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  1. #16
    Astonishing Member 9th.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bat-Meal View Post
    Batman has a small army of underlings now - he doesn't want to play favorites!

    9 kids/students (Dick, Jason, Tim, Damian, Babs, Cass, Steph, Harper, Duke), and 5 peers/family (Selina, Helena, Kate, Luke, Azrael) all vying for his attention. And that's not even including all the new characters that have been introduced lately.

    Okay, with the adults he mostly only teams-up with Selina and Kate, but that makes sense since one is his lover and the other his cousin. But with the Robin and Batgirl types, the fans of each respective character probably wants their one to get most of the team-ups, so playing favorites does become a bother.
    This man got his own Justice League good lord.
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  2. #17
    Extraordinary Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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  3. #18
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    Even after Dick went to college and became Nightwing, Robin was still viewed as a central tenant of Batman's world, hence Jason. I think it was really Year One that kickstarted this separation of Batman and Robin in the public view. All of a sudden Frank Miller showed everyone how badass Batman could be by himself. Then that's all anyone wanted. So you had the Legends of the Dark Knight series and related spinoffs like The Long Halloween, but then you had the introduction of Tim Drake, who was actually surprisingly omnipresent in the mid-to-late 90s (I think he's in like every issue of Chuck Dixon's Batman and Detective run).

    So yeah, it's weird. I'm really disappointed that DC has just given up in trying to make the Batman and Robin dynamic work. I like solo Batman, but it's time to bring Robin back. Really they should have let Duke graduate to Robin. Hell, I'd take Harper Row. Even Holly Robinson. Or, it'd be pretty funny if Jarro actually became Robin for a spell. Anyone.

  4. #19
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleGlovez View Post
    Even after Dick went to college and became Nightwing, Robin was still viewed as a central tenant of Batman's world, hence Jason. I think it was really Year One that kickstarted this separation of Batman and Robin in the public view. All of a sudden Frank Miller showed everyone how badass Batman could be by himself. Then that's all anyone wanted. So you had the Legends of the Dark Knight series and related spinoffs like The Long Halloween, but then you had the introduction of Tim Drake, who was actually surprisingly omnipresent in the mid-to-late 90s (I think he's in like every issue of Chuck Dixon's Batman and Detective run).

    So yeah, it's weird. I'm really disappointed that DC has just given up in trying to make the Batman and Robin dynamic work. I like solo Batman, but it's time to bring Robin back. Really they should have let Duke graduate to Robin. Hell, I'd take Harper Row. Even Holly Robinson. Or, it'd be pretty funny if Jarro actually became Robin for a spell. Anyone.
    Well, Duke was essentially the Robin of Snyder's run.

    But I don't think they want to remove Damian from the mantle yet. Partnering with Batman? Maybe.

  5. #20
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    Snyder wanted to make Duke "something better" than Robin and now Duke as a character has faded into total irrelevance. If there had been a bigger push to have Duke officially wear the colors, I think the public might have gotten on board with him. Walk up to someone on the street and ask them if they know who "The Signal" is... I mean, come on.

  6. #21
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleGlovez View Post
    Snyder wanted to make Duke "something better" than Robin and now Duke as a character has faded into total irrelevance. If there had been a bigger push to have Duke officially wear the colors, I think the public might have gotten on board with him. Walk up to someone on the street and ask them if they know who "The Signal" is... I mean, come on.


    Agreed. Both Duke and Harper feel like they were supposed to be Robins. I think Snyder wanted them to be "Lark" and "Blue Bird," other bird themed sidekicks who aren't actually Robins.





    Doesn't help that "Signal" makes me thing "Virtue Signal."

    The idea of a black Robin does back to Tim Burton casting Marlon Wayans for his final Bat film, which was never produced.

  7. #22
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Marlon Wayans Robin gets referenced from time to time



    I think it influenced the future Robin Sean Gordon Murphy drew is Detective Comics 27



    Nikolas Draper Ivy drew his own once:


  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleGlovez View Post
    Snyder wanted to make Duke "something better" than Robin and now Duke as a character has faded into total irrelevance. If there had been a bigger push to have Duke officially wear the colors, I think the public might have gotten on board with him. Walk up to someone on the street and ask them if they know who "The Signal" is... I mean, come on.
    But with Damian still being new to the mantle and quite popular. It was not really a good time for the switch.

    If they had made him Robin, he would have been for many people probaly "the reason why we can't have Damian back", and that would have been also pretty damaging for the character.

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member 9th.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SecretWarrior View Post
    Marlon Wayans Robin gets referenced from time to time



    I think it influenced the future Robin Sean Gordon Murphy drew is Detective Comics 27



    Nikolas Draper Ivy drew his own once:

    Hold up, Marlon Wayans was supposed to be Robin?!?!?!?!?!
    Reading List (Super behind but reading them nontheless):
    DC: Green Lantern, Wonder Girl, Far Sector, The Other History of the DC Universe, The Next Batamn, Robin, Nightwing
    Marvel: HiXmen, Miles Morales: Spider-Man, Immortal Hulk, Daredevil
    Image: Killadelphia, Bitter Root, Excellence, Decorum
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  10. #25
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9th. View Post
    Hold up, Marlon Wayans was supposed to be Robin?!?!?!?!?!
    Yeah, he signed a contract before they decided not to move forward, so he still gets royalties

    https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertain...ks-today.html/
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 06-23-2021 at 10:54 PM.

  11. #26
    Invincible Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    But with Damian still being new to the mantle and quite popular. It was not really a good time for the switch.
    Morrison's Damian first appeared back in 2006.

    Duke first appeared in 2013, and that was as a part of a Zero Year story; I don't think he was in the present-day storyline until the Endgame arc in late 2014.

    So Damian "still being new to the mantle" may be a questionable call.

  12. #27
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    Well, Damian was very popular (and was the Robin that appeared in the animated movies), so why replace him?
    Also, previous Robins held the mantle for very long tenures, which actually made them meaningful and important. Dick was Robin for over 40 years, Tim was Robin for 20 years, so 8 years is really not that long.

    Also, making Duke another Robin would just add to the extending number of Robins and ex-Robins. There's plenty of problem with both Tim and Damian sharing the mantle together now, and with Tim having problems graduating from it to his own identity. Why add another one?
    Duke would just be another ex-Robin or another Robin, one of several. Isn't it much better to start with his own identity from the very beginning?

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Morrison's Damian first appeared back in 2006.
    But he didn't became Robin until 2008.

    That's only 5-6 years in the mantle and he didn't even had a solo book during that time. So at least to me that's to early to already replace him.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleGlovez View Post
    Snyder wanted to make Duke "something better" than Robin and now Duke as a character has faded into total irrelevance. If there had been a bigger push to have Duke officially wear the colors, I think the public might have gotten on board with him. Walk up to someone on the street and ask them if they know who "The Signal" is... I mean, come on.
    so do characters need the to be in the mantle of pre established adored characters to be accepted? Especially POC,
    I was watching a youtube video about that yesterday. Is it sloppy seconds or can they become their own brand? You think Tim has it bad right now? The amount of hate he would get if he had to share the title with Duke and duke one robin was favored. The signal is not a good name, but being robin, especially when the younger and more qualified damian is around was never an option.

  15. #30
    Astonishing Member SecretWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lal View Post
    Duke would just be another ex-Robin or another Robin, one of several. Isn't it much better to start with his own identity from the very beginning?
    There are so many failed Bat characters that started this way who no one knows anymore.

    Batman really only has three types of sidekicks, and they're all variants on Dick (Golden Boy)/Babs (Smart Kid)/Jason (Bad Boy). It does feel redundant after a while, which makes it hard for new folks to stick around.
    Last edited by SecretWarrior; 06-24-2021 at 04:06 PM.

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