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  1. #121
    Mighty Member Primal Slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    I don't get why Diana would be the one to argue in favor of moral relativism in front of Clark. She literally left her Islandto teach the world "a better way". In the Marston era she had a specific ideology she wanted to impose around the world.

    I feel like Clark should be the one that would hesitate in interfering with international (or galactic) affairs.
    The island is still part of Earth and the Amazons were part of Mans World.

  2. #122
    Fantastic Member Sebastianne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Slayer View Post
    The island is still part of Earth and the Amazons were part of Mans World.
    And above all this is no Marston era...

  3. #123
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    But her culture was totally different from the rest of the world, and yet she still thinks she knows what's better for the world.

  4. #124
    Fantastic Member Sebastianne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    But her culture was totally different from the rest of the world, and yet she still thinks she knows what's better for the world.
    clearly you haven't read that story.

  5. #125
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Yeah no I haven't, I was just commenting on the panel posted. But what happens in the story?

  6. #126
    Fishy Member I'm a Fish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy_McNichts View Post
    In fact, I remember an interview with one of the show's developers where they bragged that they always made sure Wonder Woman was fighting the hardest out of everyone. I know they think that proves they treated her with respect and made her appear powerful, but it kind of reveals how little use they had for her. In any given situation or battle, Diana's just in the background punching things while the other heroes actually resolve the plot. They can't think of anything useful to do with her, so just have her punching things in the background or off-screen.
    Did it ever occur to them you can fight without using your fists?

    It should be written in the contract when you sign on to write Wonder Woman that you have a chat with Christie Marston first, she knows Wonder Woman more than anybody.
    ~I just keep swimming through these threads~

  7. #127
    The Last Dragon masterwitcher88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    What I said was that integrity and honor aren't her defining traits amidst the Justice League. Most of them are just as honorable and full of integrity.

    From what I gather, what you wrote about her Wisdom ans Judgment is "Diana knows best and is always right". I don't like this idea. For one thing, it can be boring. For another, isn't that the same thing Superman and Batman were portrayed as? thati know Batman at least always thought he was right. And there's nothing more pompous than thinking you know what's best for everyone.

    Gym trainer is straight from the Marston version. It's in her relationship with the Holliday Girls, it's in her interaction with Queen Atomia. It's fine if you don't like that version, but it was very much in her essence. Think of those Aerobics videos where a woman tells you "let's go faster! You're beautiful! you're doing great! You're gonna get that body you've always wanted" Except that what Diana teaches you is to study science and art along with athleticism.

    I never liked the ambassador thing so I guess we can't find a middle ground on that.
    I don't really believe that a woman who posses the "Wisdom of Athena" is wrong a lot or even at all. Sure, she may make a rare mistake but she apologizes after and tries to mend it. And she faces the consequences of all her actions and decisions without question. She maybe naive about the world at first, but she learns rather quickly. I do see her as someone that values learning and someone that is very observant, so she doesn't have a single mind set. She's like a more compassionate Odin in that regard, someone that seeks knowledge and wisdom and adventure, but to better the world. She deals with every situation in a way that best helps that situation. I suppose you can view it as pompous, if you totally ignore her compassionate character and if you forget that she is a princess after all, not a romanticized one but one that does make tough decisions.

    That's fine and dandy for some situations but if its for basically every interaction, then its boring.
    Zaldrīzes Buzdari Iksos Daor

  8. #128
    The Last Dragon masterwitcher88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by I'm a Fish View Post
    Did it ever occur to them you can fight without using your fists?

    It should be written in the contract when you sign on to write Wonder Woman that you have a chat with Christie Marston first, she knows Wonder Woman more than anybody.
    Its funny when you go back and watch the so called "hardest fights" because she wasn't really up against a ton of tough opponents or at least none that should have be so much of a challenge. And that quote wouldn't have been so bad if, as Guy points out, they did something else with her.
    Zaldrīzes Buzdari Iksos Daor

  9. #129
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterwitcher88 View Post
    I don't really believe that a woman who posses the "Wisdom of Athena" is wrong a lot or even at all. Sure, she may make a rare mistake but she apologizes after and tries to mend it. And she faces the consequences of all her actions and decisions without question.
    But how would that have played into the group dynamic in the Justice League show? Batman always thinks he is right. Superman is also mostly certain of himself. John Stewart doesn't have many moments of uncertainty from what I can recall. And also, how does that play into the action and the comedy of the show?

  10. #130
    Fantastic Member Sebastianne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Yeah no I haven't, I was just commenting on the panel posted. But what happens in the story?
    For me her point of view is interesting, it basically summarizes who she is and her beliefs, unlike what you say regarding that she wants to impose her ideas, what she wants is to teach and help and that the rest embrace the ideas of their culture, respecting their times and uniques contexts. In this story, what separates her from the rest of the Team is that the others want to help by imposing and organizing a planet according to their own cosmovision of the Universe (cis heteronormative terrestrial men ), that's why she says we help but we do not reign. Unlike the others, she is interested in learning, listening and understanding that culture to help them. She also tells some kind of story, an interesting parallelism about a queen, Ischyria. Anyway, for me an enjoyable story.

  11. #131
    The Last Dragon masterwitcher88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    But how would that have played into the group dynamic in the Justice League show? Batman always thinks he is right. Superman is also mostly certain of himself. John Stewart doesn't have many moments of uncertainty from what I can recall. And also, how does that play into the action and the comedy of the show?
    Oh, you know, Diana voicing an opinion, one backed with wisdom and intelligence that observes the situation at hand without any arrogance to it, and ultimately proven to be right in a clever way like the reasoning behind a character's motivations or actions during a conflict or ending a galactic war via a treaty or be friending an enemy to find a solution to a problem, that would be nice to have. Diana being treated like everyone else at the table. And people she maybe trying to help, may not take her advise, how many stories are there of Diana reaching out to a villain to help only to have it spit on?

    What does Jonn, Clark, or Bruce have to do with anything we are talking about? you bring them up like "what about these guys" and its like, I'm not talking about them. If anything you bringing them up kind of proves that Diana is the odd one out and that maybe she has the better takes if given the chance to speak.

    Action... really? Wonder Woman, the amazon warrior goddess suddenly has a problem being involved with action now? And dude, idk about comedy, she isn't Wally, you can have her crack jokes that pertain to her character or misconceptions about the amazons. She can have wit and some sass, like lady Olenna or Varis from Game of Thrones. JL/U isn't all comedy either, it had moments of gravitas and seriousness, maybe she can play more into those episodes.
    Zaldrīzes Buzdari Iksos Daor

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by DochaDocha View Post
    Aren't her periods of relative underpowering actually greater in total length than periods of appropriate power at this point? Kind of reminds me of the Thor/Hulk debate. Thor was intended to be greater in strength than Hulk, but Marvel largely went away from that and Stan Lee's take is no longer gospel.
    Not even in modern comics would be her phases of being that much underpowered longer, Post Crisis was longer than the time period of the DCEU, DCAMU, Injustice, New 52 and Rebirth together after all and Rebirth came around a bit at the end, except you mean jobbing to Superman and Batman, in that case are her phases of being underpowered truly longer. And if Wonder Woman being a powerhouse and comparable with Superman, and by that token Green Lantern, Martian Manhunter or Flash is no longer gospel at DC, is all i have to say that i hope that DC loses the rights so that anyone who is actually capable of not destroying 1 of the biggest core concepts of Wonder Woman gets a chance. Although i am not sure if Marvel would be truly a good choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Dude, I asked about what stories people would've like to see adapted in the Justice League Tv show. You seem to have no interest in discussing the stories you enjoy.


    Instead, you guys turn this back into a discussion about how Wonder Woman should be more powerful. Cmon man. Put your energy into things you like, not things you dislike.
    I have specifically answered a part of a comment of you about power complaints and that you enjoyed A League of One, why should i answer an unrelated question in my reply to specifically that?

    What do you think would happen if DC would now start the same trash in the same frequency for several years with Superman as best example, do you think the Superman board would be not full of power complaints? I would even guess it would be worse remembering big discussions throughout several comic communities, just for the few examples like Death Earth or even bigger as Wonder Woman somewhat saved Superman from Zod and Faora, and scenes like that happening far more often throughout several media would be even just a part of the full problem.
    Last edited by Rightoya; 07-24-2021 at 03:59 AM.

  13. #133
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Have you been to the Superman board? They DO complain about Clark's power levels.

    And when exactly do you think was the long period where Diana was massively powerful? It definitely wasn't post crisis aside from a brief moment between 1996 and maybe 2003.

    In Perez's run Diana was vulnerable to a tribal dart. She couldn't even resist a basic poison, and the heaviest thing I know she lifted was a car.
    Last edited by Alpha; 07-24-2021 at 03:30 AM.

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Have you been to the Superman board? They DO complain about Clark's power levels.

    And when exactly do you think was the long period where Diana was massively powerful? It definitely wasn't post crisis aside from a brief moment between 1998 and 2003.

    In Perez's run Diana was vulnerable to a tribal dart. She couldn't even resist a basic poison, and the heaviest thing I know she lifted was a car.
    Ok, you are just proving my point, if they complain already.

    In Pre Crisis had Wonder Woman odd times of being massively powerful, and in most of Post Crisis was Wonder Woman not as massively depowered as in in most of New 52 and Rebirth, and the DCEU, DCAMU, and Injustice, were not even a thing back then, but Post Crisis was not perfect in that regard either that much is true.

    In Perez run has Wonder Woman held her own against a force whose shockwaves shaked through the entire planet, deflected the combined might of the greek gods to end olympus, and had odd powers like getting regenerated from her lasso and pumping life into beings in connection with Gaea:







    And that was in a time of the new DC verse, where Wonder Woman, Superman, and almost anyone else started far less powerful than they would become, with the opposite of in DCEU's Justice League as example, a young and inexperienced Diana.
    Last edited by Rightoya; 07-24-2021 at 04:01 AM.

  15. #135
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    And she also couldn't handle a simple poison.

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