Page 1 of 16 1234511 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 227
  1. #1
    Mighty Member mystical41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    1,182

    Default Why many writers fail to write Cheetah be writen as a powerhouse?

    From comics where Batman, Catwoman ,Green Arrow, Steve Trevor etc beat her. From movies like apokolips war, death in the familiy. Where simply humans with a gun killed her. Or WW84, where she is supposed to be above WW(Sigh) and yet no great feats of strength, no super speed. And weak durability. Apparently Patty Jenkins and geoff don't think of WW as a tanky character. Since Cheetah was taken down by 20 seconds of electrocution under water, and she was supposed to be more powerful than Diana.

    So why is this. Is the character of Cheetah cursed beyond urzkartaga? This character has received a very bad treatment. Not that WW is in a much better place. But that is a topic for a different thread.

  2. #2
    Been lurking since '08 Marik Swift's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    407

    Default

    Problem with Cheetah is that to most writers she doesn't look like a powerhouse.

    Cheetahs are known for their speed and lethality, not for their strength and durability, so most writers just sees her as a glass canon with speed (which is not as good without the speed force). And speed in general is always such a different thing to write (as evident by Flash getting caught by most of his rogues who don't have super speed), that she generally just gets taken down easily.
    Last edited by Marik Swift; 07-08-2021 at 05:07 PM.

  3. #3
    Mighty Member mystical41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    1,182

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marik Swift View Post
    Problem with Cheetah is that to most writers she doesn't look like a powerhouses.

    Cheetahs are known for their speed and lethality, not for their strength and durability, so most writers just sees her as a glass canon with speed. And speed in general is always such a different thing to write (as evident by Flash getting caught by most of his rogues who don't have super speed), that she generally just gets taken down easily.
    I doubt she would get such a treatment if she was a Superman villain. I'm sure we would not see her getting beat and or killed by humans with guns and other bad stuff that her, WW and other WW characters have to suffer.

  4. #4
    Been lurking since '08 Marik Swift's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    407

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mystical41 View Post
    I doubt she would get such a treatment if she was a Superman villain. I'm sure we would not see her getting beat and or killed by humans with guns and other bad stuff that her, WW and other WW characters have to suffer.
    This victim mentality is something we as Wonder fans really need to stop spreading.

    Batman, Superman, Flash, etc, all have villains who are treated as poorly and even more poorly than a lot of Diana's rogues.

    If the argument is that "Cheetah is Diana's rival/archenemy and you don't see Lex/Joker being treated this way". The reality is that Cheetah has not been Diana's archenemy in years. Circe and Ares have both long surpassed her in that aspect and you rarely see them getting treated as anything less than the powerhouses they are.

    Even the N52 Superman/Wonder Woman comic, which infamously wrote Diana as inferior to Superman, showcased that the Greek gods are superior to Superman, as evidenced by Apollo knocking Superman on his ass, and the only reason Superman could fight on even terms with him was cause Apollo's powers was making him more powerful.
    Last edited by Marik Swift; 07-08-2021 at 05:08 PM.

  5. #5
    Fishy Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    The Ocean
    Posts
    2,707

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marik Swift View Post
    This victim mentality is something we as Wonder fans really need to stop spreading.

    Batman, Superman, Flash, etc, all have villains who are treated as poorly and even more poorly than a lot of Diana's rogues.

    If the argument is that "Cheetah is Diana's rival/archenemy and you don't see Lex/Joker being treated this way". The reality is that Cheetah has not been Diana's archenemy in years. Circe and Ares have both long surpassed her in that aspect and you rarely see them getting treated as anything less than the powerhouses they are.

    Even the N52 Superman/Wonder Woman comic, which infamously wrote Diana as inferior to Superman, showcased that the Greek gods are superior to Superman, as evidenced by Apollo knocking Superman on his ass, and the only reason Superman could fight on even terms with him was cause Apollo's powers was making him more powerful.
    I'd say quite the opposite, actually. DC has been pushing Cheetah as Diana's archenemy more than ever this past decade, while Circe and Ares have been pushed further away (Ares is rarely portrayed in a truly villainous role now)

    And Circe has only been in 5 issues of Wonder Woman this past decade, where-as she was a much more regular character Post-Crisis.
    Last edited by I'm a Fish; 07-08-2021 at 06:18 PM.

  6. #6
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    13,427

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marik Swift View Post
    If the argument is that "Cheetah is Diana's rival/archenemy and you don't see Lex/Joker being treated this way". The reality is that Cheetah has not been Diana's archenemy in years. Circe and Ares have both long surpassed her in that aspect and you rarely see them getting treated as anything less than the powerhouses they are.
    Where have Circe and Ares been treated as the arch enemies in recent years? Circe's barely appeared in the WW books since the New 52 started, and Ares hasn't been a villain since that time either.

    Ares had the first movie, but has has "Starter Villain" written all over him. He was also generally cited as the weakest element by both fans and detractors alike. If anyone is Cheetah's rival for arch nemesis these days, it is (inexplicably) Max Lord. Otherwise, they've been pushing Cheetah as the arch. In Rebirth she was at the forefront of Rucka's run and was in Snyder's Legion of Doom, and she was at the front of the group pic alongside Diana in the advertisement for the new run. In comparison, Circe was in the back of the group shot and Ares was absent altogether.
    Last edited by SiegePerilous02; 07-08-2021 at 07:26 PM.

  7. #7
    Fishy Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    The Ocean
    Posts
    2,707

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Where have Circe and Ares been treated as the arch enemies in recent years? Circe's barely appeared in the WW books since the New 52 started, and Ares hasn't been a villain since that time either.

    Ares had the first movie, but has has "Starter Villain" written all over him. He was also generally cited as the weakest element by both fans and detractors alike. If anyone is Cheetah's rival for arch nemesis these days, it is (inexplicably) Max Lord.
    Uggg, The unfortunate realty is there is a truth to that statement. *Shivers*

    Thank goodness he doesn't look as cool to fight on comic cover (or encyclopedia covers).





    Last edited by I'm a Fish; 07-08-2021 at 07:43 PM.

  8. #8
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    13,427

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by I'm a Fish View Post
    Uggg, The unfortunate realty is their is a truth to that statement. *Shivers*

    Thank goodness he doesn't look as cool to fight on comic cover (or encyclopedia covers).

    Yeah the arch nemesis pairings here are pretty telling. This equates Cheetah with Lex and Joker (and Black Manta and Zoom) pretty firmly.

    It should totally have Nightwing vs. Deathstroke and Hal vs. Sinestro though, even if putting Jess and Cyborg on there was a right move

  9. #9
    Beyond Good. Beyond Evil. Gaius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    7,542

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Yeah the arch nemesis pairings here are pretty telling. This equates Cheetah with Lex and Joker (and Black Manta and Zoom) pretty firmly.

    It should totally have Nightwing vs. Deathstroke and Hal vs. Sinestro though, even if putting Jess and Cyborg on there was a right move
    Batwoman and Harley Quinn is what's raising my eyebrow. I can at least see the connection with Cyborg vs. Deathstroke and Sinestro vs. Jessica.

  10. #10
    Fishy Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    The Ocean
    Posts
    2,707

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Yeah the arch nemesis pairings here are pretty telling. This equates Cheetah with Lex and Joker (and Black Manta and Zoom) pretty firmly.

    It should totally have Nightwing vs. Deathstroke and Hal vs. Sinestro though, even if putting Jess and Cyborg on there was a right move
    Oddly, the back has Nightwing vs Catwoman...

    Also, I have been quite satisfied with the lack of Cheetah jobbing since Rebirth. I think part of that is from Geoff Johns, who, despite my dislike of his portrayal of Wonder Woman in the comics, is the only writer to have Cheetah 1 v 6 the League. (Also Johns loves cat themed characters, am I the only one who has noticed that? He really likes Wildcat too, gave him a werecat son and everything... had Wildcat's daughter as a main character in Stargirl...co-created Dex-starr the house-cat red lantern.. anyways) I don't really have much to complain about, I think I got it all out of my system a while ago.

    I mean, Cheetah killed two gods...

    Last edited by I'm a Fish; 07-08-2021 at 08:24 PM.

  11. #11
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    8,132

    Default

    It's mostly Wonder Woman in generally they have no respect about Diana or who she stands for. It's also the fact who is cheetah to them. Is she a woman who puts on a suit or cursed. Another issue is the fact they don't use her out of the Comics sometimes and when they do it's laughable

  12. #12
    Mighty Member Largo161's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    1,069

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    Yeah the arch nemesis pairings here are pretty telling. This equates Cheetah with Lex and Joker (and Black Manta and Zoom) pretty firmly.

    It should totally have Nightwing vs. Deathstroke and Hal vs. Sinestro though, even if putting Jess and Cyborg on there was a right move
    Who is the artist? This is lovely.
    I only support clay origins.

  13. #13
    Fishy Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    The Ocean
    Posts
    2,707

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Largo161 View Post
    Who is the artist? This is lovely.
    Mikel Janin.

    He was actually a guest artist for a few Wonder Woman issues not long ago. (#759-760 I believe)

  14. #14
    Mighty Member mystical41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    1,182

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marik Swift View Post
    This victim mentality is something we as Wonder fans really need to stop spreading.

    Batman, Superman, Flash, etc, all have villains who are treated as poorly and even more poorly than a lot of Diana's rogues.

    If the argument is that "Cheetah is Diana's rival/archenemy and you don't see Lex/Joker being treated this way". The reality is that Cheetah has not been Diana's archenemy in years. Circe and Ares have both long surpassed her in that aspect and you rarely see them getting treated as anything less than the powerhouses they are.

    Even the N52 Superman/Wonder Woman comic, which infamously wrote Diana as inferior to Superman, showcased that the Greek gods are superior to Superman, as evidenced by Apollo knocking Superman on his ass, and the only reason Superman could fight on even terms with him was cause Apollo's powers was making him more powerful.

    What i said is true though. And Circe and Ares are nowhewre near Cheetah for the title of archy villain. Those 2 have barely been used in WW comics. While Ares hasn't even been portrayed as a real villain in a long time. On the other hand. Cheetah is the center face of WW's rogue in the DCU at large. She keeps being used far more than the others. But most of the time, she is disrespected. Which says a lot. For DC, Cheetah is WW's archy villain. And they treat her like garbage and weak 90% of the time.

  15. #15
    Extraordinary Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    8,132

    Default

    I honestly think of the three of them has all of her archenemies but in different ways. Cheetah is her dark mirror, Circe is the mother's mistakes that Diana has to fight and Ares is both her's and the amazons enemy. In other words


    Cheetah: Dark Mirror
    Circe:Revenge on the Mother
    Ares:What the Amazons could be

    If anything Circe can work has a enemy to Hippoltya also

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •