus beyond their years, as well as control and planning. And that will, or at least SHOULD, have earned a good amount of respect from galactic civilization because it was a show of strength with an act of creation, rather than destruction. Of rebirth, and looking to the future, not regressive obsession with the past.

    Humanity will be hard pressed to equal or top that feat. And other than maybe Reed and Tony, most of humanity as we know them will work to unmake mutantkind's feat, and kill their children, as they always do. Which will only serve to reinforce the prejudices the galactic civilizations have (and have expressed) against Earth, and humanity in general.
    Excellent points. I'm especially interested in seeing how the galactic empires view this display of power and development. Many will be impressed.
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  11. #641

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    Quote Originally Posted by zinderel View Post
    I want nothing more than to be wrong about how humanity will react. I have ZERO faith in anything a new Illuminati will come up with given the sheer scope of their past failures, however, and we all know Doom will only be interested in conquest, in whatever way he enters this. It would be GREAT to see the Ta Nehisi Coates' Wakandan Space Empire stuff come into play, and show humanity RISING to the new challenges presented by their official entry into galactic civilization, rather than regressing into the comfortable security of hate, ignorance and fear, but...I just don't have much hope, given the existence and awfulness of ORCHIS, XENO, Coven Akkaba...
    Those you just mentioned are elite few and fear mongers. I mean people like those in Lowtown who would stand up for mutants. Those who have family that are mutants that they adore. People with mutant friends who look up at Arakko in wonder hoping one day they could visit their solar systems capitol hand in hand Simple people who just want to live each day with kindness not those in power who are so frightened of being forgotten that they will commit horrors in the name of bigotry.
    Last edited by Covetous_One; 06-18-2021 at 05:54 PM.
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  12. #642
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jbenito View Post
    Excellent points. I'm especially interested in seeing how the galactic empires view this display of power and development. Many will be impressed.
    I'm sure many will be! And many will see this as a threat, of course, which is natural. The stuff I hope we get to see though, from both X-franchise titles and non-X titles, is the nuances of how people react. I have no hope that baseline humanity will respond with anything other than ignorance and stupidity, because that's all they show us, over and over and over again. But the luminaries, if they don't all come together to take down Mutantity and instead come together to build UP humanity, could lead to GREAT stories that only use Planet Arakko as a jumping off point!

    I guess we'll see, though.

  13. #643
    Astonishing Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    How exactly are they ruling earth though. I am really trying to see the "argument" here in good faith and if it does go that way i will be the first to admit it, like the sudden turn of orichis thinking mutants fear and hate them i called that out because only people on the message boards have been saying that imo, not the actual issues themselves but i ended up wanking it as one character perspective until it is repeated on a larger scale.

    Mars does not control earth and as established by the SWORD etc a regent can be anyone in that system with some sort of apparent royal claim. So there is nothing stopping Earth from putting Tchalla up for the job or anyone else with some lineage. there is no one stopping them from gathering the same info Brand did either. Maybe they should reprogram sentinels to terraform.
    A: Do the mutants....not fear and hate Orchis? Given the amount of dismembering they do to Orchis I'm pretty sure that's not an unreasonable conclusion.

    B: Regents rule things. So a regent of earth, rules the earth. Even if the technical title is still regent of Sol, that still means Earth is rules by the Regent.

  14. #644
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Covetous_One View Post
    Those you just mentioned are elite few and fear mongers. I mean people like those in Lowtown who would stand up for mutants. Those who have family that are mutants that they adore. Simple people who just want to live each day with kindness not those in power who are so frightened of being forgotten that they will commit horrors in the name of bigotry.
    The people generally shown siding with mutants are also oppressed, or neglected, or forgotten. People who - like mutants for a long time - had or have no voice in governments, no power to enact change. The people with power, the governments, the agents, the superpowers, have shown us repeatedly that they follow the lead of the elite mutant hater groups. Be they the Right, Operation: Zero Tolerance, ONE, the Friends of Humanity, the Purifiers, the Trasks, ORCHIS, XENO, Coven Akkaba, HAMMER, CRADLE, the MRA, the SHRA...the minority with power and influence have exerted control over a gullible, culpable, ignorant majority and done awful things. Every time. Lowtown support is great! Stevie Hunter being on their side is great! But its meaningless next to the humanity that DOESNT support them.

    Too bad the Madripoorian government doesn't care what Lowtown thinks and would love to wipe them all out alongside the mutants. Too bad Stevie Hunter and Eye-Boy's mom are cancelled out by Bobby Drake's family, and the crowd that wanted to kill Kurt as an infant. And too bad neither of those come close to equaling the power and influence of Russia, Brazil, the UK now, and other world governments and their blatantly anti-mutant policies, or America and its covert ones...
    Last edited by zinderel; 06-18-2021 at 06:01 PM.

  15. #645
    Mighty Member zinderel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    A: Do the mutants....not fear and hate Orchis? Given the amount of dismembering they do to Orchis I'm pretty sure that's not an unreasonable conclusion.

    B: Regents rule things. So a regent of earth, rules the earth. Even if the technical title is still regent of Sol, that still means Earth is rules by the Regent.
    I'd say that, given the amount of LITERAL dismembering that groups like ORCHIS and XENO do - and plan to keep doing - to mutants, a little metaphorical dismembering of technology and power structures based in the hate and fear these humans have inspired through their on-panel atrocities, are justified. As, frankly, is killing enemy combatants.

    ORCHIS' leader's whole triumphant gloat about mutants hating and fearing them rings hollow, considering that the majority of Mutantity has been shown to not be terribly interested in wiping humanity off the planet, whereas humanity has shown itself repeatedly, constantly, with widespread interest and support, in favor of murdering their own children and stunting their own evolution out of fear and ignorance and hate. ORCHIS justifies their atrocities by citing individual mutant threats like Magneto, or Apocalypse. Meanwhile, they turn entire world governments, power structures, and populaces to xenophobia and genocide as a solution. But...mutants hating and fearing them makes them equals...somehow? It's like equating ANTIFA with the KKK...
    Last edited by zinderel; 06-18-2021 at 06:11 PM.

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