Knowing it’s ending, how would you rate Spencer’s run?

[Frontier]

Spencer's ideas were generally good even if executed badly. He didn't fix Black Cat because she was never really good, McKay made her good. Hunted is a good idea but the clone stuff doesn't work because it's not geniune. Kindred should have been revealed at the end of the first year. The Sin Eater stuff was great until it wasn't. Art's a mess. Blah, blah, blah.

I wouldn't say McKay writes Felicia all that different from how Spencer wrote her. And I'd say McKay writes Felicia as most fans prefer her, especially compared to the Queenpin rut Spencer rehabilitated her from.

[Spiderfan001]

You do realize that he replaced Kraven with an identical clone right. Not to mention Peter and MJ haven't really been doing things together lately.

Honestly, nothing's really happened in Spencer's run.

He made sure Kraven got a worthy send-off.Slott ruined Kraven's death in Clone Conspiracy and Slott fixed it.
Also his son being Kravne after beating his Father to death was good imo.We haven't seen more him but will in Sinister War.

And MJ had an omgoing/mini and wasn't available.He still gave us video calls etc.It was out of his hands.

Tf are you talking about.He has addressed and put to rest so many things that have happened.Also we got Peter and MJ back together, Peter planning to propose, Kindred stuff and Doc Strange with Mephisto basically confirming OMD is up.We got new avengers reunion,etc.

[Spiderfan001]

I wouldn't say McKay writes Felicia all that different from how Spencer wrote her. And I'd say McKay writes Felicia as most fans prefer her, especially compared to the Queenpin rut Spencer rehabilitated her from.

Agreed.Spencer also fixed their friendship and has the identity reveal. Mckay had been doing solo Felicia in his second run.
Also while ASM is(always) one of the highest selling book current Black Cat is one of the lowest.Most people don't buy it and thus won't even see what was going on with her.

[Spiderfan001]

Yeah, Dan Slott's run generates far more hatred than Spencer's run currently. Most people (myself included) seem to think it was a fun little average run, as of now.

Deservingly I would say.Specially superior and Parker industries stuff.
It is definitely a fun run as of now but when they address OMD it will become one of the better ones.

[Spiderfan001]

Spencer's ideas were generally good even if executed badly. He didn't fix Black Cat because she was never really good, McKay made her good. Hunted is a good idea but the clone stuff doesn't work because it's not geniune. Kindred should have been revealed at the end of the first year. The Sin Eater stuff was great until it wasn't. Art's a mess. Blah, blah, blah.

Pacing is not equal to execution.individual plot lines were great but were placed badly.
Also aside from all stuff said in a above post.Spencer Black Cat >> Mckay Black Cat
He didn't do the clone stuff.He cleaned up someones mess rather than ignore continuity.
I agree, but Kindred's real identity is still a mystery with the Harry reveal.
The sin-eater stuff was really good from his first page to killing himself.
Art varies a lot but is generally good with some half-bad issues.

[PCN24454]

He made sure Kraven got a worthy send-off.Slott ruined Kraven's death in Clone Conspiracy and Slott fixed it.
Also his son being Kravne after beating his Father to death was good imo.We haven't seen more him but will in Sinister War.

That's like saying that we were better off with Ben Reilly being the real Peter Parker.

Not to mention that he pretty much tanked any and all of Harry's character growth by making him Kindred.

[NC_Yankee]

Agreed.Spencer also fixed their friendship and has the identity reveal. Mckay had been doing solo Felicia in his second run.
Also while ASM is(always) one of the highest selling book current Black Cat is one of the lowest.Most people don't buy it and thus won't even see what was going on with her.

In fairness to Felicia, female superhero comics simply do not sell as well as male, so comparing her sales to Peter is silly. Is it sexist? Maybe maybe not. Here is an interesting fact, if you look at ratings the LPGA does not do as well as the PGA and WNBA does not get the ratings of the NBA ( in fact Nike ran a commercial about that very subject this weekend). Can it change? Maybe. Disney might be the greatest marketer in history, so if anyone can get Felicia and other female lead comics to be more then a niche they can. But I am willing to bet the only Spider character that can come to close and maybe outsell Peter is Miles.

[Spiderfan001]

That's like saying that we were better off with Ben Reilly being the real Peter Parker.

Not to mention that he pretty much tanked any and all of Harry's character growth by making him Kindred.

Nope.Not even close.
It's compeltely different since Kraven was supposed to be permanently dead after Last hunt.
If peter was killed and it was supposed to be permanent then it would make sense.
Also the death of Kraven makes sense but killing Pete doesn't.

Also Harry or our Harry is not Kindred.Are you even reading the run?

[Spiderfan001]

In fairness to Felicia, female superhero comics simply do not sell as well as male, so comparing her sales to Peter is silly. Is it sexist? Maybe maybe not. Here is an interesting fact, if you look at ratings the LPGA does not do as well as the PGA and WNBA does not get the ratings of the NBA ( in fact Nike ran a commercial about that very subject this weekend). Can it change? Maybe. Disney might be the greatest marketer in history, so if anyone can get Felicia and other female lead comics to be more then a niche they can. But I am willing to bet the only Spider character that can come to close and maybe outsell Peter is Miles.

There are plenty of female characters doing much better than Black Cat or Spider-womam. Both are below 100 mark.
Also NBA is much more entertaining than WNBA so of course it has more ratings.There are plently of videos on the net about this topic.
The gender card doesn't work in both these scenarios.The gap is way too big in the sales to blame it on just Gender.
There are plently of female lead comics that sell well and plently of woman's sports that do good.

Also Spider-man is no.1 ongoing at marvel or close.It even beat X-men 20 which was a very crucial issue and ASM was just doing one King's ransom issue with nothing special.Both issues were top 10 IIRC.
Miles is usually around 50 mark with normal issues and when with clone saga and milestone and Peter being included on top of the fact that Miles is at his peak rn with his solo game and ITSV being a hit was 25.They aren't even close.
Spider-man is not being out-selled by any one else in his Verse.He is the main one.

[NC_Yankee]

There are plenty of female characters doing much better than Black Cat or Spider-womam. Both are below 100 mark.
Also NBA is much more entertaining than WNBA so of course it has more ratings.There are plently of videos on the net about this topic.
The gender card doesn't work in both these scenarios.The gap is way too big in the sales to blame it on just Gender.
There are plently of female lead comics that sell well and plently of woman's sports that do good.

Also Spider-man is no.1 ongoing at marvel or close.It even beat X-men 20 which was a very crucial issue and ASM was just doing one King's ransom issue with nothing special.Both issues were top 10 IIRC.
Miles is usually around 50 mark with normal issues and when with clone saga and milestone and Peter being included on top of the fact that Miles is at his peak rn with his solo game and ITSV being a hit was 25.They aren't even close.
Spider-man is not being out-selled by any one else in his Verse.He is the main one.

I am not a hoops fan (I will watch on occasion Arizona State and I am rooting for the Suns), I am actually a huge hockey, baseball and college football fan ( Sun Devils of course), and brought up the WNBA as an example because it was noted in a commercial by Nike. They actually complained “all we don’t have is you.” I happen to agree Peter is on top, but due to demographic changes, he may or may not be comes Amazing 1000. What can change this ( besides demographics)? Content: Miles needs to be his own character with his own stories and rogues gallery. He does not need “Hand me down Peter stories” especially those that suck like Clone Saga and OMD, no wonder sales are lagging. This I blame on Ahmad and editorial equally. Ahmad needs to get his head out of his ass and quit being lazy and come up with original ideas for Miles, if he cannot or will not then he needs to be replaced. Where I think the change will occur is with merchandising. The 5-10 year olds having their parents getting them Miles Spider-Man toys etc will be the readers and eventually collectors of tomorrow. If enough of them choose Miles he might surpass Peter by Amazing 1000.

[Spiderfan001]

I am not a hoops fan (I will watch on occasion Arizona State and I am rooting for the Suns), I am actually a huge hockey, baseball and college football fan ( Sun Devils of course), and brought up the WNBA as an example because it was noted in a commercial by Nike. They actually complained “all we don’t have is you.” I happen to agree Peter is on top, but due to demographic changes, he may or may not be comes Amazing 1000. What can change this ( besides demographics)? Content: Miles needs to be his own character with his own stories and rogues gallery. He does not need “Hand me down Peter stories” especially those that suck like Clone Saga and OMD, no wonder sales are lagging. This I blame on Ahmad and editorial equally. Ahmad needs to get his head out of his ass and quit being lazy and come up with original ideas for Miles, if he cannot or will not then he needs to be replaced. Where I think the change will occur is with merchandising. The 5-10 year olds having their parents getting them Miles Spider-Man toys etc will be the readers and eventually collectors of tomorrow. If enough of them choose Miles he might surpass Peter by Amazing 1000.

Again don't believe everything you see in a commercial.
Also as I said Miles is at his Peak and will only go down from here.He alreadu got his solo game and likely won't get another.The best he we will get is either a supporting role or a Spider-men style team-up book.Also ITSV 2 will sustain it but won't be as good and will have many more characters and after that one I doubt the franschise will retain it's quality to it's current level.

I agree.Give Miles his own stuff.Miles has a basically non-existent rogue's gallery.No iconic stories of his own aruably besides his origin but that is a big leeway.And hi supporting cast is not good.

Also the younger audience will favor the MCU and it's not even close.MCU Spidey is here and not going anywhere.He is arguably the most popular character with Thor now that the other 2 are gone.Captain Marvel is not good and Falcon Cap is still something some people don't enjoy anywhere near the level of Spidey.
If anything Spencers run sets up Spider-man comics in a better direction than ever and will only go high.Miles won't even come close specially not in the comics scene.

[PCN24454]

Nope.Not even close.
It's compeltely different since Kraven was supposed to be permanently dead after Last hunt.
If peter was killed and it was supposed to be permanent then it would make sense.
Also the death of Kraven makes sense but killing Pete doesn't.

Also Harry or our Harry is not Kindred.Are you even reading the run?

But now we have Kraven as though nothing had happened. If Spencer was committed to killing Kraven off, he wouldn't replace him with an identical clone.

I fell of the series around the time that Aunt May was interacting with Mr. Li, so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

[Frontier]

But now we have Kraven as though nothing had happened. If Spencer was committed to killing Kraven off, he wouldn't replace him with an identical clone.

I fell of the series around the time that Aunt May was interacting with Mr. Li, so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

Well, he committed to filling the void of Kraven without undoing the pathos of Kraven's Last Hunt.

[PCN24454]

Well, he committed to filling the void of Kraven without undoing the pathos of Kraven's Last Hunt.

You're right. The whole point of KLH was that it was overrated and pointless. Nothing of value was lost by killing him.

[HypnoHustler]

How can all the Kindred/OMD stuff be resolved in a satisfactory manner in 2-3 months? Anyway my answer is dependent on that.

If it’s not resolved, I’d give the run a D.

If it’s resolved in a rushed, slapdash way that somewhat addresses the “deal”, but keeps the consequences of OMD in place, I give the run a C-. (I think this is the most likely scenario)

If it’s addressed in a satisfactory way that restores Spidey’s status quo pre-OMD, (EXTREMELY unlikely imo) I’ll give it a B-.

Spencer didn’t permanently damage the character like Slott, but he has some of the worst pacing I’ve ever seen.