Spider-Man Beyond

[classicgmer]

If it helps, she did appear in the Heroes Reborn one-shot "Peter Parker: The Amazing Shutterbug" while Peter was testing out his VR-piloted drone camera. Given her past association with VR technology, I thought it was a nice touch.

Huh didn't know that as i just stuck with the main Heroes reborn book but i think there's a pretty good chance she'll make an appearance as she's one of those characters that while she may not have the biggest or most important moments continues to pop up from time to time and that's a lot more than a bunch of characters created in the 90's can say.




Also having a fairly sizeable roll in "Into the Spiderverse" i think reflects pretty well on how she's viewed by some in Marvel.

[Huntsman Spider]

Huh didn't know that as i just stuck with the main Heroes reborn book but i think there's a pretty good chance she'll make an appearance as she's one of those characters that while she may not have the biggest or most important moments continues to pop up from time to time and that's a lot more than a bunch of characters created in the 90's can say.




Also having a fairly sizeable roll in "Into the Spiderverse" i think reflects pretty well on how she's viewed by some in Marvel.

Technically, Into the Spider-Verse's Doctor Octopus was a gender-bent Otto Octavius named Olivia, but considering Carolyn Trainer as Lady Octopus was redesigned in her reappearances in Nick Spencer's ASM to resemble Olivia Octavius . . .

[Blanks]

Technically, Into the Spider-Verse's Doctor Octopus was a gender-bent Otto Octavius named Olivia, but considering Carolyn Trainer as Lady Octopus was redesigned in her reappearances in Nick Spencer's ASM to resemble Olivia Octavius . . .

Yeah, I thought that was a missed opportunity sitting there in the movie theater watching it, not naming making her Carolyn Trainer.

[The Negative Zone]

So, another pointless status quo change, huh?
Don't get me wrong, I enjoy reading about Ben Reilly, and I'm all in - having him again in main Spider-Man book, but I'm really tired of this constant change, or more like illusion of change.

Just write about Peter punching a man with metal arms, giant lizards and other things, You don't have to constantly mindswap him or replace him with clones and stuff..

I'd be disappointed if you told me nothing would ever change even if it was only for a little while

[PCN24454]

Yeah, I thought that was a missed opportunity sitting there in the movie theater watching it, not naming making her Carolyn Trainer.

It would've spoiled the twist.

[Spiderfan001]

Also the promo says that he is back as Spider-man in 75 itself so it's not a slow change.
Also that he wants to succed where peter failed.So ummm...... yeah.Maybe they show that peter failed or something in future because he seems to be doing Spider-man just fine rn.
Again determined to be the "best version" is basically what they tried in Superior Spider-man.Didn't work for ock, I doubt it works for Ben.

Again if they the story here is how Ben is related to the corp and Peter stuff, whatever that is I doubt we will actually get a lot of time with Ben as Spidey.

[Shadowcat]

New Beyond teaser from Patrick Gleason.

Gleason’s giving me Adam Kubert vibes here.

[Speed Force League Unlimited]

Did the new Ben Reilly stop being a mean jerk?

[HypnoHustler]

Did the new Ben Reilly stop being a mean jerk?

Kinda. He had his personality “reset” in Spidergeddon (don’t ask), and since then he’s appeared in Cantwell’s Iron Man. He’s portrayed nice and normal, if a bit generic.

[Somecrazyaussie]

I hope they bring back Judas Traveller, too. And maybe Spidercide. And give Kaine back his original costume. The Clone Saga was flawed but there are some great designs and characters with real potential. And Spidercide (who is neither great nor possessing great potential, but the name is awesome).

Spidercide, yes. Traveller? No. He was so far outside the Spidey wheelhouse first time around it was jarring. So much so they had to revise him later on to be Psychologist who had a mental breakdown and this triggered the ability to cause illusions. Which is all he had. But originally? He was supposed to be a quasi-mystical being walking the earth to study good vs evil.

[Somecrazyaussie]

Not that person. I have no problems not discussing or buying issues if I’m not enjoying the content or at least hopeful that it will get better. I will never be that person that continuously collects something if they are not enjoying it on some level. That’s one of the main problems with comic fans and in particular Spider-Man fans. They complain, they moan, they cry and yet still shell out the money...so in essence all that effort spent complaining really amounted to nothing. Writers and companies get away with producing mediocrity because people never show their displeasure with their wallets.

I’ve already taken multiple breaks from comics because the material just stopped being entertaining. Take “Last Remains” for instance. Started out hot and I was singing it’s praises and little by little, the mediocrity, teasing and padded story telling started to take over. What started out fantastic turned into a disappointment. So what happened? Last Remains finishes and I stop posting here and buying any issues. A little time passes, things look a bit interesting and I’m back again.

Again it infuriates the hell out of me to see how willingly fans just accept what’s throw their way. Consistently complaining does nothing. Choosing not to spend money actually does something.

Shelling out money, Buying sucky content that you don’t enjoy, complaining about the material constantly and sticking through it doesn’t make you some “true” fan. It makes you a miserable clueless one.

Just my two cents...

Normally, what you are saying is EXACTLY how people should go about things. If you aren't enjoying something, and it makes you angry/miserable/upset, then simply walk away until it shifts back into a direction where it does.

However, Revolutionary_Jack highlighted the reason many dont: a collector mentality. They will continue to buy a book regardless of how it makes them feel simply because they have too much time or money invested in it. Some have huge collections whereby any gap triggers OCD. Some just buy it out of habit.

Personally, I buy because I have done for 30 plus years. The difference with me is that I've learned to realize things come full circle eventually. They always do. Peter is one such character you can never take off the board for too long.

But I don't think not buying a comic is effective enough. Because readers would need to leave in droves and they never do. If that was the case Superior wouldn't have lasted as long as it did (and that only ended because Amazing 2 was coming out). These boards were vehemently against it. Yet enough read it.

[Dzika_Sowa]

I'd be disappointed if you told me nothing would ever change even if it was only for a little while

It's not like I don't want anything to change

Changes are good, but it needs to be well-thought and permanent (or at least it should last a few years). As I see it now, Ben Reilly is going to be the Spider-Man, a few years back, we saw Otto doing exactly that, and in the 90s we saw Ben doing just that.

I'd say, ok - it could be an interesting story, buuuuuut...... I know it'll last for a few months, and then? *Proof* Peter is back again, got back the mantle.

Rinse and repeat.

It's cheap, like characters death.
Man, I always laughed at soap operas on TV, but comics became exactly like that.

I suppose that's why I do enjoy current run so much. I can't really see where Spencer is going with it, and while we already know that Ben becames Spider-Man, we still don't know what's going to happen with Peter. He could be dead, for all we know.

[Jness]

Ah, okay. Maybe I have to walk that back a little.



The weird thing is that the sample that led to Ben's cloning was taken during Warren's class for an unrelated lab test during the Lee-Romita era. This was ASM#148-149 as someone corrected me elsewhere today.

Ben's actual creation happened after Gwen died and Miles Warren started going nuts but the sample came earlier. So what that means is that Ben is a clone of Peter who has never experienced the Death of George Stacy, the Drug Trilogy, and also The Night Gwen Stacy Died in addition to all the stuff Spider-Man did between ASM#149 to ASM#391.

What that means is that Ben is
[a]Younger than Peter (depending on how you compress Comic Book Time which also means compressing the time Peter-Gwen had a relationship of course)
[b]Has no memories of stories like The Death of Captain Stacy, The Drug Trilogy, the Night Gwen Stacy Died.

The Second Clone Saga obviously didn't honor Conway's original story but the major thing is that since they wrote Ben as the real Peter of AF#15 that meant that Ben had to have experienced all of Peter's adventures up to ASM#149 which is obviously a major plot hole that unravels the whole thing. Because if Ben's sample was drawn from an earlier point in time and cloned after Gwen's death, there's no way they can run with the idea that Peter of the 20 interim years is a clone...and if Ben was the real Peter who was switched at the smokestack, that meant that Ben had to have all of Peter's memories up to ASM#149.

So that's a major continuity issue. There's another one, let's say you retcon it and say Ben was cloned right before the big stadium fight...that means that Ben wasn't a perfect clone of Peter at creation because Peter by that time had already moved away from his feelings for Gwen to Mary Jane which wasn't reflected in Ben Reilly and is in fact the main way Peter knows he's the real deal because he's the one who has changed and changing at the end of Conway's story.

So there's a lot of ways, Ben Reilly and the stories we have break continuity and don't make sense. Layers of misreading and notes that are missed.

Oh wow. This is an excellent point and one I’ve never considered, and I’m a fan of *both* the original clone saga and the 90s one (no one was more excited than me when the Jackal came back).

[Shunt]

Oh wow. This is an excellent point and one I’ve never considered, and I’m a fan of *both* the original clone saga and the 90s one (no one was more excited than me when the Jackal came back).

It was stated from the very beginning of the second clone saga (ie, the accompanying story that came in flip book form) that Parker memories were implanted in Ben well after he was created. Kaine didn't even had them in the first place, and both clone and original got memories of waking in a vat (albeit in a dormant form), implying Warren had the technology of extracting memories from one subject and implanting them into another, leaving aside the creation of false "de novo" memories. How and when they were implanted was never perfectly clarified, but it's very plausible Warren implanted the final "batch" of memories in Ben when both him and Peter they were unconscious, right before their first figt. There are way more blatant continuity issues than that, I think.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Oh wow. This is an excellent point and one I’ve never considered, and I’m a fan of *both* the original clone saga and the 90s one (no one was more excited than me when the Jackal came back).

Thanks. The fact is that the First Clone Saga was a single one-time story and it was understood as such, which is why Jackal wasn't referred to again and why almost nobody seriously thought that Peter was a clone for any length of time in the interim between the 1st and 2nd. The way the story was done it didn't leave any room whatsoever for any kind of revival which is why the 2nd Clone Saga had to break all the norms of Spider-Man storytelling to even make a semblance of a case.

It was stated from the very beginning of the second clone saga (ie, the accompanying story that came in flip book form) that Parker memories were implanted in Ben well after he was created.

So Warren felt he had to update his clone with the latest patch before the stadium fight, like iPhone updates, lol!

How and when they were implanted was never perfectly clarified,

And there we have it.

I mean obviously the 2nd Clone Saga had a huge problem in making a big deal out of stories and characters who can never fulfill that purpose. And the entire idea that Ben is the real Peter, or could plausibly be real Peter and the Peter we read is a clone, broke continuity in a way that's never been put back together. Because the first saga made it clear that the sample for Ben came from the time Warren was teaching the class, and the first saga made an argument that Peter was clearly the real deal that had no room to dodge whatsoever.