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  1. #61
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    By wrong time you mean more regressive time? I'm not super familiar with Slingers so I can't say for sure why it didn't catch on

    I did think once that it might be cool to see a new Spider-hero who has the web/wallcrawler abilities, but otherwise has a totally different power set
    I wouldn't say it was the wrong time exclusively because it was more regressive. There is a variety of reasons it didn't quite work out at the time, including the weak position of Marvel after the 1990s crash before Quesada took over as EIC, and a lower appetite for spinoff books.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  2. #62
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    As others have mentioned, business-wise, it makes sense. If there's a storytelling issue, it's that the other spiders don't serve as foils to Peter.

    All of the characters operate mostly separately as "What ifs. . .," like "What if Peter was made in the modern day and not white?" (Miles) or "What if Peter was a woman?" (Spider-Gwen).

    Yeah, Miles is less science-y and more artsy, and Gwen has a punk vibe, but they feel very similar overall because they're all similar generic POVs--deliberately generic so that they can either serve as inserts for the reader or not offend the reader. This is mass entertainment after all.

    I think the differences would become more pronounced if the characters interacted more. Like DC's solo heroes tend to be generic in their solo titles but have more personality in team books like Justice League.

    The Spiders need a title that's structured like the New Batman Adventures in order to add depth to their personalities and interpersonal dynamics.





    Right now, they're essentially modern day Silver Age characters.

  3. #63
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    On the point above, I could see a team book being a reason to have Miles officially adopt the Shadow Spider codename he's used in some of his alternate versions.


  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    I wouldn't say it was the wrong time exclusively because it was more regressive. There is a variety of reasons it didn't quite work out at the time, including the weak position of Marvel after the 1990s crash before Quesada took over as EIC, and a lower appetite for spinoff books.
    Ok. I know that era had a lot of questionable things going on.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    I think the differences would become more pronounced if the characters interacted more. Like DC's solo heroes tend to be generic in their solo titles but have more personality in team books like Justice League.
    I find that it's the opposite: they're not constrained to their Justice League roles when when they're in their solo books. There's a reason why Peter is the "snarky kid" in Avengers books. He doesn't need to be smart nor strong nor moral because all of those roles are already filled by other characters.

  6. #66
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCN24454 View Post
    I find that it's the opposite: they're not constrained to their Justice League roles when when they're in their solo books. There's a reason why Peter is the "snarky kid" in Avengers books. He doesn't need to be smart nor strong nor moral because all of those roles are already filled by other characters.
    We're saying the same thing. Certain characteristics become more pronounced on teams, since each person needs a set role in the dynamic to differentiate themselves. If say, Peter, Miles, Gwen, and whoever else are all written as equally "smart," "strong," "moral," and whatever else then none of them are. That was a real issue with Silver Age DC group dynamics. Everyone had the same personality/characteristics. For the Spiders to work as well as the Bats, the Spiders need to serve as foils to one another.
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 06-23-2021 at 04:52 PM.

  7. #67
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Marvel Action Spider-Man had all three of them together with contrasting personalities but so often they were fighting threats that...didn't really require three Spider-People to fight.

    It's why in execution I just don't think the Spiders work as well as the Batfamily. And you focus so much more on the Superhero side, you miss the Spiders' respective civilian casts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I don't watch the cartoons so I'm not sure what you're talking about tbh.
    Well, essentially it's a show that put a bunch of Spider-Heroes together (Peter, Miles, Gwen, and Anya) but while ostensibly it was supposed to be a back-to-basics Spider-Man cartoon we had Peter often take a backseat to promote these other characters and he would constantly need to get saved or get help from other characters instead of resolving the problems himself.

    It's like the writers took far more cues from Team Flash in The Flash show than they should have, in my opinion.

    And they didn't even implement or utilize the other characters all that well from a writing standpoint because, conversely, the show would often write them out or just generally not do much with them versus Peter as the main character.

  8. #68
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Marvel Action Spider-Man had all three of them together with contrasting personalities but so often they were fighting threats that...didn't really require three Spider-People to fight.

    It's why in execution I just don't think the Spiders work as well as the Batfamily. And you focus so much more on the Superhero side, you miss the Spiders' respective civilian casts.
    These are good points.

    The Batfamily usually splits up when handling larger threats-- It's not like you have 15 people fighting the Joker all at once. They each resolve some separate issue relevant to the larger threat on their own.

    You also highlight the importance of characters like Alfred, Gordon, and Fox Sr., who can all serve as a connective tissue, even if the characters are separated.

  9. #69
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    An interesting thing to me would be for Peter and Anya to both work at the Daily Bugle. Peter with his doctorate and Anya as an intern while going to ESU to get her journalism degree. Give Anya her own series again and have the 'crossover' from them be being seen at the office together with the occasional team up as a crossover. For example someone doesn't like the DB writing a story about him and comes to shoot up the office and Peter and Anya have to stop him. Either in costume...or to make it more interesting out of costume and have to NOT give away their secret identities.

  10. #70
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0013 View Post
    An interesting thing to me would be for Peter and Anya to both work at the Daily Bugle. Peter with his doctorate and Anya as an intern while going to ESU to get her journalism degree. Give Anya her own series again and have the 'crossover' from them be being seen at the office together with the occasional team up as a crossover. For example someone doesn't like the DB writing a story about him and comes to shoot up the office and Peter and Anya have to stop him. Either in costume...or to make it more interesting out of costume and have to NOT give away their secret identities.
    See, this is how you make these things work

  11. #71
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0013 View Post
    An interesting thing to me would be for Peter and Anya to both work at the Daily Bugle. Peter with his doctorate and Anya as an intern while going to ESU to get her journalism degree. Give Anya her own series again and have the 'crossover' from them be being seen at the office together with the occasional team up as a crossover. For example someone doesn't like the DB writing a story about him and comes to shoot up the office and Peter and Anya have to stop him. Either in costume...or to make it more interesting out of costume and have to NOT give away their secret identities.
    This feels more like something you'd do with Silk since she's into journalism now.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    This feels more like something you'd do with Silk since she's into journalism now.
    I like Anya better then Cindy.

  13. #73
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0013 View Post
    I like Anya better then Cindy.
    I mean, fair enough. Just saying .

  14. #74
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    While I agree with some of the points being made, is it possible some may not like these changes because they don't care much for the new characters? Conversely, I think it's possible some might not care as much about civilian characters so they're ok with new Spider-heroes

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0013 View Post
    An interesting thing to me would be for Peter and Anya to both work at the Daily Bugle. Peter with his doctorate and Anya as an intern while going to ESU to get her journalism degree. Give Anya her own series again and have the 'crossover' from them be being seen at the office together with the occasional team up as a crossover. For example someone doesn't like the DB writing a story about him and comes to shoot up the office and Peter and Anya have to stop him. Either in costume...or to make it more interesting out of costume and have to NOT give away their secret identities.
    This honestly sounds like a terrible idea.

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